Joe Barry'd again

[incognito_man]

20 minutes ago, Packerraymond said:

Last 3 games:

31st in 3rd downs allowed per game, 30th in conversion %, 28th in 1st downs allowed per game, T26th red zone trips allowed, 24th in plays against (with an offense 6th in 3rd down conversion percentage, woof), 32nd in the NFL in punts per play, DEAD LAST. 

This defense either takes the ball away or gives up points in the last 3 weeks. Dangerously fine line between implosion and where they stand right now. They're keeping an efficient offense that's operating at a top 5 level in the league, on the sidelines.

"DVOA accounts for that."

I'm sure there's an intellectually honest reason you included "red zone trips allowed" and not "red zone TDs given up" 

Laugh. my. Fuggin. ***. Off

😂😂

[beekay414]

1 minute ago, incognito_man said:

DVOA accounts for points per drive

Can you explain why the improvement in DVOA doesn't matter for this defense?

Because DVOA takes into account how every defense performs? We climbed up the rankings while other defenses performed more poorly is my guess. Can you show me week to week data?

[incognito_man]

The truly hilarious thing is not ONCE have I defended Joe Barry. 

I've been too busy dealing with intellectually dishonest arguments.

[coachbuns]

10 minutes ago, Brit Pack said:

You just keep on jumping. First it is ypc, then its attempts, then it yards per game, then it's rush TDs, rush TDs over a season . Each one no correlation to success. We are just clutching at meaningless stats after meaningless stat. Trying to show significance in these stats but failing each time. You have thrown out the stats but not show the effect they have. Just give it up bro.

They are also nice to have stats, great talking points maybe but points allowed supersedes all of these. What's the point in being like Carolina statistically better in yards, at number 6 but 29th in points given up.

If we are talking about yesterday, Spags with his better rated defence went against our novice offence and couldn't do what Barry did against a far more mature and statistically better offence with a beast of a RB, the GOAT of TEs, the QB GOAT. Everything you are upset with Barry with Spags did but worse. Long drives, converting 3rd downs, that 4th and 2nd to Doubs and he allowed an inferior team to do that to him. 

Maybe .. just maybe that's because the Packers offense was just that good.  That defense was rated in the top 5 in most categories all year long.  Spags tried like crazy to fluster and get to the offense and it didn't work.  As Packray stated, the offense is carrying the defense with an awfully fine line.  

[mikebpackfan]

3 minutes ago, incognito_man said:

The truly hilarious thing is not ONCE have I defended Joe Barry. 

I've been too busy dealing with intellectually dishonest arguments.

Maybe.  But saying “DVOA accounts for that” over and over is also intellectually dishonest.

Even if it accounts for something, it doesn’t mean it properly accounts for something.  It can be better than just throwing out a stat or two, but also could be worse.

[incognito_man]

10 minutes ago, beekay414 said:

Because DVOA takes into account how every defense performs? We climbed up the rankings while other defenses performed more poorly is my guess. Can you show me week to week data?

GB ranked 28th after week 8 with a 10.1% defensive DVOA. 

Currently ranked 18th with a 2.5% DVOA. This week, Carolina has a 10.1% defense DVOA and ranks 29th. So the movement has been almost exclusively upwards for GB and not downward for other teams.

Edited December 5, 2023 by incognito_man

[incognito_man]

3 minutes ago, mikebpackfan said:

Maybe.  But saying “DVOA accounts for that” over and over is also intellectually dishonest.

Even if it accounts for something, it doesn’t mean it properly accounts for something.  It can be better than just throwing out a stat or two, but also could be worse.

In what world is accounting for more data intellectually dishonest?

Follow-up: do you know how DVOA actually works? I'm suspicious maybe not, because if you did, I don't think you'd hold the opinion that continuing to point out the simple truth that DVOA accounts for it is in any way shape or form intellectually dishonest.

Edited December 5, 2023 by incognito_man

[beekay414]

5 minutes ago, incognito_man said:

GB ranked 28th after week 8 with a 10.1% defensive DVOA. 

Currently ranked 18th with a 2.5% DVOA. This week, Carolina has a 10.1% defense DVOA and ranks 29th. So the movement has been almost exclusively upwards for GB and not downward for other teams.

My guess is the quality of opponent part of the score went up then and it'll drop in the coming weeks if we keep up the same type of defensive performance.

EDIT - You also said it doesn't take the back-up QB into account so the Rams game probably weighs significantly heavily on that score with them being a top 10 DVOA offense.

Edited December 5, 2023 by beekay414

[Norm]

DVDA

[incognito_man]

4 minutes ago, beekay414 said:

My guess is the quality of opponent part of the score went up then and it'll drop in the coming weeks if we keep up the same type of defensive performance.

EDIT - You also said it doesn't take the back-up QB into account so the Rams game probably weighs significantly heavily on that score with them being a top 10 DVOA offense.

Back-up situations apply to EVERY team, though. We aren't special in the eyes of DVOA.

[Brit Pack]

9 minutes ago, beekay414 said:

You didn't answer the question and the stats I continue to bring up tie directly into what I just asked you. I didn't ask about how our offense performed vs Spags. I asked about how your boy did. You're really ******* good at deflecting, I'll give you that.

I'm sorry that you can't understand how stats work for an individual team without the need to bring outside teams into the argument (though I've continued to tell you that what *insert any team here* does has no bearing on how Joe Barry performs but you can't get that through your English head). And to think, I'm concerned about the current state of the American education system lmao.

Firstly, the thickness of mu head and the British education system itself really should have no bearing on this debate and I see no need to bring it up. 

Next my boy, Barry Bomaye, gave up 19 points to the GOATS, and he got the win and he don't give a **** about how many points per drive or ypc (which is apparently very important), or 3rd down conversions cos they don't really matter if you can't stop a team from scoring points.

It's all well and good stating stats but you haven't indicated how they predict future success of a team as I can't find any correlation at the moment. Or how those stats led to the outcome of holding the Chiefs to 19 points.

[beekay414]

1 minute ago, incognito_man said:

Back-up situations apply to EVERY team, though. We aren't special in the eyes of DVOA.

I'm explaining why our ranking rose from week 8 on. I don't care about every other team. And every other team didn't play a top 10 DVOA offense with their PS QB either so miss me with that bull****.

[beekay414]

3 minutes ago, Brit Pack said:

Firstly, the thickness of mu head and the British education system itself really should have no bearing on this debate and I see no need to bring it up. 

Next my boy, Barry Bomaye, gave up 19 points to the GOATS, and he got the win and he don't give a **** about how many points per drive or ypc (which is apparently very important), or 3rd down conversions cos they don't really matter if you can't stop a team from scoring points.

It's all well and good stating stats but you haven't indicated how they predict future success of a team as I can't find any correlation at the moment. Or how those stats led to the outcome of holding the Chiefs to 19 points.

Bout what I thought. Thanks for confirming. Enjoy the list because there's no point of you not being on it.

[Brit Pack]

4 minutes ago, beekay414 said:

Bout what I thought. Thanks for confirming. Enjoy the list because there's no point of you not being on it.

Well that was an anti-climax?

[mikebpackfan]

18 minutes ago, incognito_man said:

In what world is accounting for more data intellectually dishonest?

Follow-up: do you know how DVOA actually works? I'm suspicious maybe not, because if you did, I don't think you'd hold the opinion that continuing to point out the simple truth that DVOA accounts for it is in any way shape or form intellectually dishonest.

Of course I have no clue.  I’d rather spend my time rewatching the game than digging into the details of how DVOA is created.  Here’s what I know:  it’s some rating system that (according to you as my only source) takes a ****load of data in and spits out a ranking of a team based on that.  In order to do so, some formula must be applied.  That formula seems unlikely to be infalliable. Especially since it would have incorrectly predicted the Packer game the last three weeks.