beardown3231 Posted January 15 Share Posted January 15 (edited) 2 minutes ago, Madmike90 said: That's the issue though...that is not an answer... Teams around the league have to be asking that question...can find highlight videos of all these guys that show they can all make crazy throws and win in that scheme...but what makes Caleb different? What makes him better than say Kyler who has the same sort of ability to escape the pocket (maybe a little faster) has as strong an arm...put up better numbers in that scheme...what separates Caleb? I guess I am looking for something to blow me off my position that two maybe even three impact players this year along with Fields is better than Caleb and one impact player. You can keep waiting then. Watch a game. As you say stats don't tell the story. If they did you'd lose the boner for Fields. I don't know what to tell you Edited January 15 by beardown3231 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madmike90 Posted January 15 Share Posted January 15 2 minutes ago, beardown3231 said: You can keep waiting then. Watch a game. As you say stats don't tell the story. If they did you'd lose the boner for Fields. I don't know what to tell you Intelligent input as usual man 😏 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beardown3231 Posted January 15 Share Posted January 15 26 minutes ago, Madmike90 said: Intelligent input as usual man 😏 You keep talking about how Mayfield was statistically better than Williams was in college and that will scare teams, yet statistically, Fields is awful. On top of that he was another good OSU QB, a school that never produces good QB's You can't have it both ways Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madmike90 Posted January 15 Share Posted January 15 1 minute ago, beardown3231 said: You keep talking about how Mayfield was statistically better than Williams was in college and that will scare teams, yet statistically, Fields is awful. On top of that he was another good OSU QB, a school that never produces good QB's You can't have it both ways Your the only one involving Fields in the discussing...even though there is nothing to compare him to Caleb in college... Mayfield & Murray both played in the same scheme for the same HC play caller and both put up better numbers...both have the highlight reels showing they made exceptional throws as well...all three won the Heisman...Caleb is going #1 overall to us or someone else...Mayfield & Murray also went #1 overall...there are clear comparisons to be drawn and all I am asking is what makes Caleb so much better than those guys? They all looked great in college...it's not a slight against Caleb but it has to be a discussion point and like I said I am looking for something to swing me the other way on the argument...just saying "don't be that guy" isn't an answer...just saying "watch a game"...as if I haven't watched a ton of Caleb...isn't an answer... Tangibly what are the traits that take Caleb to being more in the pros than either Mayfield or Murray? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beardown3231 Posted January 15 Share Posted January 15 (edited) 13 minutes ago, Madmike90 said: Your the only one involving Fields in the discussing...even though there is nothing to compare him to Caleb in college... Mayfield & Murray both played in the same scheme for the same HC play caller and both put up better numbers...both have the highlight reels showing they made exceptional throws as well...all three won the Heisman...Caleb is going #1 overall to us or someone else...Mayfield & Murray also went #1 overall...there are clear comparisons to be drawn and all I am asking is what makes Caleb so much better than those guys? They all looked great in college...it's not a slight against Caleb but it has to be a discussion point and like I said I am looking for something to swing me the other way on the argument...just saying "don't be that guy" isn't an answer...just saying "watch a game"...as if I haven't watched a ton of Caleb...isn't an answer... Tangibly what are the traits that take Caleb to being more in the pros than either Mayfield or Murray? Watch a game wasn't a slight. Go back and watch an OU game when either played there and now watch Williams. If you still can't find tangible evidence, I'm not sure what to tell you. Williams is bigger and stronger than either guy. Williams played with worse players. All were accurate college QB's. All were highly regarded. All came with accolades. Williams is the better prospect of all 3. That's my opinion, just like yours is that Fields needs a Pro Bowl roster around him. Edited January 15 by beardown3231 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madmike90 Posted January 15 Share Posted January 15 2 minutes ago, beardown3231 said: Watch a game wasn't a slight. Go back and watch an OU game when either played there and now watch Williams. If you still can't find tangible evidence, I'm not sure what to tell you. Williams is bigger and stronger than either guy. All were accurate college QB's. All were highly regarded. All came with accolades. Williams is the better prospect of all 3. That's my opinion, just like yours is that Fields needs a Pro Bowl roster around him. That's what your going with? Okay Again bringing it back to Fields...you have to understand the reason I never compare the two is because it is not apples to apples...it's Fields plus more talent added vs. Caleb and less talent added...that is the part of the equation you seem to be missing...as a passer Williams is more advance than Fields was coming out of college...I have never said other wise and I don't think anyone would...but again the fact that guys who you think are worse prospects put up better numbers has to be questions...silly not too when your trying to make a franchise altering decision. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beardown3231 Posted January 15 Share Posted January 15 (edited) 16 minutes ago, Madmike90 said: That's what your going with? Okay Again bringing it back to Fields...you have to understand the reason I never compare the two is because it is not apples to apples...it's Fields plus more talent added vs. Caleb and less talent added...that is the part of the equation you seem to be missing...as a passer Williams is more advance than Fields was coming out of college...I have never said other wise and I don't think anyone would...but again the fact that guys who you think are worse prospects put up better numbers has to be questions...silly not too when your trying to make a franchise altering decision. Again what exactly are you looking for? All were accurate. All had Heismans. All were awesome all around. All had strong arms. All were coached by Riley. Are you looking for me to call the Sports Science guy and get the velocity numbers? Their scouting reports were/are similar, except again Williams is much more stout, more athletic than either (don't confuse fast, Murray has him beat there), and the improvisational skills are much better than the other two Why is it Fields and more talent vs Williams and less? If they trade down from 1.9 and get a 3rd and a 4th + trade Fields for a 2nd and 4th, they just added a ton more picks. They have a ton of cap space too. That's not an excuse Edited January 15 by beardown3231 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madmike90 Posted January 15 Share Posted January 15 1 minute ago, beardown3231 said: Again what exactly are you looking for? All were accurate. All had Heismans. All were awesome all around. All had strong arms. All were coached by Riley. Are you looking for me to call the Sports Science guy and get the velocity numbers? Their scouting reports were/are similar Why is it Fields and more talent vs Williams and less? If they trade down from 1.9 and get a 3rd and a 4th + trade Fields for a 2nd and 4th, they just added a ton more picks. They have a ton of cap space too. That's not an excuse So are you saying that a Mayfield or Murray level upgrade on Fields would be worth it if Caleb is the same as those guys? And if we trade down from #9 we miss out on the top WRs...not only that a 3rd is very different from a 2nd...and on top of that the draft haul from trading out of #1 is monumentally different to both those scenarios. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Epyon Posted January 15 Author Share Posted January 15 54 minutes ago, Madmike90 said: it's Fields plus more talent added vs. Caleb and less talent added. This isn't true at all..... -It's Fields, when you already have 3 years of evidence that he's a bust, are going to have to pay him very soon (which will COST you players that are actually good) -The pending catastrophe WHEN he doesn't turn into a good-great quarterback, you're stuck with him until his contract has an out and going to need another 2022 type teardown and rebuild, coupled with the fact that nearly every superbowl matchup in the past 2 decades has at least 1 if not 2 elite QBS in it (or QBs at least producing at that level in spurts like Eli or Foles).... -That stacking a roster only works in the short term..... Having an elite QB makes you a perennial contender -The high end backup QB you need to carry the franchise when Fields is invariably hurt for 4+ games a year Meanwhile Caleb -Is considered the best of the Lincoln Riley QBs.... literally all of whom are better than Fields. -Has elite potential without 3 years of evidence he can't hack it in the NFL like Fields -Resets your QB contract letting you get better FA's vets NOW.... -Doesn't financially cripple your franchise if he busts. -Might actually let us run an offense that isn't a joke. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beardown3231 Posted January 15 Share Posted January 15 9 hours ago, Madmike90 said: So are you saying that a Mayfield or Murray level upgrade on Fields would be worth it if Caleb is the same as those guys? And if we trade down from #9 we miss out on the top WRs...not only that a 3rd is very different from a 2nd...and on top of that the draft haul from trading out of #1 is monumentally different to both those scenarios. Dude don't be obtuse. Just because the scouting reports are similar doesn't mean they'll have an equivalent pro career Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G08 Posted January 15 Share Posted January 15 11 hours ago, beardown3231 said: If you still can't find tangible evidence, I'm not sure what to tell you. Williams is bigger and stronger than either guy. Williams played with worse players. All were accurate college QB's. All were highly regarded. All came with accolades. Williams is the better prospect of all 3. That's some hard-hitting analysis, man. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G08 Posted January 15 Share Posted January 15 10 hours ago, beardown3231 said: Why is it Fields and more talent vs Williams and less? If they trade down from 1.9 and get a 3rd and a 4th + trade Fields for a 2nd and 4th, they just added a ton more picks. They have a ton of cap space too. That's not an excuse I... wow. 😂 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G08 Posted January 15 Share Posted January 15 10 hours ago, Madmike90 said: ot only that a 3rd is very different from a 2nd...and on top of that the draft haul from trading out of #1 is monumentally different to both those scenarios. The fact you had to explain this is where I realized the conversation was going nowhere. Impressed with your patience, Mike! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beardown3231 Posted January 15 Share Posted January 15 (edited) 54 minutes ago, G08 said: I... wow. 😂 How did getting a ton of picks and cap space help Fields this year? He was atrocious. Now he needs it again? He has 2 good weapons and he stinks still People think getting four 1's and three 2's is the only way to build a team. I guess if you have a handicap at QB it might be. Trust me, Williams isn't going to need two #1's and three AP's on the OL at his ceiling to have better than an 88 QB rating 56 minutes ago, G08 said: That's some hard-hitting analysis, man. Once again, there is no real answer here. Scouting reports in terms of strengths and weaknesses are similar. I bet there has never been QB's who had similar strengths and weaknesses coming out of college that ended up having different pro careers. It's now at the stage for Fields fanboys where they're talking about guys who played under the same college coach 4 years ago because they're upset their favorite is worse than prime Marcus Mariota Edited January 15 by beardown3231 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StLunatic88 Posted January 15 Share Posted January 15 (edited) 4 minutes ago, beardown3231 said: People think getting four 1's and three 2's is the only way to build a team. I guess if you have a handicap at QB it might be. Trust me, Williams isn't going to need two #1's and three AP's on the OL at his ceiling to have better than an 88 QB rating Source: "Trust Me Bro" Edited January 15 by StLunatic88 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.thumb.jpg.26e29e9988ae4603c2210794a45393c6.jpg)
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.