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2021 DRAFT PROSPECTS


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22 minutes ago, Karnage84 said:

Would you want two guys with similar styles/builds to add depth (say, 3T) or add different abilities (1T AND 3T)/body styles? How confident would you be having two rookies starting on the interior?

Both.  I feel like the various 1T/3T types in a 4-3 can be fluid based on the down and distance.  But mainly I want pass rushes whether it be a 1T like Suh or a 3T like Geno Atkins, just give me someone who makes plays and gets to the QB.  I liked what I saw from Penisini as a run defender and think he has room to grow (no pun intended), so I think focusing on pass rushing DTs will help our D the most.  I would be annoyed if we drafted to bigs that were space fillers as we already had that.  

As for starting two rookies, I am not against it.  Penisini started some and I think can be a decent starter/rotational DT but I don't think 2 rookies will be any worse than trying to start Shelton and Williams. 

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23 minutes ago, Sllim Pickens said:

Both.  I feel like the various 1T/3T types in a 4-3 can be fluid based on the down and distance.  But mainly I want pass rushes whether it be a 1T like Suh or a 3T like Geno Atkins, just give me someone who makes plays and gets to the QB.  I liked what I saw from Penisini as a run defender and think he has room to grow (no pun intended), so I think focusing on pass rushing DTs will help our D the most.  I would be annoyed if we drafted to bigs that were space fillers as we already had that.  

As for starting two rookies, I am not against it.  Penisini started some and I think can be a decent starter/rotational DT but I don't think 2 rookies will be any worse than trying to start Shelton and Williams. 

Do you see value in Hand playing inside or is he better suited at a 3-4 end? I'm wondering if we really need to add another guy to play Penisini's role and if we would be good enough if we just added a penetrating 3T and let JP plug up the middle. Assuming they choose to bring back Okwara (since AG seemed to be high on him at the press conference) and there was talk of being able to play Flowers inside. If we can add a penetrating 3T + another edge defender  as starters and upgrade our depth, maybe that's enough to improve this whole group along with a new philosophy. 

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13 minutes ago, Karnage84 said:

Do you see value in Hand playing inside or is he better suited at a 3-4 end? I'm wondering if we really need to add another guy to play Penisini's role and if we would be good enough if we just added a penetrating 3T and let JP plug up the middle. Assuming they choose to bring back Okwara (since AG seemed to be high on him at the press conference) and there was talk of being able to play Flowers inside. If we can add a penetrating 3T + another edge defender  as starters and upgrade our depth, maybe that's enough to improve this whole group along with a new philosophy. 

I think its all about scheme.  We ran both Suh and Fairley as 1T at the same time on opposite sides and they were pass rushers.  I think where they line up is more about the exact scheme that what they are intended to do, albeit most 3T are pass rushers but doesnt mean 1T can't be.  Its all about have the right guys in there.  On passing downs I dont want JP in there at all, give me two guys who have a chance to collapse the pocket.  

As for Hand, I don't trust him enough to be a starter either at DE or DT.  I think he could be an upgrade inside on passing downs, much more than Flowers lining up inside, but I wouldn't not upgrade the position because of him.  

Pretty much my philosophy is to attack and get pressure.  Anyone who adds that ability whether it be a DT, DE,  or LB will improve the whole defense.  

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On 2/12/2021 at 11:43 AM, Karnage84 said:

Hot take:

Ja'Marr Chase is good at football. 

Just watched his highlights from 2019. Makes plays on screens, slants, intermediate, deep throws. Great run after the catch and tackle breaking ability. Has this really nice burst after the catch that can turn a 5 yard catch into a 25 yard TD. Has protypical size at 6'1, 208 lbs. I'm getting Deandre Hopkins vibes from him. 

 

 

On 2/12/2021 at 11:51 AM, Sllim Pickens said:

My focus has been interior D lineman and pass rushers.  I am high on Davyion Nixon and Alim McNeill.  I also like Barrmore but dont think he is worth 7 and likely wont be there in round 2 for us so he could be a target in a trade down scenario.  Jalen Twyman has seemed to fall in mocks given he opted out but likely will move back up with workouts.  I also like Shelvin and Onwuzurike.  I really hope we walk away with at least one of these guys in the first three rounds but wouldn't be mad if we double dip given DT is such a cluster on our team.  

 

i love nixon and marvin. at DT. Marvin was projected top 15 like mid season!!! Alim as well just not as caught up on him if you have any good videos or articles on him. This class is loaded for passrush and LB. maybe not a bunch of top 10 LBs. but soooo many solid guys like werner later. 

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Found this interesting: ran a mock where the three QBs, top two WRs and Parsons were off the board. I went with Patrick Surtain and moved Trufant to FS. That's a pretty crazy secondary: Okudah, Surtain and Oruwariye at CB with Trufant at FS and Walker at SS.

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38 minutes ago, TL-TwoWinsAway said:

Found this interesting: ran a mock where the three QBs, top two WRs and Parsons were off the board. I went with Patrick Surtain and moved Trufant to FS. That's a pretty crazy secondary: Okudah, Surtain and Oruwariye at CB with Trufant at FS and Walker at SS.

It sounds good in theory but Walker struggled last year at SS and has even said his preferred position is FS. He does offer up some flexibility but if a guy is telling you "I am at my best in this role" and they had a history of success, I'd rather lean into that. If we brought in another guy with some positional versatility then I'm cool with both guys splitting time at either safety spot. If we're going to play more defined roles, then I'd rather we bring in someone like John Johnson at SS and let Walker do his thing. 

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15 minutes ago, Karnage84 said:

It sounds good in theory but Walker struggled last year at SS and has even said his preferred position is FS. He does offer up some flexibility but if a guy is telling you "I am at my best in this role" and they had a history of success, I'd rather lean into that. If we brought in another guy with some positional versatility then I'm cool with both guys splitting time at either safety spot. If we're going to play more defined roles, then I'd rather we bring in someone like John Johnson at SS and let Walker do his thing. 

Oh, sure. Walker at FS and you find a SS.

The post was more about pairing Surtain with Okudah and Oruwariye and forming a pretty crazy, young CB group with elite upside. Walker was a side note.

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8 minutes ago, TL-TwoWinsAway said:

Oh, sure. Walker at FS and you find a SS.

The post was more about pairing Surtain with Okudah and Oruwariye and forming a pretty crazy, young CB group with elite upside. Walker was a side note.

I'm not opposed to adding in another young CB. We need either Okudah or Oruwariye to develop into a starting outside guy (hopefully both). We also need to have someone in as a starting SCB. I'd rather not use the #3 overall pick in the slot but if we're playing the bulk of our defensive snaps with a slot guy instead of a LB (whether it's a 3rd CB, a 3rd safety, etc.) then who cares. Put the best guys on the field. 

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5 hours ago, TL-TwoWinsAway said:

Oh, sure. Walker at FS and you find a SS.

The post was more about pairing Surtain with Okudah and Oruwariye and forming a pretty crazy, young CB group with elite upside. Walker was a side note.

I did a mock adding Caleb Farley to Okudah/Oruwariye and everyone was dead set against it. I'm not. I think we need players at EVERY position on defense and want the best talent available.

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15 minutes ago, Louis Friend said:

I did a mock adding Caleb Farley to Okudah/Oruwariye and everyone was dead set against it. I'm not. I think we need players at EVERY position on defense and want the best talent available.

This right here. We're way too talent-starved, especially on defense, to not take the best player available.

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2 hours ago, TL-TwoWinsAway said:

This right here. We're way too talent-starved, especially on defense, to not take the best player available.

I think I'd just trade down. Considering the coaching talent you have in the defensive backfield, I don't think I'd spend another top pick on a CB. Pleasant and Glenn ought to be able to get the best out of guys drafted later (I've seen Pleasant do that with multiple players).

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9 minutes ago, jrry32 said:

I think I'd just trade down. Considering the coaching talent you have in the defensive backfield, I don't think I'd spend another top pick on a CB. Pleasant and Glenn ought to be able to get the best out of guys drafted later (I've seen Pleasant do that with multiple players).

Wouldn't an elite player be made even better with great coaching talent?

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4 minutes ago, TL-TwoWinsAway said:

Wouldn't an elite player be made even better with great coaching talent?

Sure. But I think Okudah already has the ability to be an elite player. So if you can get a top talent at another position, why wouldn't you? I would trust Pleasant and Glenn to get the most out of guys you draft later. I won't say that you can't rely on other coaches to do the same, only that you run into the issue of diminishing returns. 

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