Who do you choose at 4? (No trade down option)

[BleedTheClock]

21 minutes ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said:

Unreal success?  He was 4th in the Big 10 in rushing yards and 9th in ypc.  In the CONFERENCE.

People DID stop Barkley though, he only had 4 100 yard rushing games all last season.

Yall act like he was some unstoppable force, but he really wasn’t.

He was the best player on the field every single week. He was in the heisman discussion behind a terrible OL. He won outside of just receiving traditional carries. He was dynamite in the passing game and was an elite return man as well. He's more than just a traditional runningback. And consider this: If we draft him, he's going to be playing against non-loaded boxes because we actually have some receiving threats to work with. Penn State was a 1-man team last season. Teams geared up to shut him down and he still had significant success and made big plays in literally every game he played in.

I have no clue what to tell the 1% of the football watching population that watch Barkley and don't see why he's so special. He's literally #1 or #2 on every respected scout's board. He's regarded by most as the best RB prospect since Adrian Peterson. He's dominated CFB since he was a freshman. He's got elite intangibles and is an incredible leader. There are really no holes to poke in his game other than the fact that he apparently doesn't run between the tackles for 2-3 yard gains all game long.

[Aztec Hammer]

8 minutes ago, BleedTheClock said:

He was the best player on the field every single week. He was in the heisman discussion behind a terrible OL. He won outside of just receiving traditional carries. He was dynamite in the passing game and was an elite return man as well. He's more than just a traditional runningback. And consider this: If we draft him, he's going to be playing against non-loaded boxes because we actually have some receiving threats to work with. Penn State was a 1-man team last season. Teams geared up to shut him down and he still had significant success and made big plays in literally every game he played in.

I have no clue what to tell the 1% of the football watching population that watch Barkley and don't see why he's so special. He's literally #1 or #2 on every respected scout's board. He's regarded by most as the best RB prospect since Adrian Peterson. He's dominated CFB since he was a freshman. He's got elite intangibles and is an incredible leader. There are really no holes to poke in his game other than the fact that he apparently doesn't run between the tackles for 2-3 yard gains all game long.

Well there are some holes to poke in his game. He doesn't run with power consistently and hasn't shown a consistent ability to slam it down the middle. I've seen him display power at times and some tough running straight down the teeth of the defense but it's not a hallmark of his game yet. He also has developed some bad habits when it comes to taking what the defense gives him, which sometimes is what you just have to do. The Ohio State game for example, he nearly safetied himself because he turned and tried to run backwards instead of just sticking it up the gut and plowing for a few yards.

These aren't prospect destroying holes, but they are holes. He's not perfect.

I still want him at 4 if we draft there.

[buno67]

The beauty of Barkley is you can’t take him out of a game. He has the ability to make an impact in different areas. Yeah running the ball vs tOSU was impossible because of his OL but his return ability completely changed the game. One, he scored a TD, two, he completely changed the kickoff scheme for tOSU, which gave PSU great position all night. Also those games he didn’t rush for 100yarda, how many yards did he have receiving?

barkley just isn’t the best RB, he is the best playmaker/weapon. 

[Aztec Hammer]

Only 21 as well. I'd take a decade out of him.

For as much talk as there is of the short shelf life for RBs, ten years of game changing an elite back would be well worth it. LT is a decent comparison for him. LT carried it almost 300 times more than Barkley in college and entered the league a year older. He managed 8 big years with SD, then another almost 1000 yard season with the Jets two years later.

I think we could get somewhere close to ten years out of Barkley.

[Dawgpoun8017]

1 minute ago, Aztec Hammer said:

Only 21 as well. I'd take a decade out of him.

For as much talk as there is of the short shelf life for RBs, ten years of game changing an elite back would be well worth it. LT is a decent comparison for him. LT carried it almost 300 times more than Barkley in college and entered the league a year older. He managed 8 big years with SD, then another almost 1000 yard season with the Jets two years later.

I think we could get somewhere close to ten years out of Barkley.

LT is the comparison for Barkley except Barkley is bigger

[BleedTheClock]

I'd recommend more people that question Barkley's power to go watch his Freshman year stuff. He ran between the tackles a lot more and was still beasting teams. He doesn't run over anyone Fournette-style, but he's certainly not apprehensive to run inside when that's where the hole opens up. I think as he got more comfortable with his vision and instincts, he began to bounce outside more and more. But there is plenty of tape of him running between the tackles and just getting those tough yards.

[Dawgpoun8017]

Just now, BleedTheClock said:

I'd recommend more people that question Barkley's power to go watch his Freshman year stuff. He ran between the tackles a lot more and was still beasting teams. He doesn't run over anyone Fournette-style, but he's certainly not apprehensive to run inside when that's where the hole opens up. I think as he got more comfortable with his vision and instincts, he began to bounce outside more and more. But there is plenty of tape of him running between the tackles and just getting those tough yards.

I like the way he runs more than a punishing run you over back honestly... sure we all like to see defenders get trucked but if you look at someone like shady he has made a career of making big plays without taking the big punishing hits that some of those bigger run you over backs have taken, same with Marshall Faulk he knew how to avoid those big hits, and I think Barkley does the same thing. Most backs cannot make the kinds of cuts that he can. He can keep defenders on skates at any time 

[LETSGOBROWNIES]

58 minutes ago, BleedTheClock said:

I have no clue what to tell the 1% of the football watching population that watch Barkley and don't see why he's so special. He's literally #1 or #2 on every respected scout's board.

Appeal to popularity doesn’t make it a fact. Go back and check those same scouts though on Richardson, McFadden, Carter, etc.

And, if we need other folks opinions to validate our own, Scot McCloughan obviously wasn’t in love with Barkley either when he said Guice was a better prospect. For whatever that’s worth....

58 minutes ago, BleedTheClock said:

He's regarded by most as the best RB prospect since Adrian Peterson.

So was Fournette.....and Zeke....and Gurley...and..... people say this every year.  And then they say “No but really this guy is the best!”.  Almost every year.  

58 minutes ago, BleedTheClock said:

He's dominated CFB since he was a freshman.

1000 yards and 7 TD’s at a sub 6 ypc is dominating CFB now? Bruh...

58 minutes ago, BleedTheClock said:

He's got elite intangibles and is an incredible leader.

No argument here.

58 minutes ago, BleedTheClock said:

There are really no holes to poke in his game other than the fact that he apparently doesn't run between the tackles for 2-3 yard gains all game long.

If you want to be obtuse feel free, but you’re not making much of a point.  Barkley’s greatest success came from being bigger, stronger, faster and quicker than everyone else most weeks.  Backs don’t consistently turn the corner in the NFL, they need to be able to make their money between the tackles and turn what should be a 2 yard gain into a 4 yard gain, a 5 yard gain into a 7, etc.  No one is saying he can’t do those things, simply that he didn’t all that often and certainly not at an “elite” level.

He has not shown an ability to put his team on his back and grind out 125, 150, 200 yards week in, week out.

[LETSGOBROWNIES]

1 hour ago, Aztec Hammer said:

Yeah it's an interesting one. I don't think he's the perfect prospect he is made out to be, but there's no doubt he has a number of really special abilities.

Agree 100%.

1 hour ago, Aztec Hammer said:

I remember watching a few of his games live last season. He fell into a bit of a trend for the 0, -1, 3, 0, 1, 4, 42 type line. Northwestern comes to mind. He was being stoned constantly. To the point where it would be easy to feel a bit underwhelmed by him. At one stage my eyes were even telling me that his burst off the snap didn't look great. Then he broke a beautiful 40 yard or so TD run where he made a lateral cut that I swear 95% of backs can't make. It was ridiculous. This pattern happened over the span of a few games. I remember it because they were hyping him for Heisman still as he was getting TDs elsewhere from returns and passes. But it gave me some pause rather than just declaring him the GOAT RB prospect.

THIS is my issue.  It’s not just about total yards or even ypc, but rushing efficiency.

 

[matt27j]

Reminds me of LT as well, and I think he'd be best off shedding some pounds. He can still run inside at 223 but shedding 10 pounds would give him even more speed and quickness. Then you could be watching a truly special player. 

[MistaBohmbastic]

46 minutes ago, matt27j said:

Reminds me of LT as well, and I think he'd be best off shedding some pounds. He can still run inside at 223 but shedding 10 pounds would give him even more speed and quickness. Then you could be watching a truly special player. 

I don't know man, if you don't think he's all that quick right now go back and watch his film and check his combine numbers. That's why he's so special. He can pack a punch with his size, and he moves as great as anyone.

[pnies20]

4 hours ago, matt27j said:

Reminds me of LT as well, and I think he'd be best off shedding some pounds. He can still run inside at 223 but shedding 10 pounds would give him even more speed and quickness. Then you could be watching a truly special player. 

I remember thinking "oh he stumbled a little bit" on his second forty coming out of the blocks and he still ran a 4.4 flat. He's fine where he's at and the 4.4 translates to his game tape.

[buno67]

12 hours ago, matt27j said:

Reminds me of LT as well, and I think he'd be best off shedding some pounds. He can still run inside at 223 but shedding 10 pounds would give him even more speed and quickness. Then you could be watching a truly special player. 

I don’t know, like other said he didn’t look any bigger from his film and the dude put up some amazing numbers at the combine. To me his playing weight should be around 225-230. Not for speed or quickness but to handle the grind and pounding you take being a NFL RB. 

[buno67]

12 hours ago, LETSGOBROWNIES said:

Appeal to popularity doesn’t make it a fact. Go back and check those same scouts though on Richardson, McFadden, Carter, etc.

And, if we need other folks opinions to validate our own, Scot McCloughan obviously wasn’t in love with Barkley either when he said Guice was a better prospect. For whatever that’s worth....

So was Fournette.....and Zeke....and Gurley...and..... people say this every year.  And then they say “No but really this guy is the best!”.  Almost every year.  

1000 yards and 7 TD’s at a sub 6 ypc is dominating CFB now? Bruh...

No argument here.

If you want to be obtuse feel free, but you’re not making much of a point.  Barkley’s greatest success came from being bigger, stronger, faster and quicker than everyone else most weeks.  Backs don’t consistently turn the corner in the NFL, they need to be able to make their money between the tackles and turn what should be a 2 yard gain into a 4 yard gain, a 5 yard gain into a 7, etc.  No one is saying he can’t do those things, simply that he didn’t all that often and certainly not at an “elite” level.

He has not shown an ability to put his team on his back and grind out 125, 150, 200 yards week in, week out.

Like you say, he has not shown the ability to put his team on his back and grind. That is not on his shoulders tho. That’s all on franklin. He ran Barkley close to 200 times but also ran his QB 150 times. Franklin has a bell cow and treated him like a donkey. iMO Franklin greatly misused Barkley. He knew it would be his last season with Barkley so he should of adopted the offense around him but he didn’t. You look at some of the other top backs, their offense games was built around them, at PSU Franklin didn’t do that. He stuck with McSorley way to much, specially in the run game. 

[brownie man]

I'm ready for Chubb

I really like Ward but this is a deep DB class we can get a slighlty less rated corner at 33

I love Barkley but we can get a stud at 35

we're not getting a player of Chubb's Caliber in the 2nd