Is this one of Belichick’s best coaching years?

[Saint_James]

Just now, ET80 said:

I'm sorry... did Jimmy Garropolo turn into a good QB recently?

 

Compared to Cam Newton???  Yeah, I would say so.   The guy went to a Super Bowl last year and they only lost because of utter incompetence by the coaching staff.  "Hey we're up by a huge margin and all we have to do is work the clock in the second half.  Let's come out throwing it non-stop, stopping the clock, and punting back to the Chiefs.  Cool?"

Jimmy G is 28-8 as a starter and he's nothing but a disappointing QB?  I mean the injuries sure, I can see that.  But I don't get how he's not viewed as a legit starting QB with a record like that, an NFC Championship, and a Super Bowl appearance in such a short time.

Just my opinion. 

 

[ET80]

1 hour ago, Saint_James said:

Compared to Cam Newton???  Yeah, I would say so.  

For $134mm extra salary and four additional years? 

No, no. Nope. 

You can walk away from Cam after kicking the tires. You can't with Garropolo, that sort of money requires a 2-4 year commitment - a commitment that's souring to the point to where it's a foregone conclusion that Garropolo is gone next season.

1 hour ago, Saint_James said:

The guy went to a Super Bowl last year and they only lost because of utter incompetence by the coaching staff. 

But they got there due to an excellent defense and a plug n' play run game that was able to get guys like Matt Breida and Raheem Mostert looking like top tier RBs.

Jimmy G was along for the ride - and last I checked, his implosion in the 4Q had a lot to do with the loss. It wasn't JUST coaching incompetence, Garropolo missed some basic throws down the stretch.

1 hour ago, Saint_James said:

Hey we're up by a huge margin and all we have to do is work the clock in the second half.  Let's come out throwing it non-stop, stopping the clock, and punting back to the Chiefs.  Cool?

If he makes the throws - it's a moot point. He didn't make those throws... that's on him just as much as the playcalling.

1 hour ago, Saint_James said:

Jimmy G is 28-8 as a starter and he's nothing but a disappointing QB?

I'm tired of W/L being the barometer of QB worth. Anyone who watches the 49ers can tell you that Jimmy G is not the reason for the 28-8 record, he's along for the ride at most.

1 hour ago, Saint_James said:

But I don't get how he's not viewed as a legit starting QB with a record like that, an NFC Championship, and a Super Bowl appearance in such a short time.

The same Cam Newton you're dumping on once went 15-1, an NFCCG and a SB not too long ago (he's also got an MVP on his mantle, something Garropolo hasn't accomplished). Why is it that Jimmy G is propped up for it, but Cam is torn down despite doing something very similar? It's not injuries, Cam is about on the same plane as Garropolo when it comes to getting hurt. So, what gives? 

[Apparition]

1 hour ago, Saint_James said:

Compared to Cam Newton???  Yeah, I would say so.   The guy went to a Super Bowl last year and they only lost because of utter incompetence by the coaching staff.  "Hey we're up by a huge margin and all we have to do is work the clock in the second half.  Let's come out throwing it non-stop, stopping the clock, and punting back to the Chiefs.  Cool?"

Jimmy G is 28-8 as a starter and he's nothing but a disappointing QB?  I mean the injuries sure, I can see that.  But I don't get how he's not viewed as a legit starting QB with a record like that, an NFC Championship, and a Super Bowl appearance in such a short time.

Just my opinion. 

 

Uh, did you miss the part where JG threw for a grand total of 208 yards on 27 attempts in their previous two playoff games? Or the part where the Chiefs were stacking the box in the 2nd half and daring the Niners to throw? Those things happened for a reason. 

[ET80]

1 hour ago, Saint_James said:

Hey we're up by a huge margin and all we have to do is work the clock in the second half.  Let's come out throwing it non-stop, stopping the clock, and punting back to the Chiefs.  Cool?

Garropolo's #1 WR has split coverage and is open for what should be a go-ahead TD in the 4th Quarter of the Super Bowl with less than two minutes to play. Pretty much anyone who has ever picked up a football and played catch DREAMS of this moment - a momentum shifting bomb to take a lead late in the 4th in the biggest game of the year. (I know I've done play-by-play of me throwing this to Haywood Jeffries in the end zone...)

How was that on the playcalling? The play literally worked exactly how you want this play to work, your best WR got open deep late in a game you're losing. This is a throw Garropolo should be able to make in his sleep.

I get that Cam has his SB blunder, too - but Cam is about $23.5m cheaper than Garropolo.

[Saint_James]

2 minutes ago, ET80 said:

Garropolo's #1 WR has split coverage and is open for what should be a go-ahead TD in the 4th Quarter of the Super Bowl with less than two minutes to play. Pretty much anyone who has ever picked up a football and played catch DREAMS of this moment - a momentum shifting bomb to take a lead in the biggest game of his life.

How was that on the playcalling? The play literally worked exactly how you want this play to work, your best WR got open deep late in a game you're losing. This is a throw Garropolo should be able to make in his sleep.

I get that Cam has his SB blunder, too - but Cam is about $23.5m cheaper than Garropolo.

 

The 49'ers had an unstoppable run game with a huge lead at halftime.  Smart football says you just keep running the ball and doing your thing.   I get he missed that throw, but wow, are you being serious?   This is irrational Jimmy G hate or something, I don't get it. 

You do remember the same idiot who's responsible for the 28-3 choking of a Super Bowl three years earlier when he was OC for the Falcons, did the SAME stupid thing in this game.   RUN THE BALL WITH A HUGE LEAD YOU MORON Kyle Shanahan.

This was playcalling malpractice plain and simple.   You can bring up that throw, fine, but you have to at least give me this.   The ONLY way you lose that game, is to keep putting Patrick Mahomes on the field.  It was just unbelievable to watch them implode like that. 

 

 

[Saint_James]

22 minutes ago, Starless said:

Uh, did you miss the part where JG threw for a grand total of 208 yards on 27 attempts in their previous two playoff games? Or the part where the Chiefs were stacking the box in the 2nd half and daring the Niners to throw? Those things happened for a reason. 

Uh, that is exactly how you play Cam Newton today.  Except he's an even worse passer than what you alleging Jimmy G to be.

So what is your point?

[Apparition]

4 minutes ago, Saint_James said:

Uh, that is exactly how you play Cam Newton today.  Except he's an even worse passer than what you alleging Jimmy G to be.

So what is your point?

A few posts ago, you were saying that the Pats could've been contenders this year if they'd kept Jimmy over Brady. 🤔

[ET80]

11 minutes ago, Saint_James said:

The 49'ers had an unstoppable run game with a huge lead at halftime.  Smart football says you just keep running the ball and doing your thing.   I get he missed that throw, but wow, are you being serious?   This is irrational Jimmy G hate or something, I don't get it

I'm as serious as a heart attack on this.

We're only talking about Garropolo because you're trying to sell him up as some guy who'd be able to walk in and replicate a QB who won SBs for New England and an MVP for himself. I don't hate him (I don't hate anybody, tbh) but I know he's massively overpaid and has an example of not showing up in - quite literally - the biggest moment of his life.

Let me reframe the question: Is Garropolo six times better than Cam? Because that's roughly difference in cost ($23.5mm v $4mm).

In addition, can Garropolo win an MVP in 2017 and a SB in 2018, much like Tom Brady did after Jimmy G was traded?

I have to sincerely wonder if you're being serious with this argument?

11 minutes ago, Saint_James said:

This was playcalling malpractice plain and simple.   You can bring up that throw, fine, but you have to at least give me this.

It's not mutually exclusive. The playcalling AND Garropolo's execution was bad. If the playcalling was better, San Francisco could win. If the execution of the questionable playcalling was better, San Francisco could win.

Neither happened.

[Saint_James]

1 minute ago, Starless said:

A few posts ago, you were saying that the Pats could've been contenders this year if they'd kept Jimmy over Brady. 🤔

 

No, I never said that.  I said they wouldn't be in a rebuilding year.   Please show me where I said all that.

You really don't think the man who took a sixth round nobody and molded him into your "GOAT" could do wonders with Jimmy though? 

 

[Saint_James]

7 minutes ago, ET80 said:

We're only talking about Garropolo because you're trying to sell him up as some guy who'd be able to walk in and replicate a QB who won SBs for New England and an MVP for himself.

 

That's...not true.  I am not selling him as anything and I never said he would replicate anything.   I mean where do you guys see this stuff?   The entire point was that the roadmap Bill Bellicheck had for this team got derailed when Tom Brady decided to play GM for a day.   That's it!!!

And somehow you interpret that as some kind of huge Jimmy G mancrush??  I'm not saying he's some amazing QB but he's a damn sight better, and younger, than Cam Newton at playing QB.  

 

[Soko]

51 minutes ago, ET80 said:

For $134mm extra salary and four additional years? 

No, no. Nope. 

You can walk away from Cam after kicking the tires. You can't with Garropolo, that sort of money requires a 2-4 year commitment - a commitment that's souring to the point to where it's a foregone conclusion that Garropolo is gone next season.

And this is just focusing on this one year for Cam. 

Pats went to 3 SBs in that span with Brady and won two. Knowing what we know about Jimmy’s durability and his play as a QB, you’d be a fool to insinuate that the alleged ultimatum hurt the team. They were a possession away from going three straight, FFS. 

 

[Soko]

2 minutes ago, Saint_James said:

That's...not true.  I am not selling him as anything and I never said he would replicate anything.   I mean where do you guys see this stuff?   The entire point was that the roadmap Bill Bellicheck had for this team got derailed when Tom Brady decided to play GM for a day.   That's it!!!

The roadmap that Bill allegedly was diverted from resulted in 3 SB appearances and two wins...

Seems like things worked out pretty well, all things considered.

[ET80]

48 minutes ago, Saint_James said:

That's...not true.  I am not selling him as anything and I never said he would replicate anything.   I mean where do you guys see this stuff?

 

4 hours ago, Saint_James said:

I'm going to take a crazy hot-take that maybe the guy who was the architect of those 6 Super Bowls knows a thing or two about football.  And knows that when you have a really good QB waiting in the wings, and an aging starting QB, you have a chance to not be stuck rebuilding if you handle that situation. 

There's a lot you're implying here, as well as a lot you're glossing over here. (Given that I'm not the only one who read what you said as such, I'll go ahead and declare that I'm NOT crazy).

Garropolo was traded in 2017 - since then, Brady won an MVP and a SB. So in your scenario, what happens? If Garropolo is still waiting in the wings in 2020, what is the result from 2017 to current? Do they sacrifice a SB and an MVP season in an effort to avoid a rebuild three years later? Do they just Garropolo walk after his contract year? Do they move Brady ahead of Garropolo?

Play this out for me - because we're all coming to the same conclusion based on your initial response. What ARE you trying to say? How does Belicheck "handle this situation" as you stated?

48 minutes ago, Saint_James said:

The entire point was that the roadmap Bill Bellicheck had for this team got derailed when Tom Brady decided to play GM for a day.   That's it!!!

Was it derailed though? They made two SBs, they won one since that trade. What exactly was derailed? 2020? The Pats are 6-6, they still have a chance to make the playoffs. Can they beat KC? Probably not, but who can? And does Garropolo really bring much more than Cam at this moment (let alone on an inflated contract)?

Edit: Also, let's remember that the Pats lost eight players (tops in the league) and four projected starters to Covid-19 opt outs. The "rebuild" is moreso to do with that - not everyone could lose a starting T, a starting S/ST Ace, a starting FB and your Team Captain/ILB and break .500.

48 minutes ago, Saint_James said:

I'm not saying he's some amazing QB but he's a damn sight better, and younger, than Cam Newton at playing QB.

As I asked earlier...

1 hour ago, ET80 said:

Let me reframe the question: Is Garropolo six times better than Cam? Because that's roughly difference in cost ($23.5mm v $4mm).

These checks have to be cut - which is the better situation? Paying Garropolo $23.5mm or paying Cam $4mm?

[40Year Pack Fan]

5 hours ago, Saint_James said:

Tom Brady was the one who ran Jimmy G right out of town.   Not a huge Bellicheck lover but he had an actual plan for the team going forward, and Tom Brady himself was who wrecked it when he ran crying to Kraft.  So when I see people blaming coach for the "talent" on the team.....meh, not so sure about that. 

If Bill had been allowed to move on from Brady years ago, the Patriots would be in a much better position today.  Cam Newton?  Nah, that was not part of the plan lol. 

I said it before and I'll say it again...BB made a deal with the devil, which is one 31 other teams wished they could have....As for rebuilding or down time, this is something not unfamiliar to sport franchises....There are a lot of NFL teams unable to return to former glories...

[childofpudding]

7 hours ago, Saint_James said:

If Bill had been allowed to move on from Brady years ago, the Patriots would be in a much better position today.  Cam Newton?  Nah, that was not part of the plan lol. 

As a Patriots fan, I am glad they didn't move on from Brady at that time. They went to 3 SBs since then and won two of them. You must have to really, really hate Brady to think it was somehow an error to hold onto him and let Jimmy G go elsewhere.