Skinsin2013 Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 On 2/6/2019 at 2:44 PM, turtle28 said: Pretty sure, Wall has been dealing with a heel issue on and off for a few years. At least that’s what Scott Brooks said, and they finally decided to have surgery on the heal. I don’t think that’s a “character issue,” that’s a medical issue. The wizards organization has handled Wall’s injuries wrong IMO for years. He should’ve have never been allowed to play an entire season on two bad knees 3 years ago - both which requires offseason surgery two years ago - or on a bad heel the last two years. You damn well know what I mean. Showing up FAT to camp is a character issues, especially for a guy with bones spurs in his heal. Wall looked like he had just smoked a huge bowl, and spent three days at the Sizzler buffet, when he showed up to the USA camp. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinsin2013 Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 (edited) On 2/6/2019 at 10:11 PM, turtle28 said: What's not to love about this trade? The Wizards unloaded an awful Otto Porter contract for two starting caliber bigs who both average the same amount as Otto! Parker: 14 pts, 6 rebs Portis: 14 pts, 7 rebs And while Parker has battled injuries, he and Portis are only 23. Parker is definitely gone after this year. See his contract. Portis will want too much $$$... read $16M? This trade was to free up money to extend Sato and Bryant. So, ultimately, the Wiz lose Otto, Parker, and Portis.... all three. Edited February 8, 2019 by Skinsin2013 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeT14 Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 Isn't Portis a RFA? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slateman Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 On 2/6/2019 at 10:11 PM, turtle28 said: What's not to love about this trade? The Wizards unloaded an awful Otto Porter contract for two starting caliber bigs who both average the same amount as Otto! Parker: 14 pts, 6 rebs Portis: 14 pts, 7 rebs And while Parker has battled injuries, he and Portis are only 23. 3 hours ago, Skinsin2013 said: Parker is definitely gone after this year. See his contract. Portis will want too much $$$... read $16M? This trade was to free up money to extend Sato and Bryant. So, ultimately, the Wiz lose Otto, Parker, and Portis.... all three. The Wizards have effectively unloaded Porter to get under the luxury tax this season. It's going to cost a ton to keep either one long term. Honestly, it wasn't like Porter's contract was crippling. He's definitely gone after the next two seasons, and maybe even after next season if he opts out. The Wizards certainly aren't going to be competitive next season without Wall. So I mean, if you want to take another shot at Durant if he opts out, sure. Other than that, this is a move to basically save Leonsis from having to pay the 2 million penalty. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woz Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 (edited) 8 hours ago, turtle28 said: And, you clearly don't watch the Wizards, you've admitted this and it's been evident since you've started commenting on them when they first started getting good 5 years ago Bolded is only true relative to where they were before. On an absolute scale, they're mediocre-to-decent. 8 hours ago, turtle28 said: Dekker has played well since we traded for him, if you watched the Wizards, you’d know that. I have no idea what Harden said about him 3 or so years ago, it's irrelevant to today. Was talking about Wesley Johnson, not Dekker. You know, the guy who you were rending your garments and gnashing your teeth about taking away minutes from Brown? Since you obviously missed the reference (how, I'm not sure, even I knew about this), here you go: That guy? That's who you are worried will be taking minutes from Brown? Let's try to clear this up - focusing solely on forwards, here are the transactions, per ESPN: http://www.espn.com/nba/team/transactions/_/name/wsh/season/2019 February 6, 2018 - Washington trades Otto Porter Jr. to Chicago for Bobby Portis, Jabari Parker, and a 2023 2nd round pick Under contract: Markieff Morris, Trevor Ariza, Jeff Green, Bobby Portis, Jabari Parker, Sam Dekker, Troy Brown Jr. TOTAL = 7 February 6, 2018 - Washington trades Markieff Morris (and a 2023 2nd round pick) to New Orleans for Wesley Johnson Under contract: Trevor Ariza, Jeff Green, Bobby Portis, Jabari Parker, Sam Dekker, Wesley Johnson, Troy Brown Jr TOTAL = 7 If as you say Sam Dekker is realistically playing more of the 4, then the addition of both Portis and Parker will eat into his time. This means Washington can either leave him 7th or 8th off the bench, or they can slide him into the 3 (limiting Brown's time on the court). Thus, the additions of Portis and Parker have more a chance of eating into his time than the addition of a Wesley Johnson. Think of it this way, had the Wizards not traded Morris, they would have had three pure power forwards (Morris, Portis, and Parker), two pure small forwards (Ariza and Green), a switch forward (per you, Dekker), and Brown. What would be more likely, Dekker being the fourth PF off the bench or being the third SF off the bench? Also, if Johnson does eat into Brown's minutes, then yes that's an even bigger problem since it means the coaching staff and/or front office cannot figure out how to utilize one of their only remaining two healthy first round picks of the past decade. Edited February 8, 2019 by Woz Fixed the janky editing Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woz Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 8 hours ago, turtle28 said: Every wizards fan wants them to think about the future now and get a lottery pick, not try to make the playoffs. At best the Wizards are an 8 seed & a one and done playoff series team. There's no point in making the playoffs, might as well play guys like Troy Brown over the older vets bc he's the future, they aren't. Huh ... so for all my "not watching this team for five years," I still projected them correctly the last two years as the bolded. But I know nothing about the Wizards ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woz Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 6 hours ago, turtle28 said: So, the Wizards traded a 2023 2nd round pick in the Morris trade, not next years 2nd round pick. https://www.prosportstransactions.com/basketball/DraftTrades/Future/Wizards.htm Yes, the 2019 2nd round pick was traded away in 2016 for Kelly Oubre. Or do you mean the 2020 2nd round pick? That one was traded away in two parts: first, in 2015, for Jared Dudley (it was top 45 protected) and then in exchange for cash to have the Bucks take Jodie Meeks (that was the "draft compensation" was I mentioned on page 83 ... it removed the protected status altogether) The short version is: as it stands today, the Wizards will not have a 2nd round pick until 2024 at the earliest (well, it's possible they will have their 2023 pick as it is top 36 protected and is apparently dependent on the Bulls draft position (I guess in 2019?, but it isn't clear)). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woz Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 5 hours ago, Skinsin2013 said: All the Wiz did was remove Otto to create cap space to remain a fence-sitter. That's it. That's the plan. This team is royally screwed for the next FIVE years. But I've been saying that since that contract was signed. But they won't have to pay as much salary tax penalty! ... oh wait ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woz Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 5 hours ago, Skinsin2013 said: Which means we wasted, what, the 15th pick? And the 2019 2nd round pick. But wait, they want to re-sign Ariza! At 34 years old ... oh ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woz Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 5 hours ago, Skinsin2013 said: Portis will want too much $$$... read $16M? Well, that's nice, but the Wizards can keep him if they tender him a RFA contract at $3.6M this coming year. So, they'll get 16-18 months of Portis. Then he walks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woz Posted February 8, 2019 Share Posted February 8, 2019 1 hour ago, Slateman said: So I mean, if you want to take another shot at Durant if he opts out, sure. Other than that, this is a move to basically save Leonsis from having to pay the 2 million penalty. While there was a teeny tiny chance Durant came to DC in 2015, there is a negative chance that he comes to DC in 2019. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turtle28 Posted February 9, 2019 Author Share Posted February 9, 2019 10 hours ago, Skinsin2013 said: And now Ariza can walk for nothing after the year. Which means we got NOTHING back for Oubre. Which means we wasted, what, the 15th pick? Exactly! So dumb! Of course no one has a crystal ball but trading Oubre looks really dumb now. Of course... Someone has been saying they needed to trade Porter all year. If they had traded Otto - like they could have - w/ Keef’s & Jason Smith’s expiring contracts in the offseason then, they could be re-signing Oubre in July for the rebuild. The trio of Wall-Beal-Otto had maxed out w/ the 2nd round of the playoffs especially w/ the Eastern Conference getting better the last two years. Otto regressed as a 3-pt shooter the last two years and didn’t take the next step in his development like I expected him to - still not sure why - it was time to move on last summer for those handful of teams which wanted him the previous offseason when he signed the max deal. Ernie screwed it all up and continued to by not trading Ariza and Green for young developing players the last two days. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turtle28 Posted February 9, 2019 Author Share Posted February 9, 2019 (edited) 11 hours ago, MikeT14 said: Isn't Portis a RFA? Yes. They’ll keep him. It’s Parker who they’ll decline his $20 million qualifying offer. Hopefully he plays well and they can sign him to something cheaper, but they'll probably lose him. Portis was 7/8 (2/3 from 3) with 18 points in his first half as a Wizard. Parker with 8 rebs & 7 assists. Edited February 9, 2019 by turtle28 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinsin2013 Posted February 9, 2019 Share Posted February 9, 2019 Otto needed a change of scenery. And he's on a team that is positioned better than the Wiz to start to build up out the next few years. Oubre was ***. I know folks only like to chat about PPGs. But he's an awful defender. Last night he scored 25 points and was a -29. Some of that is who you play with. But he's consistently been a minus player. My conspiracy theory is the following - We've heard quite a few quotes from Ted and Beal about not tanking and trying to make the playoffs. I think Beal told Ernie/Ted that he'll stick with this team SO LONG AS THEY ARE COMPETITIVE. So that set Ernie's marching orders. And that's why we are where we are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turtle28 Posted February 9, 2019 Author Share Posted February 9, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, Skinsin2013 said: Otto needed a change of scenery. And he's on a team that is positioned better than the Wiz to start to build up out the next few years. Oubre was ***. I know folks only like to chat about PPGs. But he's an awful defender. Last night he scored 25 points and was a -29. Some of that is who you play with. But he's consistently been a minus player. My conspiracy theory is the following - We've heard quite a few quotes from Ted and Beal about not tanking and trying to make the playoffs. I think Beal told Ernie/Ted that he'll stick with this team SO LONG AS THEY ARE COMPETITIVE. So that set Ernie's marching orders. And that's why we are where we are. Otto needed to not be a 3rd piece, he wasn't aggressive enough on the offensive end for the role. As the #2 option on a team, he'll get more shots just bc he's the 2nd option and put up more points, but that doesn't necessarily mean the Bulls will win more games. The thing with Oubre is we can't forget how young he is, he just turned 23. He a still developing and improving his IQ as a basketball ball player. He’s only going to get better. I would have loved to have him and Portis together for the long term with Beal. Having two guys from the 1st round of 2015 draft to develop would've been nice. I definitely agree with your conspiracy theory. Beal wasn't going to stay on a rebuilding team that was tanking, I totally agree he said I won't ask for a trade as long as you get pieces we can build with in any trade you make. Edited February 9, 2019 by turtle28 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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