Alex Smith to be traded to Washington for 3rd round pick and CB Kendall Fuller; agrees to extension

[squire12]

41 minutes ago, CWood21 said:

That's the biggest grey area, I'm not sure exactly when the period for compensatory picks to be awarded and not is.  I believe as long as the player signs a contract before a certain period (I want to say it's before the first regular season game), they're eligible for a compensatory pick.  Honestly, I think this is a point that nobody on here is privy to and can only speculate.

Here is some info from over the cap on this.  Not sure how the dates correspond to now with new CBA changes.

https://overthecap.com/the-basics-and-methodology-of-projecting-the-nfls-compensatory-draft-picks/

Quote

 

Also take note that only certain players qualify for the compensatory formula. Adam explains this further:

In order to qualify for the comp equation, a player must have been a true Unrestricted Free Agent whose contract had expired or was voided after the previous season (i.e., he cannot have been released by his old team); he must sign during the UFA signing period (which ended July 27 last year); if he signs after June 1[*], he must have been tendered a June 1 qualifying offer by his old team; his compensatory value or contract value must be above a specific minimum amount; and he cannot have been permanently released by his new team before a certain point in the season (which seems to be after Week 10) or, possibly, before getting a certain amount of playing time, unless he was claimed off waivers by another team.

*On 2015, this date was switched to May 12, and in 2016 it was May 10. It is believed that the cutoff date in future years will be the second Tuesday after the draft.

 

 

[Woz]

Just now, iPwn said:

But I mean what’s happening is that Washington would effectively be telling the teams “hey, take this QB we obviously don’t want to pay $35M this year.” And that’s one thing. But on top of that they’re telling the other team “you have to pay us [going back to the beans thing here] for him, and also you then have to pay him [extra beans]” or they’re telling Kirk “you don’t get to really pick the team you want to play for, they have to be one we’re okay with you going to, and probably you’re going to have to take [less beans] to do it”.

And for what? So that the two sides don’t have to wait an extra two months for Washington to admit they have zero interest in paying a backup $35 million?

Oh, this is all stupid. It assumes that the Redskins are dumb enough to franchise Cousins and that the Special Master interprets the CBA as imparting to the Redskins the sole negotiating rights for any and all contracts that can be offered him in 2018. In that case, I tried to think of a possible scenario where the Redskins could make a contract that would possibly work for Kirk in terms of overall dollars but not leave any monies on their cap.

 

[Woz]

Just now, squire12 said:

42 minutes ago, CWood21 said:

That's the biggest grey area, I'm not sure exactly when the period for compensatory picks to be awarded and not is.  I believe as long as the player signs a contract before a certain period (I want to say it's before the first regular season game), they're eligible for a compensatory pick.  Honestly, I think this is a point that nobody on here is privy to and can only speculate.

Here is some info from over the cap on this.  Not sure how the dates correspond to now with new CBA changes.

https://overthecap.com/the-basics-and-methodology-of-projecting-the-nfls-compensatory-draft-picks/

Quote

 

Also take note that only certain players qualify for the compensatory formula. Adam explains this further:

In order to qualify for the comp equation, a player must have been a true Unrestricted Free Agent whose contract had expired or was voided after the previous season (i.e., he cannot have been released by his old team); he must sign during the UFA signing period (which ended July 27 last year); if he signs after June 1[*], he must have been tendered a June 1 qualifying offer by his old team; his compensatory value or contract value must be above a specific minimum amount; and he cannot have been permanently released by his new team before a certain point in the season (which seems to be after Week 10) or, possibly, before getting a certain amount of playing time, unless he was claimed off waivers by another team.

*On 2015, this date was switched to May 12, and in 2016 it was May 10. It is believed that the cutoff date in future years will be the second Tuesday after the draft.

 

That's vaguely what I recalled. Since Cousins wouldn't have had his contract expire or void after the previous season (i.e. he was tendered at the start of the 2018 league year), the compensatory pick evaporates.

[CWood21]

Just now, Woz said:

That's vaguely what I recalled. Since Cousins wouldn't have had his contract expire or void after the previous season (i.e. he was tendered at the start of the 2018 league year), the compensatory pick evaporates.

I don't see anything in there that answer it one way or the other.  Using the Josh Norman situation, they rescinded the franchise tag on April 20th.  Presumably this was done so the Panthers could receive a compensatory pick.  The Panthers ended up getting that compensatory pick for Norman.  That was a full month AFTER FA opened, so the Panthers rescinded the franchise tag AND still received a compensatory pick.

[Woz]

17 minutes ago, CWood21 said:

Because they're not negotiating with Washington.  They'd be negotiating with someone like Denver.

https://nfllabor.files.wordpress.com/2010/01/collective-bargaining-agreement-2011-2020.pdf (Article 10, Section 8)

Quote

No Assignment: No Club may assign or otherwise transfer to any other Club the exclusive negotiating rights or any Right of First Refusal it may have for any Franchise Player, nor any Right of First Refusal it may have for any Transition Player, nor any designation rights it may have.

So, the Redskins would need to find a trading partner that they can come to terms with before the franchise tag window opens, present that Cousins as an option, tell him to negotiate a new deal in two weeks (plus any days before the window opens if they can come to terms sooner), and assuming he accepts the new deal, hope a deal can be hammered out in time.

Because otherwise, the whole thing goes FUT when the tag is applied.

 

[Woz]

33 minutes ago, CWood21 said:

I don't see anything in there that answer it one way or the other.  Using the Josh Norman situation, they rescinded the franchise tag on April 20th.  Presumably this was done so the Panthers could receive a compensatory pick.  The Panthers ended up getting that compensatory pick for Norman.  That was a full month AFTER FA opened, so the Panthers rescinded the franchise tag AND still received a compensatory pick.

Learn something new ...

[CWood21]

1 minute ago, Woz said:

Learn something new ...

Honestly, until I dug into it more I was in the dark as much as you are.  I'd assume there's some more loopholes that we don't know about it.  I mean anyone remember the "Alan Faneca" rule?

[Woz]

Just now, CWood21 said:

Honestly, until I dug into it more I was in the dark as much as you are.  I'd assume there's some more loopholes that we don't know about it.  I mean anyone remember the "Alan Faneca" rule?

I remember it being a thing ... but what it was, I don't recall. *goes a-Googlin'* Huh, not what I thought that was. I wonder if that still holds true under the current CBA (we wouldn't know one way or the other since the mechanisms of the compensatory system are opaque).

[CWood21]

7 minutes ago, Woz said:

I remember it being a thing ... but what it was, I don't recall. *goes a-Googlin'* Huh, not what I thought that was. I wonder if that still holds true under the current CBA (we wouldn't know one way or the other since the mechanisms of the compensatory system are opaque).

I believe it's still a thing.  I think it's referred to as the 10 year veteran rule now.

[Woz]

2 hours ago, CWood21 said:

I believe it's still a thing.  I think it's referred to as the 10 year veteran rule now.

Wouldn't surprise me, as I guess it behooves teams to re-sign long term vets since they won't get as much in compensation for them if they walk.

[beats2rock]

4 hours ago, Woz said:

https://nfllabor.files.wordpress.com/2010/01/collective-bargaining-agreement-2011-2020.pdf

So, 120% of 24M = 28.8M.

That said, the transition tag makes no sense now. What would the Redskins get out of it? The right of first refusal on a contract that there is an infinitesimally small chance that they'd match (it's not zero due to the Morons In Charge (MIC))? If they decline to match (an almost certainty), they get nothing. At least if they let him walk away, they might get a 2019 compensatory pick.

Also, unlike with the franchise tag where there is a possibility Cousins might sign it to lock in the guaranteed $35M contract, Cousins wouldn't sign the transition tender since he can negotiate with any of the other 31 teams and hammer out a contract to his liking. Since the likelihood of the Redskins matching the tendered deal and paying Alex Smith is incredibly low (but not zero because of the MIC), there's no real fear of effort or time wasted in working out that deal on the part of the new club. In essence, a transition tag would be unrestricted free agency for Kirk Cousins in all but name.

All a transition tag would do at this point is make the Redskins look stupid and childish, which is not beyond the pale considering we have the MIC.

Thanks for explaining that. I thought they would receive a second round pick from a team that signed him on the transition tag but that might have been an old rule or something?

[Woz]

Just now, beats2rock said:

Thanks for explaining that. I thought they would receive a second round pick from a team that signed him on the transition tag but that might have been an old rule or something?

No, you never could get any picks from the transition tag. You might be thinking of the middle level RFA compensation?

[Sugashane]

3 hours ago, beats2rock said:

Thanks for explaining that. I thought they would receive a second round pick from a team that signed him on the transition tag but that might have been an old rule or something?

I may be wrong, but I believe you're thinking of restricted free agent tenders. A player can be assigned a first, second, or third round tender which they will be awarded if another team takes them on. I don't remember of any compensation for a transition tag, but may just not know of it.

 

EDIT - Nevermind, Woz already said what I posted. Next time I'll scroll a bit further. lol

Edited February 3, 2018 by Sugashane

[Dr LBC]

On 1/31/2018 at 7:39 AM, HTTRG3Dynasty said:

Pro-tip.  Draft Vernon Davis in your fantasy leagues next year.  

Draft?  No.  Not unless Jordan Reed is either released/traded this off-season or gets injured before the regular season begins.  I never advocate drafting anyone who is going to sit on my roster for 2-3 weeks before ever being useful (then again, I do play in more competitive leagues with shallower benches than most people).  I'd amend this to "keep tabs on Vernon Davis and pick him up off waivers a week earlier than you think you may need to - i.e. if you have a TE with an early bye week and you have the roster space to make a speculative pick on Davis a week ahead of when that bye occurs, that's a good move).

[Nex_Gen]

Cousins just gained a huge fan in me after this entire ordeal. The way he handled everything from a professional standpoint. He said everything perfectly on the NFL Network interview yesterday as well. What a good dude. The guy is definitely a franchise QB in my eyes. He's going to have had a good career when it's all said and done....