TL-TwoWinsAway Posted November 28, 2020 Share Posted November 28, 2020 Thanks for the time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ET80 Posted November 28, 2020 Share Posted November 28, 2020 If he's so good, why is he still unemployed? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TL-TwoWinsAway Posted November 28, 2020 Author Share Posted November 28, 2020 1 minute ago, ET80 said: If he's so good, why is he still unemployed? Who said he was "so good"? He's just not regarded as a horrible head coach. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M.10.E Posted November 28, 2020 Share Posted November 28, 2020 (edited) Guys we’re dealing with bigger issues rn. Edited November 28, 2020 by M.10.E 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ET80 Posted November 28, 2020 Share Posted November 28, 2020 1 minute ago, TL-TwoWinsAway said: Who said he was "so good"? He's just not regarded as a horrible head coach. If he wasn't horrible, then why doesn't he have a job? That better, Mr. Semantics? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TL-TwoWinsAway Posted November 28, 2020 Author Share Posted November 28, 2020 4 minutes ago, ET80 said: If he wasn't horrible, then why doesn't he have a job? That better, Mr. Semantics? Why is it semantics to point out the difference between "horrible" and "so good"? Why are you continuing this nonsense in multiple threads? Why are you so angry? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ET80 Posted November 28, 2020 Share Posted November 28, 2020 11 minutes ago, TL-TwoWinsAway said: Why is it semantics to point out the difference between "horrible" and "so good"? Why are you continuing this nonsense in multiple threads? Why are you so angry? Yes, I'm the one who started this thread. I'm the one going to multiple forums desperately trying to justify a point. You started this thread, then linked it to a GDT in Gen, not me. Seems like you're deflecting your feelings to me - don't worry though, I'm used to it. Sorta the curse of being the big fish in the pond that is FF... It's semantics because it's not really the point of my question. My point was "why doesn't he have a job" but you're focusing on other aspects of the question. Hence, semantics on the what. Why don't you answer the why? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TL-TwoWinsAway Posted November 28, 2020 Author Share Posted November 28, 2020 (edited) 9 minutes ago, ET80 said: Yes, I'm the one who started this thread. I'm the one going to multiple forums desperately trying to justify a point. You started this thread, then linked it to a GDT in Gen, not me. Seems like you're defecting your feelings to me - don't worry though, I'm used to it. Sorta the curse of being the big fish in the pond that is FF... It's semantics because it's not really the point of my question. My point was "why doesn't he have a job" but you're focusing on other aspects of the question. Hence, semantics on the what. Why don't you answer the why? Dude. You "challenged" me to find other posters that felt a certain way. I did that. I'm not the one that posted in here, complaining that my viewpoint wasn't shared by others. Are you suggesting that every single coach that isn't employed must not be a good, or even average, head coach? I'm guessing you think that Bill Cowher is a "horrible" head coach too, right? After all, if he isn't, "WhY dOeSn'T hE hAvE a JoB?!" Edited November 28, 2020 by TL-TwoWinsAway Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TL-TwoWinsAway Posted November 28, 2020 Author Share Posted November 28, 2020 Breaking news: Jon Gruden was a "horrible" head coach from 2009-2017, at which point he was hired by the Raiders and became "so good" again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ET80 Posted November 28, 2020 Share Posted November 28, 2020 2 minutes ago, TL-TwoWinsAway said: Dude. You "challenged" me to find other posters that felt a certain way. I did that. I'm not the one that posted in here, complaining that my viewpoint wasn't shared by others. I just asked a question, nobody is complaining about a thing. Nonetheless, everything I'm saying is accurate: 12 minutes ago, ET80 said: Yes, I'm the one who started this thread. I'm the one going to multiple forums desperately trying to justify a point. You started this thread, then linked it to a GDT in Gen, not me. 3 minutes ago, TL-TwoWinsAway said: Are you suggesting that every single coach that isn't employed must not be a good, or even average, head coach? I'm guessing you think that Bill Cowher is a "horrible" head coach too, right? After all, if he isn't, "WhY dOeSn'T hE hAvE a JoB?!" Cowher was offered the Texans job before Bill O'Brien as well as the Carolina job before Ron Rivera job. He actively turns down offers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ET80 Posted November 28, 2020 Share Posted November 28, 2020 1 minute ago, TL-TwoWinsAway said: Breaking news: Jon Gruden was a "horrible" head coach from 2009-2017, at which point he was hired by the Raiders and became "so good" again. Obtuse, FTW! I'm done with you, BTW. It's seemingly impossible to hold a reasonable conversation with you, as others can attest to. Good luck Ravens fans - I know the Covid situation is really going bad over there, I hope you find a good solution for this. Sorry this argument spilled into your forum, but I can't control the actions of irrational people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heinz D. Posted November 28, 2020 Share Posted November 28, 2020 42 minutes ago, ET80 said: If he's so good, why is he still unemployed? I don't recall Billick actually applying for other head coaching jobs. But, my memory might be off... 13 minutes ago, ET80 said: Obtuse, FTW! I'm done with you, BTW. It's seemingly impossible to hold a reasonable conversation with you, as others can attest to. Good luck Ravens fans - I know the Covid situation is really going bad over there, I hope you find a good solution for this. Sorry this argument spilled into your forum, but I can't control the actions of irrational people. Well, ummm...I've obviously missed something. Or some things. Don't know what's going on here. Ta ta! 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
diamondbull424 Posted November 29, 2020 Share Posted November 29, 2020 (edited) I definitely wouldn’t say Billick is a terrible HC, his motivation tactics were instrumental in moving the Ravens to that first SB win. Billick however is a CEO style HC (similar to Harbaugh) where he didn’t really excel as an offensive genius or defensive genius... only that’s not what he was marketed as. It was made only more frustrating considering our offenses were always embarrassingly pathetic. All in all, I’d say he was probably a HC similar to a Jim Harbaugh, though perhaps not quite as special (though he did win a SB and Jim didn’t), but he’s a guy that could motivate guys and really tell a great story, but his messages were too similar and ultimately overtime became stale; thus once the motivation quality was gone, he was essentially a useless HC. He also wasn’t quite as good in that CEO roles as a John Harbaugh, who has the ability to cultivate a new story and new message for each team he has. It keeps things fresh enough that his teams are rarely ever blown out and rarely ever out of the playoff race. Everything is far more constant and reliable than with Billick’s more spirited personality (which isn’t to say Harbaugh also can’t be fiery). I don’t think anyone would ever confuse Billick for a GOAT, but if a young team needed a coach to help build up the mentality of the squad to condition them into a professional locker room and motivate them to rise above their station, Billick would make for an excellent transition coach. Sort of like the Golden State Warriors with Mark Jackson. He built the foundation for Steph and Klay’s mentality that was vital in them becoming eventual champs. That’s what Billick was, a mentality coach vs the offensive guru he was advertised to be. Edited November 29, 2020 by diamondbull424 Figured I should be more clear about the difference between John and Jim 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DontTazeMeBro Posted November 30, 2020 Share Posted November 30, 2020 I think offensively he gets judged unfairly. You would have to be a miracle worker to succeed with the QBs and WRs we had. And the only time I remember him calling plays was after he fired Fassel and that saved our season. So I guess you could fault him for not calling plays. He was also really good situationally. We had an insane W-L record when leading in the 2nd half. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SalvadorsDeli Posted December 3, 2020 Share Posted December 3, 2020 (edited) Billick was not a horrible coach. He wasn't the X's and O's genius people thought he might be because he happened to be the OC when Randy Moss and Cris Carter destroyed the league in 1998. But he was an outstanding leader of men who comes second only to Ray Lewis in terms of his responsibility for creating the tough/blue collar culture within the Ravens organization that has helped keep us successful for the past 2 decades. And Ray Lewis the leader and personality probably doesn't become the Ray Lewis we came to know under a different head coach - Billick embraced him in a way a lot of coaches wouldn't have, particularly given the off-the-field issues. Not to mention, as bad as he was at building the offense, even as an 'offensive' head coach he deserves credit for the incredible staffing job he did on defense - he didn't miss on DC's, going Marvin Lewis --> Mike Nolan --> Rex Ryan, on top of also having guys like Mike Smith, Vic Fangio, Mike Pettine, Jack Del Rio, and Mike Singletary (who was an amazing fit working with Ray even if he sucked everywhere else) on staff over the years. A big part of being a head coach is making the right staffing choices and he batted near 1.000 on defense. He had an intense and abrasive style that probably makes for a shorter shelf life as a coach so its actually pretty amazing he made it almost a decade with us, but it was clearly time to part ways at the end of 2007. That said, Billick could and probably should have gotten another shot at coaching after that, to answer @ET80's point. I think he was somewhat a victim of circumstance in that at the time he got fired, every team in the league was looking at Mike Tomlin in Pittsburgh (including us) and scouting assistants and coordinators trying to find their own young hotshot head coach - hence why guys like Harbaugh, Jason Garrett, Josh McDaniels, Jim Zorn, and Raheem Morris all got coaching jobs in that period. Those things are cyclical so eventually things did turn back towards seeking older/established voices afterwards. My understanding though is that once teams did start reaching out to Billick he decided he just decided he didn't want to go back to the grind and was more than happy just hanging out on the Eastern Shore on his boat doing some broadcasting and basically coasting into a pretty comfortable retirement. Can't really fault him for that choice, he already had his Super Bowl ring so why not just enjoy life instead? His biggest failure in Baltimore was just never identifying and developing a quarterback. The one time we tried drafting one during his time, it was Kyle Boller who was doomed from the start. There's an alternate universe out there where instead of trading back into the 1st round to take Boller in 03, we wait till 2004 to draft a QB and take Ben Roethlisberger instead - who I absolutely believe the organization and Billick in particular would have fallen in love with. Think I've said this before but Ben would have been the archetypal Ravens and Billick QB - huge, tough, strong armed dude and complete scumbag. If that somehow does happen, even with Billick not being a brilliant offensive mind, Big Ben + Jamal Lewis + our defense would have resulted in at least one championship between 04 and 08 IMO and Billick's career trajectory and legacy ends up completely different. Edited December 3, 2020 by SalvadorsDeli 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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