Forge Posted January 22 Share Posted January 22 On 1/20/2024 at 7:07 PM, Danger said: Ask me again in 5 or so years. This is probably the right call....I should leave that open as well. Lamar could easily climb that hill 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NeptunePenguins Posted January 22 Share Posted January 22 This is an odd comparison atm. A HOF QB that was about as efficient as you could be as a QB at his peak is gonna be hard for any player that has only been starting a handful of seasons so far. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nightime Posted January 28 Share Posted January 28 On 1/21/2024 at 10:51 PM, AngusMcFife said: Really? Let's take the 1988 season: Comp: 53% TD/INT: 3/3 Rating: 72 Do you consider this a "great" year? This is Young playing on a dominant, Super Bowl winning team no less. From 1987-1990, Steve Young had 23 touchdowns and 6 interceptions, with a passer rating of 102.1 on 324 attempts 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tank4Drake Posted January 28 Share Posted January 28 On 1/22/2024 at 11:24 AM, MaddHatter said: Currently it's Young - prime v prime - but Lamar's "prime" may yet still be to come Still, Lamars body would have been destroyed in that era. What Young did in that era is nuts. His stats can literally directly compete with this era. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Ramster Posted January 29 Share Posted January 29 The guy who plays well in the playoffs 2-5? Is crazy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AngusMcFife Posted January 29 Share Posted January 29 5 hours ago, Nightime said: From 1987-1990, Steve Young had 23 touchdowns and 6 interceptions, with a passer rating of 102.1 on 324 attempts 1987 was the wonky strike year and Young put up 10/0 TD/INT late in the year. Impressive, but I take those stats with a grain of salt. Even Young's first year as starter in 1991 he was 5-5 while Bono was 5-1. Obviously from 1992 onward Young was elite as a QB can be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seminoles1 Posted January 29 Share Posted January 29 16 hours ago, El Ramster said: The guy who plays well in the playoffs 2-5? Is crazy. Young had a really bad playoff reputation as well. He had an all-time postseason in 1994, but was pretty subpar besides that. Young is not known as someone who played well in the playoffs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AngusMcFife Posted February 1 Share Posted February 1 Young was terrible on a terrible team. Then he was great on a legendary dynasty with the greatest WR of all time and learned from the greatest offensive coach of a generation while paired a top 5 defense. It would have been nice to have some middle ground, that's about an extreme a contrast a player can have. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MWil23 Posted February 6 Share Posted February 6 Young was infinitely better as a passer and it’s not close. Young for me is Top 5 all time, so probably not even a fair comparison. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AngusMcFife Posted February 6 Share Posted February 6 2 hours ago, MWil23 said: Young was infinitely better as a passer and it’s not close. Young for me is Top 5 all time, so probably not even a fair comparison. And yet Lamar somehow has a higher completion%, TD%, lower INT%, higher passer rating, and lower sack% than Young for his career. While Young played in a tougher era for passing, Lamar adds way more value as a rusher. Young had the benefit of playing on an all time great offense (including coaches) throwing to the greatest WR of all time, and Lamar has played under Greg Roman throwing to DeMarcus Robinson as his no. 1. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HerbertGOAT Posted February 7 Share Posted February 7 6 hours ago, AngusMcFife said: And yet Lamar somehow has a higher completion%, TD%, lower INT%, higher passer rating, and lower sack% than Young for his career. While Young played in a tougher era for passing, Lamar adds way more value as a rusher. Young had the benefit of playing on an all time great offense (including coaches) throwing to the greatest WR of all time, and Lamar has played under Greg Roman throwing to DeMarcus Robinson as his no. 1. Steve Young has 8 seasons with a higher Comp%+ than Lamar's highest. Steve Young's highest TD%+ is higher than Lamar's, and has 4 more seasons higher than Lamar's 2nd highest. Steve Young has 3 seasons with a better INT%+ than Lamar's best. Lamar has 1 season with an above average Sack%+. Steve Young has 4. Steve Young has 5 seasons with a higher Rate+ than Lamar's best, and 2 more seasons tied with it. It's not even close. Young also averaged the same YPC as Lamar over a 6 year span. Yes, Lamar ran more. He's obviously a better runner. Even though Lamar is the best running QB ever, I don't think Young is lower than 5th. Young also beats Lamar in raw passing stats in the playoffs, despite playing in a tougher era. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AngusMcFife Posted February 7 Share Posted February 7 1 hour ago, HerbertGOAT said: Steve Young has 8 seasons with a higher Comp%+ than Lamar's highest. Steve Young's highest TD%+ is higher than Lamar's, and has 4 more seasons higher than Lamar's 2nd highest. Steve Young has 3 seasons with a better INT%+ than Lamar's best. Lamar has 1 season with an above average Sack%+. Steve Young has 4. Steve Young has 5 seasons with a higher Rate+ than Lamar's best, and 2 more seasons tied with it. It's not even close. Young also averaged the same YPC as Lamar over a 6 year span. Yes, Lamar ran more. He's obviously a better runner. Even though Lamar is the best running QB ever, I don't think Young is lower than 5th. Young also beats Lamar in raw passing stats in the playoffs, despite playing in a tougher era. I agree Young's peak is better. But not many QBs get to be nurtured for years in an all-time great offensive system with occasional game action and then start full time at age 30 throwing to the greatest WR of all time. Steve Young had a lot of incredible advantages built in to his career that I don't think any other all time great can claim. What happens to Young if the Bucs hold onto him even after playing poorly in 1985 and 1986 and he was Testeverde's backup? Or he is traded to a middling team? From being declare a bust after the 1986 season, he had some very fortunate things go his way to resurrect his career. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TecmoSuperJoe Posted February 7 Share Posted February 7 (edited) 13 hours ago, AngusMcFife said: And yet Lamar somehow has a higher completion%, TD%, lower INT%, higher passer rating, and lower sack% than Young for his career. While Young played in a tougher era for passing, Lamar adds way more value as a rusher. Young had the benefit of playing on an all time great offense (including coaches) throwing to the greatest WR of all time, and Lamar has played under Greg Roman throwing to DeMarcus Robinson as his no. 1. You're comparing now to a time in the 1990's where it would be lucky to have more than 10 starters having a 60%+ completion percentage on a season. This past season we had like 30 dudes hit that mark. The eras are vastly different. And even then, as a passer Young's statistical milestones stand the test of time over the majority of what Jackson has accomplished as a starter regardless of the advantages Jackson has in the pass-friendly NFL of today. Yes Young played with some awesome coaches, and talent. If you're getting Lamar being the superior talent/player, than that talent/player shouldn't need nearly as much help as the perceived inferior player he's being compared to. Edited February 7 by TecmoSuperJoe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TecmoSuperJoe Posted February 7 Share Posted February 7 (edited) 4 hours ago, AngusMcFife said: What happens to Young if the Bucs hold onto him even after playing poorly in 1985 and 1986 and he was Testeverde's backup? Or he is traded to a middling team? From being declare a bust after the 1986 season, he had some very fortunate things go his way to resurrect his career. What happens if Lamar Jackson is on the Panthers this entire time??? Or the Bears??? The Raiders??? The Ravens were a fine organization before Lamar got there, and they've continued to do be one. He's in one of the best spots anyone in his position could hope to be in. Edited February 7 by TecmoSuperJoe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AngusMcFife Posted February 7 Share Posted February 7 4 hours ago, TecmoSuperJoe said: What happens if Lamar Jackson is on the Panthers this entire time??? Or the Bears??? The Raiders??? The Ravens were a fine organization before Lamar got there, and they've continued to do be one. He's in one of the best spots anyone in his position could hope to be in. The Ravens were 40-40 the past 5 seasons, and 4-5 in 2018 when Lamar took over and starting winning 75% of games. The 49ers had won 2 of the past 3 Super Bowls and came off consecutive 14-2 seasons when Young was installed. Laughable to compare the two situations. How good an offensive team were the Ravens from 2013 to the first half of 2018? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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