Week 7: Browns @ Colts. A Game Day Thread

[NateDawg]

Obviously I grant that I’m not a mind reader and that people in Cleveland have publicly said the right things, when they have had anything to say at all about our creepo Quarterback. There was a clear perception coming out of Houston that he quit on the team, and that was before all the creep allegations. Obviously, every fanbase is going to have their own narrative, but there is a track record and perception here. I placed more stock in that than the public comments being made by current teammates. He hasn’t demonstrated anything to this point that would refute a reputation. Again, I don’t really care about the ownership and circumstances, I don’t think that owner being terrible justified anything. You seem to be someone that takes some time to pass judgment, that can be a good thing, but the clues are there on this one. 

[LETSGOBROWNIES]

3 minutes ago, NateDawg said:

Obviously I grant that I’m not a mind reader and that people in Cleveland have publicly said the right things, when they have had anything to say at all about our creepo Quarterback. There was a clear perception coming out of Houston that he quit on the team, and that was before all the creep allegations. Obviously, every fanbase is going to have their own narrative, but there is a track record and perception here. I placed more stock in that than the public comments being made by current teammates. He hasn’t demonstrated anything to this point that would refute a reputation. Again, I don’t really care about the ownership and circumstances, I don’t think that owner being terrible justified anything. You seem to be someone that takes some time to pass judgment, that can be a good thing, but the clues are there on this one. 

There’s definitely concerning history, I’m not arguing that.  
 

I think some folks are quick to jump on things here.  
 

“hes been here a year and a half” is a bad faith argument.  Those first 11 games last season were out of his control (other than not being a rapist of course). He looked bad last year though, no doubt. 
 

This year has been 3 games and 5 passes.  
 

Week 1 he was *** but so was Burrow in a wet, sloppy game.

Week 2 was a disaster.

Week 3 was a p damned good game.

Yesterday was bad, but stuff like this does give validity to the idea he simply isn’t right physically. 
 

 I don’t know if I’m slow to pass judgment or not, my point is just there’s no need to pass any judgement on big picture stuff after 3 games this season.  In another couple months, end of the season, etc, I think things will be a lot clearer, good or bad.

[MWil23]

9 hours ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said:

There’s definitely concerning history, I’m not arguing that.  
 

I think some folks are quick to jump on things here.  
 

“hes been here a year and a half” is a bad faith argument.  Those first 11 games last season were out of his control (other than not being a rapist of course). He looked bad last year though, no doubt. 
 

This year has been 3 games and 5 passes.  
 

Week 1 he was *** but so was Burrow in a wet, sloppy game.

Week 2 was a disaster.

Week 3 was a p damned good game.

Yesterday was bad, but stuff like this does give validity to the idea he simply isn’t right physically. 
 

 I don’t know if I’m slow to pass judgment or not, my point is just there’s no need to pass any judgement on big picture stuff after 3 games this season.  In another couple months, end of the season, etc, I think things will be a lot clearer, good or bad.

https://www.pass2win.com/ball-velocity-exposing-the-power-qb.html
 

Watson was a 45-49, the lowest since 2008. He’s always won with athleticism and anticipation. On that throw he was very late and the ball hung up on him, and that’s in a dome. Just wait til November and beyond on the lake.

[LETSGOBROWNIES]

28 minutes ago, MWil23 said:

https://www.pass2win.com/ball-velocity-exposing-the-power-qb.html
 

Watson was a 45-49, the lowest since 2008. He’s always won with athleticism and anticipation. On that throw he was very late and the ball hung up on him, and that’s in a dome. Just wait til November and beyond on the lake.

I’m well aware of this and was when you were gushing about him pre-draft lol.  I’m glad to finally be proven correct 😝 

I’m not saying he throws lasers, but watching that ball hang and how that pick happened would explain why KS decided to pull him right away after being cleared.  That’s very likely one of those things as soon as you see his passes floating like that you realize he other team does too and that you’re not gonna be able to hide that injury.

As much as he won with anticipation and athleticism he also won with his big play ability.  He’s won down the field a metric sht ton since he came into the league regardless of MPH. I think that’s a throw most folks expect Watson to make.  If he can’t throw deep and drive the ball, which for the record is exactly what the team has said the issue has been for weeks, it’s gonna be hard to play. 

[LETSGOBROWNIES]

And I realize some folks are simply going to refuse to acknowledge this because, well, people will, but everything we’ve heard thus far about the injury, recovery time from the ortho surgeon, how it’s impacting his play/ability, etc all tracks.

I’m not going to say he’s 100% bought in and ready to do whatever it takes, etc. because I simply don’t know, but I do think it’s entirely possible that all of the things we’re hearing that also coincidentally happen to match what we’re seeing could indicate he is in fact just injured and not some giant conspiracy or heist of cash.

[mtmmike]

19 hours ago, NateDawg said:

Obviously I grant that I’m not a mind reader and that people in Cleveland have publicly said the right things, when they have had anything to say at all about our creepo Quarterback. There was a clear perception coming out of Houston that he quit on the team, and that was before all the creep allegations. Obviously, every fanbase is going to have their own narrative, but there is a track record and perception here. I placed more stock in that than the public comments being made by current teammates. He hasn’t demonstrated anything to this point that would refute a reputation. Again, I don’t really care about the ownership and circumstances, I don’t think that owner being terrible justified anything. You seem to be someone that takes some time to pass judgment, that can be a good thing, but the clues are there on this one. 

Your absolutely right the fact he has alienated 2 fan  bases in 4 years is undeniable. 

The fact he has a lower qb rating then the player we gave away is undeniable. 

Still think of the 13 games he has been active we have been in last place.

The most pressing point if Mayfield played that bad here he would have been run out of town.

[NateDawg]

1 hour ago, mtmmike said:

Your absolutely right the fact he has alienated 2 fan  bases in 4 years is undeniable. 

The fact he has a lower qb rating then the player we gave away is undeniable. 

Still think of the 13 games he has been active we have been in last place.

The most pressing point if Mayfield played that bad here he would have been run out of town.

excelent post

how are you mike?

[mtmmike]

56 minutes ago, NateDawg said:

excelent post

how are you mike?

Excellent 

Glad to see the real browns exhibiting freakish behavior 

That wr stinks

Running stinks 

And we have 35 free agents Berry what a genius having record setting carryover money then giving players a outright freedom walk. 

[Thomas5737]

17 hours ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said:

I’m well aware of this and was when you were gushing about him pre-draft lol.  I’m glad to finally be proven correct 😝 

I’m not saying he throws lasers, but watching that ball hang and how that pick happened would explain why KS decided to pull him right away after being cleared.  That’s very likely one of those things as soon as you see his passes floating like that you realize he other team does too and that you’re not gonna be able to hide that injury.

As much as he won with anticipation and athleticism he also won with his big play ability.  He’s won down the field a metric sht ton since he came into the league regardless of MPH. I think that’s a throw most folks expect Watson to make.  If he can’t throw deep and drive the ball, which for the record is exactly what the team has said the issue has been for weeks, it’s gonna be hard to play. 

You don't have to have a cannon to throw downfield. You'll need something, for guys like Watson and Lamar often times you extend plays.

Watson said he had a microtear in the muscle of his shoulder. If you lift a weight or throw a football that will happen.

Maybe he misspoke. Maybe it was the tendon, which is what seems to be what the medical experts are assuming it is with recovery time. I'm not a doctor or anything close nor am I trying to give that impression. However, most people know how you grow muscles. If it was a microtear in a muscle it sounds better than saying we found nothing but it's actually nothing.

I'm sure the bruised shoulder hurt and while he couldn't damage it more there would be pain management for a week or two. It could be that he didn't have a high enough pain tolerance to play through it. It isn't the only possibility though. It seemed odd that he was cleared and didn't at least try to give it a go. But hey, we're all different and we're all driven by different things. If there is an issue with him that could come back and haunt us (besides the obvious) that is a reflection of who made the trade. There was information out there beyond what you could get out of him. We may have chosen to ignore it at the possible upside.

[LETSGOBROWNIES]

6 hours ago, Thomas5737 said:

You don't have to have a cannon to throw downfield. You'll need something, for guys like Watson and Lamar often times you extend plays.

Watson said he had a microtear in the muscle of his shoulder. If you lift a weight or throw a football that will happen.

Maybe he misspoke. Maybe it was the tendon, which is what seems to be what the medical experts are assuming it is with recovery time. I'm not a doctor or anything close nor am I trying to give that impression. However, most people know how you grow muscles. If it was a microtear in a muscle it sounds better than saying we found nothing but it's actually nothing.

I'm sure the bruised shoulder hurt and while he couldn't damage it more there would be pain management for a week or two. It could be that he didn't have a high enough pain tolerance to play through it. It isn't the only possibility though. It seemed odd that he was cleared and didn't at least try to give it a go. But hey, we're all different and we're all driven by different things. If there is an issue with him that could come back and haunt us (besides the obvious) that is a reflection of who made the trade. There was information out there beyond what you could get out of him. We may have chosen to ignore it at the possible upside.

another ortho that MKC spoke with stated the injury has a 2-6 week recovery period, so a similar timeframe.  Nasty man is still in that timeframe.

 

[Thomas5737]

8 hours ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said:

another ortho that MKC spoke with stated the injury has a 2-6 week recovery period, so a similar timeframe.  Nasty man is still in that timeframe.

 

They should just IR him then.

His MRI showed nothing new after last week's game. So he is medically cleared and if he doesn't feel he should play give him 4 weeks of me watching the Browns. I mean rest.

Of course if he is off 4 weeks it will take 14 regular season games to shake off the rust.

[LETSGOBROWNIES]

2 minutes ago, Thomas5737 said:

They should just IR him then.

His MRI showed nothing new after last week's game. So he is medically cleared and if he doesn't feel he should play give him 4 weeks of me watching the Browns. I mean rest.

Of course if he is off 4 weeks it will take 14 regular season games to shake off the rust.

They should have IR’d him initially, that’s indisputable in hindsight.

Medically cleared doesn’t mean capable of playing.  Everyone with a soft tissue injury is medically cleared.  
 

I personally think this is a situation where one particular group of people who despise him for very valid reasons are seeing what they want to see and not what they’re being told by the player, the coach, the orthopedic surgeons who are providing info, etc.

The team didn’t handle this particularly well either, although part of that was Watson telling them he planned on playing vs the Ravens. There’s been mixed messages, “day to day”, etc and had they just IR’d him for 4 weeks a lot of the rumblings wouldn’t exist.

[Thomas5737]

31 minutes ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said:

They should have IR’d him initially, that’s indisputable in hindsight.

Medically cleared doesn’t mean capable of playing.  Everyone with a soft tissue injury is medically cleared.  
 

I personally think this is a situation where one particular group of people who despise him for very valid reasons are seeing what they want to see and not what they’re being told by the player, the coach, the orthopedic surgeons who are providing info, etc.

The team didn’t handle this particularly well either, although part of that was Watson telling them he planned on playing vs the Ravens. There’s been mixed messages, “day to day”, etc and had they just IR’d him for 4 weeks a lot of the rumblings wouldn’t exist.

Maybe.

Are you able to place a player on IR that is medically cleared to play?

You know, to keep teams from putting healthy players on IR because they need to sign a player for a couple weeks for whatever reason.

Honestly only Watson knows how he feels. So you either trust him or you don't.

[candyman93]

4 minutes ago, Thomas5737 said:

Are you able to place a player on IR that is medically cleared to play?

No, but teams can just make something up like “soreness.”

[Bonanza23]

7 minutes ago, Thomas5737 said:

Maybe.

Are you able to place a player on IR that is medically cleared to play?

You know, to keep teams from putting healthy players on IR because they need to sign a player for a couple weeks for whatever reason.

Honestly only Watson knows how he feels. So you either trust him or you don't.

Why is everyone so hung up on “medically cleared”?  You guys should know it means absolutely nothing. Tua at one point was medically cleared.