Swift has turned out to be a complete waste of money

[mdonnelly21]

I had high hopes for him, but I did not realize he doesn't know how to run up the middle. 

I would say it's the O Line and a lot of it is but Roschon Johnson played very well and should be our Starting RB 1 

And let Swift and Hebert fight for #2. Imagine how much we could have shored up the O Line with that money instead and let Roschon and Hebert split carries SMH.

[Docknstein11]

I didn’t like the signing when it happened and I absolutely despise it now. Love some of the things Poles has done but he’s really outsmarted himself by investing in the wrong areas while thinking he nailed all of his offensive line moves. 

[Epyon]

Offense needs to decide what it wants to be, tbh...

 

Swift is a back designed for a spread offense, imo..... Put him in big space and he's explosive enough to take big chunks.... and if we had bigger bodied WR on the edge, to good taking "receiver" screens.

Unfortunately, we keep trying to run him up the middle, with zero OL push in the running game, and he just goes down too easily to contact.... Meanwhile our only WR I'd trust to block right now is Odunze.  Moore isn't good at it, Allen is too old for it (and hurt), and Carter just doesn't have the mass.

I'd argue that Swift was an overpay to begin with, but he's flat out in the wrong offense to take advantage of what he does actually do well........ Unironically, I think he'd have been amazing in the old Trestman offense with Alshon/BMarsh on the perimeter blocking for him.   As it stands for us, he's a 3rd down back, and not even a good one.  Given his contract, you can basically be assured he's here next year too, with Herbert walking.

As for Roschon: I'm not convinced he's that good, as much as he's a guy who will just always go for whether he can get, vs trying to hit the home run. It's the reason he actually had a higher YPC than Bijan in college, but also had dramatically fewer explosive plays.  Ideally to me he's a #2-3 on the depth chart..... With Swift unfortunately being the really expensive change of pace guy, and then someone more talented to come in and actually take more snaps.  Personally, I really like Ashton Jeanty in the draft, but he may end up too rich for us if he has a great combine at the rate he's going.

 

 

Edited Monday at 04:47 AM by Epyon

[beardown3231]

Correct

[topwop1]

Yeah I didn't really get this signing at the time and so far the returns haven't been there.

I don't know what this coaching staff has against Herbert. 

I realize he's not a home run hitting type of RB and that he was drafted by the previous regime but he's still a good runner who can get those tough much needed yards

Also when Roschon was drafted there was a lot of hype towards him from this coaching staff and then he suddenly dropped off in favor of guys like Travis Homer who is a career special teams guy. 

I think Swift can still have value but as more of a 3rd down back who does his best work in the open field...and not between the tackles 

It was good to see more usage of Herbert and RJ in the Colts game...so maybe the staff is figuring out that they need to get these guys going more

I guess I'll give the coaches the benefit of the doubt in figuring out the personnel usage  since both Waldron and Morton are new

Edited Monday at 11:48 AM by topwop1

[Sugashane]

I preferred Herbert but Swift was meant to fill a role that he hasn't had a chance to really be utilized in either. He has never been a guy that gets the dirty yards, he is a guy that gets chunk plays when he can get in space. But the OL can't open holes and he is averaging about 3 targets per game. I thought he was going to be a bigger part of the offense just as a dump off option but it hasn't worked out yet. I thought he would be a guy that would get 400-500 yards receiving but he is currently on pace for just 260. Its 3 games in though and there is a TON of time for adjustments. Johnson flashed some as a receiver, maybe he will be a more complete player than we thought or it may have been more of an aberration. Regardless Waldron has to find a way to better utilize Swift. He's not as complete as Forte, he can't run up the middle and break tackles like the Bears RBs have had recently (Howard and Monty), and he isn't as shifty as Cohen was. I'd say he is kind of the middle between Forte and Cohen, he needs to get into space to use speed but isn't going to do a lot of damage after contact. 

Swift had significantly better OLs in PHI and was above average but not amazing by any means, so I think expectations needed to be tempered for him here with lesser OL and a rookie QB. Game was rough for sure but I'm more invested in Williams than a winning season, so his progression is what matters most. From the highlights/clips I've seen he had WAY more trust in his arm yesterday, Waldron still called a trash game but at least was getting personnel improved and Williams was making a ton of great throws. What helps is recognizing Allen (who is a top WR2 in the league) was out and he still was making things happen.  He was 28 out of 37 to his top 4 targets. Getting Allen back will just open up more for them. Maybe that and an improved passing game will open up more in the run game so Swift can be a real weapon. 

The OL has been bad but it might actually be best to go 4 wide more often. Think of how Indy ran with Peyton. Use Kmet like Clark and be a move TE/big slot, then use Moore/Allen/Odunze as the 3 WRs. If the defenses spread out and go smaller then Swift may be able to find a gap or if they want to bring pressure to rush Williams then Swift might be able to get the quick dump off and use his speed in space. Honestly without having numbers in their favor right now I don't have much confidence in the OL to do much. The IOL needs Jenkins to come back and Bates to be at least average, then they will have to figure out who is least **** for RG. The biggest issue with this approach though is Williams, will he take the short throws and be happy with getting a number of 3rd and 4s or will he try too hard to play hero ball and get the crap beat out of him. I'm leery of counting on Waldron to really keep the tempo quick for him ATM. 

[mdonnelly21]

11 hours ago, Epyon said:

Offense needs to decide what it wants to be, tbh...

 

Swift is a back designed for a spread offense, imo..... Put him in big space and he's explosive enough to take big chunks.... and if we had bigger bodied WR on the edge, to good taking "receiver" screens.

Unfortunately, we keep trying to run him up the middle, with zero OL push in the running game, and he just goes down too easily to contact.... Meanwhile our only WR I'd trust to block right now is Odunze.  Moore isn't good at it, Allen is too old for it (and hurt), and Carter just doesn't have the mass.

I'd argue that Swift was an overpay to begin with, but he's flat out in the wrong offense to take advantage of what he does actually do well........ Unironically, I think he'd have been amazing in the old Trestman offense with Alshon/BMarsh on the perimeter blocking for him.   As it stands for us, he's a 3rd down back, and not even a good one.  Given his contract, you can basically be assured he's here next year too, with Herbert walking.

As for Roschon: I'm not convinced he's that good, as much as he's a guy who will just always go for whether he can get, vs trying to hit the home run. It's the reason he actually had a higher YPC than Bijan in college, but also had dramatically fewer explosive plays.  Ideally to me he's a #2-3 on the depth chart..... With Swift unfortunately being the really expensive change of pace guy, and then someone more talented to come in and actually take more snaps.  Personally, I really like Ashton Jeanty in the draft, but he may end up too rich for us if he has a great combine at the rate he's going.

 

 

I want to spend 7 draft picks on O Line next year and hope that land a lot of young talent there. That's it, I'm done. 

[BEAR FACE DOWN ARROW]

When we think of "Eagles' Swift" and "Detroit Swift" are we really thinking of their OL?

Only other thought I've had is that if we're concerned about Herbert being int he backfield acting as a "tell" I think we may be past the point of that mattering. 

[Madmike90]

He will continue to be a waste of money until he is used correctly...running him on inside zone is an utter waste of time...

This is a guy who either needs the OL to create space for him to use his speed or an offensive coordinator who is creative enough to get the ball in his hands in space consistently...

Right now he is **** out of luck for both

[Epyon]

The perimeter blocking is just bad in general as well....

We've all seen the talent DJ Moore has, and we've seen him embarrass people 1v1 to get yac. Now go look up dj's stats this year on receiver screens... It's pathetic. 

No one is blocking worth a damn on this team. 

Edited Monday at 06:57 PM by Epyon

[beardown3231]

1 hour ago, Madmike90 said:

He will continue to be a waste of money until he is used correctly...running him on inside zone is an utter waste of time...

This is a guy who either needs the OL to create space for him to use his speed or an offensive coordinator who is creative enough to get the ball in his hands in space consistently...

Right now he is **** out of luck for both

He should be used on 3rd down only or on other downs by as a decoy/slot guy/etc

[Ty21]

It’s going exactly as expected. I might as well have started a podcast complaining about him with how much I’ve been doing it. He was always going to be the mediocre back he was in Detroit, we don’t have the eagles super line. 
 

Poles has gotten some things right but he has proven with some cases to be an atrocious evaluator of talent. Thinking he can get a functional OL for pennies, Claypool, swift, etc. 

[BEAR FACE DOWN ARROW]

44 minutes ago, Ty21 said:

It’s going exactly as expected. I might as well have started a podcast complaining about him with how much I’ve been doing it. He was always going to be the mediocre back he was in Detroit, we don’t have the eagles super line. 
 

Poles has gotten some things right but he has proven with some cases to be an atrocious evaluator of talent. Thinking he can get a functional OL for pennies, Claypool, swift, etc. 

All GMs have their misses,  any every forum probably has their most hated players on it.

I knew Swift mostly from Detroit and thought he was worse than Monty.  He'd look better with a better OL, although that does remind me of the excuses we used to make for Fields about how he'd do better with a gameplan adapted to his strengths and better OL, although that seems at least partly true with him in Pit. 

The only really alarming thing was how focused they had to have been to target Swift, sign him right away for what seems like a high dollar.  Seems kind of like how Pace would target players and go bananas.  Also reminds me of the Ryan Bates courtship, which has not as of yet paid off in any positive way. \

While I would freely admit that the best thing Ryan Poles has ever done is luck into that first pick, in my opinion he has been above average when you take the sum total.  If his poor job on OL sinks the Bears this year or ruins Williams then we have a problem. 

[AZBearsFan]

The thing I’ve seen most with Swift this year so far is that he looks tentative a lot. When he’s not tentative he’s been fine, but him not looking tentative has been really infrequent. By contrast, Roschon never runs tentatively. Herbert very seldomly runs tentatively.

I came away from TC and the preseason expecting to see Swift make more of an impact in the screen game, yet we haven’t seen much of that called at all and I’m not sure why. Still waiting for some moving pockets to help out our QB when he’s constantly under duress too, but I guess that might be asking too much… 

[soulman]

On 9/22/2024 at 10:42 PM, Epyon said:

Offense needs to decide what it wants to be, tbh...

 

Swift is a back designed for a spread offense, imo..... Put him in big space and he's explosive enough to take big chunks.... and if we had bigger bodied WR on the edge, to good taking "receiver" screens.

Unfortunately, we keep trying to run him up the middle, with zero OL push in the running game, and he just goes down too easily to contact.... Meanwhile our only WR I'd trust to block right now is Odunze.  Moore isn't good at it, Allen is too old for it (and hurt), and Carter just doesn't have the mass.

I'd argue that Swift was an overpay to begin with, but he's flat out in the wrong offense to take advantage of what he does actually do well........ Unironically, I think he'd have been amazing in the old Trestman offense with Alshon/BMarsh on the perimeter blocking for him.   As it stands for us, he's a 3rd down back, and not even a good one.  Given his contract, you can basically be assured he's here next year too, with Herbert walking.

As for Roschon: I'm not convinced he's that good, as much as he's a guy who will just always go for whether he can get, vs trying to hit the home run. It's the reason he actually had a higher YPC than Bijan in college, but also had dramatically fewer explosive plays.  Ideally to me he's a #2-3 on the depth chart..... With Swift unfortunately being the really expensive change of pace guy, and then someone more talented to come in and actually take more snaps.  Personally, I really like Ashton Jeanty in the draft, but he may end up too rich for us if he has a great combine at the rate he's going.

 

 

I believe you'd hit the nail square on the head as it relates to Swift.  What I see in this offense is a very costly 3rd down back yet he was a guy Waldron seemed to want.  As long as he runs strictly outside zone and is willing to scheme well blocked screen passes Swift might better succeed but he's definitely not an every down back in this offense.  IMHO we did far better and would still do far better splitting carries between Herbert and Johnson.  I think we made a $14 mil (gtd $$$) mistake with Swift at least for this offense.