2024 49ers offseason

[Forge]

Odum contract makes more sense now

[Steve_DeBerg_Fan_420]

1 hour ago, StevenK said:

I don’t know what else we are attempting to add to our team via FA. There’s still a large safety market. Feliciano maybe. I know there’s been comms with him.

I wouldn’t mind a receiver/return specialist and then a corner for depth because I can’t see us being comfortable with Ambry when we have a chance to bring in an additional vet. 
 

I personally think Oline is going to be our top priority in the draft or at least seems that way with the way we have attacked FA. 

 

Yeah, I would hope so, but these guys don't invest much in offensive linemen.  Even Trent Williams was a 3rd and a 5th.

I think the offensive linemen market being as expensive as it was is because college is not producing very many pro ready offensive linemen.  I am not sure how you can trust a rookie center.  I think we might be able to piece something together at RG.  

The team still needs a 3rd corner.  Nickel is the new base for the league.

Edited March 14 by Steve_DeBerg_Fan_420

[N4L]

9 minutes ago, Steve_DeBerg_Fan_420 said:

Yeah, I would hope so, but these guys don't invest much in offensive linemen.  Even Trent Williams was a 3rd and a 5th.

While the first part is true to a degree (see below), they traded Buckner for wirfs, but then Trent became available so they pivoted. 

Kyle absolutely, 1000% values LTs. The rest of the OL, particularly Gs? Not so much. 

The idea behind it is that the blocking scheme can get production out of lesser players because of how well they work in unison. There are very complicated options blocks that we utilize that look seamless but are actually very complicated. 

It is why the entire OL seemed to play better when Burford got benched. Feliciano wasn't good, he just actually ran the system the way he was supposed to. Burford never learned that part of the game. It is too much for him, clearly. The blocking scheme doesn't work when people blow their assignment, mainly because they aren't talented enough to overcome a missed assignment when it happens. 

[Steve_DeBerg_Fan_420]

10 minutes ago, N4L said:

While the first part is true to a degree (see below), they traded Buckner for wirfs, but then Trent became available so they pivoted. 

Kyle absolutely, 1000% values LTs. The rest of the OL, particularly Gs? Not so much. 

The idea behind it is that the blocking scheme can get production out of lesser players because of how well they work in unison. There are very complicated options blocks that we utilize that look seamless but are actually very complicated. 

It is why the entire OL seemed to play better when Burford got benched. Feliciano wasn't good, he just actually ran the system the way he was supposed to. Burford never learned that part of the game. It is too much for him, clearly. The blocking scheme doesn't work when people blow their assignment, mainly because they aren't talented enough to overcome a missed assignment when it happens. 

It would be nice to have Wirfs now.  Especially with Purdy at QB.

I think we need guys who are good enough at the three right side spots, as long as they are consistent.  I wouldn't hate the idea of loading up with good young hands and feet guys until we find out which ones can fit into the complex blocking assignments  I just think all three positions fell a little under the mark last year.  Feliciano being the exception.

 

I see the value in youth at RT, but not as much at RG, and youth is a liability at center.

 

[Forge]

 

[757-NINER]

13 minutes ago, Forge said:

 

🤮

[Steve_DeBerg_Fan_420]

1 hour ago, 757-NINER said:

🤮

Feliciano and Conley are the two I would want to keep around.  Gregory was more or less replaced by Gross-mattos.

I'm not a fan of DFF and Burkes. I feel like they just clog the depth chart.  I thought Robinson shoulda won that job last year, and this year you'd hope Grahm, Winters, or the guy we draft could compete for that spot.  If not, a free agent (like Simmons) would be required.

Edited March 14 by Steve_DeBerg_Fan_420

[Forge]

35 minutes ago, Steve_DeBerg_Fan_420 said:

Feliciano and Conley are the two I would want to keep around.  Gregory was more or less replaced by Gross-mattos.

I'm not a fan of DFF and Burkes. I feel like they just clog the depth chart.  I thought Robinson shoulda won that job last year, and this year you'd hope Grahm, Winters, or the guy we draft could compete for that spot.  If not, a free agent (like Simmons) would be required.

I would actually bring back Gregory because I have to imagine that's a league minimum deal and I did see at least some Juice in those old legs still. 

Feliciano is probably a no brainer, though I wish we'd just try and actually upgrade the damn spot. Conley is probably also a guy I'd bring back not just as receiver depth, but he made some key special teams plays as well, which is important. 

I suppose the things that hurt Gregory and Conley though is that their league minimum is quite a bit higher than a late round pick or 2nd / 3rd year vet 

[Steve_DeBerg_Fan_420]

4 minutes ago, Forge said:

I would actually bring back Gregory because I have to imagine that's a league minimum deal and I did see at least some Juice in those old legs still. 

Feliciano is probably a no brainer, though I wish we'd just try and actually upgrade the damn spot. Conley is probably also a guy I'd bring back not just as receiver depth, but he made some key special teams plays as well, which is important. 

I suppose the things that hurt Gregory and Conley though is that their league minimum is quite a bit higher than a late round pick or 2nd / 3rd year vet 

I think Gregory fits in with the 3 by 1 stunt heavy formation we didn't use last year.  

I think the team needs a higher floor and ceiling at all three of the Center RG and RT spots.  It's hard to find high floors in the draft at O-line at the moment.

Edited March 14 by Steve_DeBerg_Fan_420

[Forge]

I love Juice, but the Juice hive is just too much, man. Great niche player. Still just a niche player. If the thought is that Aiyuk is as equally replaceable as Juice, I really don't know what we are doing here. But maybe I'm conflating the idea of being "difficult to replace" with "value", but I would think that in conversations such as that, the two go hand in hand. 

Like, okay...maybe Juice is actually harder to replace....but his impact is so much smaller that I'm not sure why we care? 

[GW21]

3 minutes ago, Forge said:

I love Juice, but the Juice hive is just too much, man. Great niche player. Still just a niche player. If the thought is that Aiyuk is as equally replaceable as Juice, I really don't know what we are doing here. 

As far as value to the team? No, Juice is not more valuable. I think the sentiment is that you can find a receiver that can do what BA does way easier than you can find a FB that can do with Juice does; and I agree with that. 

Also I feel like the FB position is a niche position at this point lol. 

[Steve_DeBerg_Fan_420]

14 minutes ago, GW21 said:

As far as value to the team? No, Juice is not more valuable. I think the sentiment is that you can find a receiver that can do what BA does way easier than you can find a FB that can do with Juice does; and I agree with that. 

Also I feel like the FB position is a niche position at this point lol. 

Juice is a guy that can play fullback, but he probably spends about 25% of this time there. 

He has become more of a versatile flank player who dictates personnel match-ups.  It's possible to find ways to improve the different things he does, but it is hard to do so without having a guy who does everything.  It really makes the offense more unpredictable.  I just don't think they had time to mess with changes at this level, or they have a draft replacement in mind, and a year or two of learning the very unique job would be helpful. 

Man, at this point, Fullback is probably the thing Juice will do least.  Sometimes I wonder if we keep that package around just for nostalgia.   

Edited March 14 by Steve_DeBerg_Fan_420

[GW21]

12 minutes ago, Steve_DeBerg_Fan_420 said:

Juice is a guy that can play fullback, but he probably spends about 25% of this time there. 

He has become more of a versatile flank player who dictates personnel match-ups.  It's possible to find ways to improve the different things he does, but it is hard to do so without having a guy who does everything.  It really makes the offense more unpredictable.  I just don't think they had time to mess with changes at this level, or they have a draft replacement in mind, and a year or two of learning the very unique job would be helpful. 

Man, at this point, Fullback is probably the thing Juice will do least.  Sometimes I wonder if we keep that package around just for nostalgia.   

Isn't it weird that a fullback is called a fullback and a halfback is called a halfback? Definitely seems backwards. 

 

Anyway call Juice a FB, call him a TE, call him whatever you want; I still maintain that his skillset is unique and less easy to replace than a number 1 receiver. 

[John232]

Love juice and he’s been a net positive,  But this isn’t even about Aiyuk, we have basically spent money on a guy where money could’ve been used on a position that sees the field every snap. He was getting paid a significant amount too.

 

it sort of just comes down to shanny wanting things a very specific way, and unfortunately that comes with a different set of costs.

I would’ve much rather rolled juices money into a really solid center or right guard. It sometimes feel like this overseas thinking of “oh we have juice to fill blocking gaps” but so much execution is required versus just having a more talented guy who can consisntlty win one on one. Obviously juice provides way more value than that, but I would still rather have a better offensive lineman. 

[StevenK]

What’s also odd, we don’t even use Juice as much in the run game. I think someone had mentioned about 50% of our runs were with him and the other without. We don’t use him as a receiving threat, even though we should, so it’s kind of like Office Space - what would you say, you do here?! 
 

While his point is valid, there’s a lot receivers coming out each year, but the way that Kyle “trains” and requests so much from them, it’s harder to replace. The league in itself doesn’t use FB’s as much. Not saying Juice wouldn’t find a team, it’s just odd to think that Aiyuk is easily replaceable.