squire12 Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 Does the Randall trade indicate that House is more likely to return as some level of insurance? King / House / Colvin / Draft pick That is not an awful group, depending on how high that draft pick is. If it is at pick 14, then the EDGE group still looks shaky behind Perry and Matthews. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexGreen#20 Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 3 minutes ago, incognito_man said: It's pretty clear we wanted NOTHING to do with Randall who was almost cut midseason. ANY value in return was likely seen as a win. We are cutting bait with likely two guys from 2017 that left a sour taste in the staffs mouth: Hundley and Randall. In return we will probably get something like Kizer and a 5th and 6th. It sucks Randall wasn't a better fit, but hoping he was isn't going to make it so. Cut the loss, collect some value, move on. This isn't some landmark roster move... Just because our staff doesn't want them, doesn't mean there wasn't some value around the league. You were able to get draft picks and last year's 2nd round pick from the Browns. Either the Browns have decided Kizer's useless or they actually liked Randall quite a bit. In either instance I would rather have more draft capital than Kizer. This move only makes sense from a changing the culture perspective. If that's the case, I still hate the value, but I don't mind the thought process. If it was anything other than this, we made a terrible decision. Even if it was a change the culture situation, I still think you're better off dealing with Randall's attitude than leaving our CB rotation a bleeding mess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FinneasGage Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 Just now, Leader said: What makes you think OAK is interested in Hundley? I mean, I agree with your comment - if they can get some value out of him great - but has OAK expressed an interest in the past> there was something on twitter about it from a source that ppl were saying had some merit. i dont wanna track down the tweet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leader Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 1 minute ago, HorizontoZenith said: Everybody saying everybody's freaking out about losing Randall really don't get it. It's not losing Randall, it's the compensation. Why add Kizer and not just make it a 3rd round pick? It's stupid compensation. Yeah, he was a favorite of mine. I'm a little bothered by people suddenly acting like he was crap because he wasn't. I wouldn't even be complaining about this right now if the compensation was a receiver or tight end or a safety or a third round pick or literally anything that could help us. You can do a LOT worse than Damarious Randall no matter who your defensive coordinator is. If you're going to get rid of a player who can help you, get a player who can help you or a draft pick high enough to help you. Again - backup QB was a need (IMO at least) and supposedly - those who actually get paid to make these evaluations and decisions - determined that Kizer had more upside than a 4th year Hundley. As for draft picks - we did move up in both the 4th and 5th rounds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexGreen#20 Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 3 minutes ago, HorizontoZenith said: Everybody saying everybody's freaking out about losing Randall really don't get it. It's not losing Randall, it's the compensation. Why add Kizer and not just make it a 3rd round pick? It's stupid compensation. Yeah, he was a favorite of mine. I'm a little bothered by people suddenly acting like he was crap because he wasn't. I wouldn't even be complaining about this right now if the compensation was a receiver or tight end or a safety or a third round pick or literally anything that could help us. You can do a LOT worse than Damarious Randall no matter who your defensive coordinator is. If you're going to get rid of a player who can help you, get a player who can help you or a draft pick high enough to help you. So much this Thank you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
incognito_man Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 2 minutes ago, AlexGreen#20 said: Just because our staff doesn't want them, doesn't mean there wasn't some value around the league. You were able to get draft picks and last year's 2nd round pick from the Browns. Either the Browns have decided Kizer's useless or they actually liked Randall quite a bit. In either instance I would rather have more draft capital than Kizer. This move only makes sense from a changing the culture perspective. If that's the case, I still hate the value, but I don't mind the thought process. If it was anything other than this, we made a terrible decision. Even if it was a change the culture situation, I still think you're better off dealing with Randall's attitude than leaving our CB rotation a bleeding mess. I also think our staff is way way way way way way way way higher on kizer than you are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
green 01 Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 2 minutes ago, jfinley88 said: there was something on twitter about it from a source that ppl were saying had some merit. i dont wanna track down the tweet. John Gruden is interested in every QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deltarich87 Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 3 minutes ago, HorizontoZenith said: Everybody saying everybody's freaking out about losing Randall really don't get it. It's not losing Randall, it's the compensation. Why add Kizer and not just make it a 3rd round pick? It's stupid compensation. Yeah, he was a favorite of mine. I'm a little bothered by people suddenly acting like he was crap because he wasn't. I wouldn't even be complaining about this right now if the compensation was a receiver or tight end or a safety or a third round pick or literally anything that could help us. You can do a LOT worse than Damarious Randall no matter who your defensive coordinator is. If you're going to get rid of a player who can help you, get a player who can help you or a draft pick high enough to help you. Bingo. It's the compensation for Randall that I don't get GB has 12 picks in the draft including multiple in the 4th/5th/6th rds. Go get your development QB with one of those boatloads of picks at that point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leader Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 1 minute ago, jfinley88 said: there was something on twitter about it from a source that ppl were saying had some merit. i dont wanna track down the tweet. Fine with me. Who's backing up in OAK now....Connor Cook (whoever that is.....) and he's under contract until becoming a UFA in 2020. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squire12 Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 Just now, incognito_man said: I also think our staff is way way way way way way way way higher on kizer than you are. They were also higher on Hundley and felt he was more than capable to play some competent QB. Maybe the ability to judge QB talent by MM and some others is lacking. MM was part of the organization that took Alex Smith over Aaron Rodgers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlexGreen#20 Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 Just now, incognito_man said: I also think our staff is way way way way way way way way higher on kizer than you are. Very possible, still think it's a very strange move unless you think Kizer is your QBOTF. Trading away minimally a rotational CB for a Potential improvement at backup QB seems very very strange to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leader Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 2 minutes ago, green 01 said: John Gruden is interested in every QB. Hmmmmm interesting as Gruden called what probably was Hundley's best game - against Pittsburgh. Although - he really stunk the place up (Tampa) developing young QBs. Meaning - he couldnt do it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gopackgonerd Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 4 minutes ago, AlexGreen#20 said: Just because our staff doesn't want them, doesn't mean there wasn't some value around the league. You were able to get draft picks and last year's 2nd round pick from the Browns. Either the Browns have decided Kizer's useless or they actually liked Randall quite a bit. In either instance I would rather have more draft capital than Kizer. This move only makes sense from a changing the culture perspective. If that's the case, I still hate the value, but I don't mind the thought process. If it was anything other than this, we made a terrible decision. Even if it was a change the culture situation, I still think you're better off dealing with Randall's attitude than leaving our CB rotation a bleeding mess. This is where I'm at, if his attitude was bearable was it really worth what we got in return. To me it has to be something in the building that the staff didn't like. On the outside looking in he wasn't nearly as bad as Martellus Bennett. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick_gb Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 1 hour ago, DavidatMIZZOU said: Nobody is pretending that Randall is elite, or anywhere near that level. I thought he was an ascending player. Randall has shown good and bad play, I would argue that he had 1.5 good years and 1.5 bad years. That seems like a serviceable player. He would be a definite contributor on this team, this season. With Kizer, we are hoping that he develops, but never plays. With the current depth chart, we have Lenzy Pipkins as one of our starting CBs. We have now forced our own hand in this draft. We NEED to take at least one CB, and we maybe, hopefully got better at a position everyone hopes never sees the field. I don't like it. I am not going to lose sleep over it. I am not going to make a really hilarious website about it (www.firegute.com). But I will discuss it on a message board. Gute has not earned the benefit of the doubt yet. This is his first move as GM. To like this move, you have to be one heck of a Deshone Kizer fan, absolutely hate Damarious Randall, or are blindly optimistic about everything Green Bay Packers. What hand was forced? Who's to say that the Packers don't have a move lined up for this? Someone in free agency? Someone available via trade? I mean the draft isn't the ONLY way we have to fill this hole. There's Colvin / Johnson / Honey Badger / Sherman etc that could come in on a dime and help shore some things up in that secondary and that doesn't force our hand in the Draft with a move like that. Secondly, I'm optimistic on Kizer. Liked the kid coming out, didn't like the situation he landed in. Thought he had a poor showing last year that made me rethink my evaluation on him but overall I think this is a good trade for both parties involved UNDER these conditions: - Kizer ends up being a quality backup and maybe eventually more then that (trade bait) - The picks we obtained from it are used wisely Add in the fact that the Packers veterans reportedly wanted him outright as he was becoming a "locker room cancer" and I'm not going to hate on the trade. The kid had as much off days as he had days that he was on. I'm just not going to talk in all caps and talk about how **** this is before the facts are out there and the fact is we wont know how good or bad of a trade this turns out to be for another 2-3 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
squire12 Posted March 10, 2018 Share Posted March 10, 2018 2 minutes ago, deltarich87 said: Bingo. It's the compensation for Randall that I don't get GB has 12 picks in the draft including multiple in the 4th/5th/6th rds. Go get your development QB with one of those boatloads of picks at that point. Agree on this. A mid round QB is only 1 year younger than Kizer. GB would have that for 4 years vs 3 years with Kizer. If Kizer never sees meaningful regular season snaps in the next few years, why would another NFL team trade for someone whose only action looked like trash? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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