Epyon Posted September 17 Share Posted September 17 (edited) Super doubtful he'll be available yet unless it's an overpay, but Tyson Bagent (Bears backup QB, 2nd year player) has been pretty solid with some upside toward the future. Played well in preseason last two years, and won half the games filling in for injured Fields last season. Definitely not a rocket arm, though. He showed much more zip/drive this year's preseason, but last year he was throwing balls like "about to retire" level Tom Brady arm, fwiw.... On the bright side, very quick operator, good footwork, tons of game experience (was the NCAA all time career passing yard and TD leader coming out, not sure if he still is), and had a very low sack rate behind the same offensive line Fields was getting butchered by. He's also a crossfit freak.... and did 1mile burpee challenge for fun which sounds just awful, but is impressive. Biggest weakness? Well, honestly? Ceiling. He's just not going to bomb a 70 yarder downfield to Tyreek. But the kid works hard, and if he really masters the mental game, he can be successful. Especially in a more West Coast styled offense. Possible all he ever ends up being is a game manager/backup qb, but he's imo earned a chance to get a bigger look (and though I'm happy we have Caleb now, I would have strongly preferred rolling w/ Bagent over Fields this season at least, and probably most of the other QBs from this class, since it would have also involved getting another trade down "haul"). Odds are he's going to get traded longer term anyhow, with Caleb here. Edited September 17 by Epyon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WizeGuy Posted September 17 Share Posted September 17 Not sure Tanny would do much behind that O line. I'm assuming he'd be a statue back there, and the Dolphins were pretty beat up in the middle of their line, then lost Armstead, but Buffalo was having their way with them even before that injury. Huntley at least provides some speed to counter what their weaknesses at O line. Truth is, they're searching the bottom of the barrel. Huntley's about as good as you can expect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted October 1 Share Posted October 1 At this point what should they do? Their season is slipping away and they've looked terrible the last two weeks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hunter2_1 Posted October 1 Share Posted October 1 Quit for Quinn Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
El Ramster Posted October 1 Share Posted October 1 (edited) You pray Edited October 1 by El Ramster Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
notthatbluestuff Posted October 1 Share Posted October 1 Why is their offense so terrible? There are plenty of coaches who can get backup QBs to run a functional offense; the starter going down isn't an excuse. McDaniel is the architect of what this forum deemed one of the all-time great offenses a year ago (or at least an all-September offense) and yet the entire operation collapses with Tua? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iknowcool Posted October 1 Share Posted October 1 14 minutes ago, notthatbluestuff said: Why is their offense so terrible? There are plenty of coaches who can get backup QBs to run a functional offense; the starter going down isn't an excuse. McDaniel is the architect of what this forum deemed one of the all-time great offenses a year ago (or at least an all-September offense) and yet the entire operation collapses with Tua? I wouldn't say there are "plenty of coaches" who can do it. Even in a situation like KOC/Darnold, Darnold was a top 5 pick. Physical talent was never the issue with him, whereas Huntley and Thompson don't have a fraction of the talent. You (probably) couldn't just swap Darnold out for Thompson and expect the same production. Not to say McDaniel doesn't deserve some criticism - he 100% does as even with Tua, their offense has too many games where they fold. But I don't think it is fair to say plenty of coaches could get a functional offense with Thompson (7th round pick) and Huntley (UDFA) at QB. In the 12 Ravens games Huntley threw the ball 10+ times in, only 2x did the Ravens score 20+ points. And Huntley wasn't on the team a month ago. Heck, look at the difference in Carolina's offense when it is Bryce Young vs Andy Dalton starting. Sometimes truly awful QBing can't be overcome no matter how good the play caller is. And it is even worse when the QB doesn't have the physical skillset you can work around. Malik Willis isn't great, but he's a great athlete with a good strong arm and so it is easier for Green Bay to design an offense for him to succeed in short-term. Miami's issue was not having a better plan behind their injury-prone QB. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
notthatbluestuff Posted October 1 Share Posted October 1 3 minutes ago, iknowcool said: I wouldn't say there are "plenty of coaches" who can do it. Even in a situation like KOC/Darnold, Darnold was a top 5 pick. Physical talent was never the issue with him, whereas Huntley and Thompson don't have a fraction of the talent. You (probably) couldn't just swap Darnold out for Thompson and expect the same production. Not to say McDaniel doesn't deserve some criticism - he 100% does as even with Tua, their offense has too many games where they fold. But I don't think it is fair to say plenty of coaches could get a functional offense with Thompson (7th round pick) and Huntley (UDFA) at QB. In the 12 Ravens games Huntley threw the ball 10+ times in, only 2x did the Ravens score 20+ points. And Huntley wasn't on the team a month ago. Heck, look at the difference in Carolina's offense when it is Bryce Young vs Andy Dalton starting. Sometimes truly awful QBing can't be overcome no matter how good the play caller is. And it is even worse when the QB doesn't have the physical skillset you can work around. Malik Willis isn't great, but he's a great athlete with a good strong arm and so it is easier for Green Bay to design an offense for him to succeed in short-term. Miami's issue was not having a better plan behind their injury-prone QB. McDaniel is supposed to be on a level with Lafleur, Shanahan, McVay. Even Stefanski has done better than this. Taylor/Callahan with Cincy? Steichen with Minshew? Thompson isn't anywhere near talented for a backup, true - but he's been there for years now. He's their choice of backup QB. To your point, they should've known sooner that they needed a better option. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iknowcool Posted October 1 Share Posted October 1 (edited) 21 minutes ago, notthatbluestuff said: McDaniel is supposed to be on a level with Lafleur, Shanahan, McVay. Even Stefanski has done better than this. Taylor/Callahan with Cincy? Steichen with Minshew? Thompson isn't anywhere near talented for a backup, true - but he's been there for years now. He's their choice of backup QB. To your point, they should've known sooner that they needed a better option. But that is a roster management and evaluation issue, not necessarily a reflection on how good or bad he is as a play-caller. When has McVay ever had to make a functional offense work with a QB at the level of Skylar Thompson? They averaged 16 PPG in the 3 games Wolford/Perkins started in 2022. McVay is better than McDaniels for sure, but even his offense is gonna struggle with bad QB play. They were 27th in scoring that year. It happens. When has Stefanski done it? Do we not see them struggling with Deshaun Watson? They are 27th in scoring with the QB they chose. How is that any better than McDaniel struggling with the back-up QB? But nobody is going to blame Stefanski because we know Watson sucks. Again there is only so much a HC or OC can do about that. When has Zac Taylor done it? Minshew is way better than Thompson, but even if we are going to use him as an example - his numbers were noticeably worse under Steichen than in his years in Jacksonville. If your argument is simply that Mike McDaniel isn't as good as his reputation would suggest, fair enough. I would maybe agree with you on that. But I don't think it is true that being a good to great OC/HC means you should be able to succeed with whoever is at QB, talent be damned. Edited October 1 by iknowcool Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HerbertGOAT Posted October 1 Share Posted October 1 2 minutes ago, iknowcool said: But that is a roster management and evaluation issue, not necessarily a reflection on how good or bad he is as a play-caller. When has McVay ever had to make a functional offense work with a QB at the level of Skylar Thompson? They averaged 16 PPG in the 3 games Wolford/Perkins started in 2022. McVay is better than McDaniels for sure, but even his offense is gonna struggle with bad QB play. They were 27th in scoring that year. It happens. When has Stefanski done it? Do we not see them struggling with Deshaun Watson? They are 27th in scoring with the QB they chose. How is that any better than McDaniel struggling with the back-up QB? But nobody is going to blame Stefanski because we know Watson sucks. Again there is only so much a HC or OC can do about that. When has Zac Taylor done it? Minshew is way better than Thompson, but even if we are going to use him as an example - his numbers were noticeably worse under Steichen than in his years in Jacksonville. If your argument is simply that Mike McDaniel isn't as good as his reputation would suggest, fair enough. I would maybe agree with you on that. But I don't think it is true that being a good to great OC/HC means you should be able to succeed with whoever is at QB, talent be damned. This reminds me of when biggie tried to say Shanahan sucked because CJ Beathard and Brian Hoyer weren't good with the 49ers. (the 49ers QBs are 2nd in EPA per play going back to 2017) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iknowcool Posted October 1 Share Posted October 1 3 minutes ago, HerbertGOAT said: This reminds me of when biggie tried to say Shanahan sucked because CJ Beathard and Brian Hoyer weren't good with the 49ers. (the 49ers QBs are 2nd in EPA per play going back to 2017) I also don't think it is wrong to say that Kyle Shanahan (at least of this era) is one of the best to ever do it. What he's able to accomplish with all these different QBs is more a reflection of his talent as a play-caller/designer. You can't expect everyone to be as good as Kyle Shanahan. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
notthatbluestuff Posted October 1 Share Posted October 1 10 minutes ago, HerbertGOAT said: This reminds me of when biggie tried to say Shanahan sucked because CJ Beathard and Brian Hoyer weren't good with the 49ers. (the 49ers QBs are 2nd in EPA per play going back to 2017) No, it's nothing like biggie. That was totally silly and wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
notthatbluestuff Posted October 1 Share Posted October 1 15 minutes ago, iknowcool said: If your argument is simply that Mike McDaniel isn't as good as his reputation would suggest, fair enough. I would maybe agree with you on that. But I don't think it is true that being a good to great OC/HC means you should be able to succeed with whoever is at QB, talent be damned. I'm not saying he has to succeed necessarily but Jesus Christ, the offense is a disaster. For someone with McDaniels' reputation, I'd have expected better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Superduperman Posted October 1 Share Posted October 1 I think expecting a good offensive performance with a qb who's been with the team for a couple weeks is kind of unrealistic. Blaming it on McDaniel is not that fair. If you ask me, the fault lies with team management for keeping Tua as their QB when everyone knew he was a ticking bomb to get another concussion and tank their season. Now that's happened and the Dolphins have to lie in the bed they made until they can do something about it in the off season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lavar703 Posted October 1 Share Posted October 1 You would have to figure Russ is there in a week or two. He's never going to play for the Steelers and it makes no sense for him to just sit there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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