Forge Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 1 minute ago, 757-NINER said: @NinerNation21 Because Burns is the better player. His tape is better for one. And Sweat doesn't play to his athletic measurables. His film is just ok. I think he benefited greatly from Simmons just being a absolute wreaking ball inside. His bust potential is jus too high for me. I wouldn't hate him if we traded down and all of the other edge guye were gone. But for me, I'd take Burns and Ferrell over him easily. As long as you are applying these things equally, that's fine. If you're dinging Sweat for Simmons, you need to be dinging Ferrell for playing on one of the most stacked defensive lines we've seen. I don't agree at all about the bust potential somehow being higher on Sweat. Burns has weight problems and shows absolutely not evidence of converting speed to power, which is problematic at the next level. Better college pass rusher than sweat? No doubt. Translating better to the NFL game? Maybe....that could be heavily influenced by situation. But Burns has a big bust out rate in my opinion as well. I agree that he doesn't quite play up to the athletic measurables. I was blown out of the water when he hit those numbers at the combine (the 3 cone was about what I expected). His tape doesn't have uber explosive impressive plays and he does get taken out for far too long a period of time sometimes, but they both have that. Sweat was largely contained by Risner (though he did get a sack in that game, I don't really fault Risner), while Burns got largely man handled by Scharping when they played NIU. Sweat is a high motor guy, which I like Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sherm Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 38 minutes ago, J-ALL-DAY said: Didn't know who to trust as in which evaluations to trust or they think they have scouts leaking stuff out? My guess would be leaks at thus point. All the evaluating is done. If it is just them 2 they know who the leak came from. I can see the logic in that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justone2 Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 59 minutes ago, Forge said: One day people will have to explain the Joe Jackson love to me. He's a lock day 3 prospect to me. One guy in the draft forum is convinced he'll be the best to come out of this class. He's not nearly as athletic as people make him out to be, his production was meh with major consistency problems, he's super raw with regards to technique, etc. I just don't know why people love him that much. To me he is behind a few guys but really to me its the effort he puts in every single play. Besides that i think he is close to or a elite level athlete. His consistency to see comes from his technique which i believe is more fixable than say power is for Burns. For the production he had 12 sacks, 11 hits and 31 hurries which is better than Sweat and Polite and on the same level as Ferrell. Besides that he already is a better run defender than most of the guys in front of him which will get him on the field while he works on refining his technique. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forge Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 2 minutes ago, Justone2 said: To me he is behind a few guys but really to me its the effort he puts in every single play. Besides that i think he is close to or a elite level athlete. His consistency to see comes from his technique which i believe is more fixable than say power is for Burns. For the production he had 12 sacks, 11 hits and 31 hurries which is better than Sweat and Polite and on the same level as Ferrell. I'm not sure where you are getting that production level for Jackson. I show 8-9 sacks depending on where you go (college stats are notoriously inaccurate), whereas most places credit Sweat with 12 sacks or there about last year (weirdly, espn has 8.5, not sure where that figure comes from, its unsubstantiated by any other source I can find) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justone2 Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 1 minute ago, Forge said: I'm not sure where you are getting that production level for Jackson. I show 8-9 sacks depending on where you go (college stats are notoriously inaccurate), whereas most places credit Sweat with 12 sacks or there about last year (weirdly, espn has 8.5, not sure where that figure comes from, its unsubstantiated by any other source I can find) Got them from PFF. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forge Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 Just now, Justone2 said: Got them from PFF. Yeah, don't see that supported anywhere else. Hurries and the like are subject stats, so I won't call them out on that, but the sack total appears to definitely be wrong based on every other data source tracking college stats. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N4L Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 54 minutes ago, Forge said: I don't think that's a mess...a little rampant paranoia, maybe, but do what you've got to do, I suppose. This means whatever Raider leaks have come out recently are true. They must have a reason to suspect a leak. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrissooner49er Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 59 minutes ago, P_locniners said: I would take that Raiders trade, dropping two spots while picking up an extra 1 and re-coup next years two. Still coming away with a great talent. Though the Giants trade would justify taking a Ferrell, Sweat or Burns a bit more Not only that, but the next 2 picks given by the Raiduhs are each higher than the next 2 offered by the Giants. So, while a 2020 1st would be nice, I would go for the here-and-now benefits inherent in that offer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrissooner49er Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 @Justone2 and @Forge : Joe Jackson had 9 sacks, 14.5 TFL in '18, 6.5 and 11.5 in '17. Montez Sweat had 11.5 sacks, 14 TFL in '18, 10.5 and 15.5 in '17. Per my Athlon Sports NFL Draft 2019 guide. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forge Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 1 minute ago, Chrissooner49er said: @Justone2 and @Forge : Joe Jackson had 9 sacks, 14.5 TFL in '18, 6.5 and 11.5 in '17. Montez Sweat had 11.5 sacks, 14 TFL in '18, 10.5 and 15.5 in '17. Per my Athlon Sports NFL Draft 2019 guide. And these are the figures that I mostly come around. I think college reference has sweat with 12 sacks which is a minor difference. LIS, ESPN has him with 8.5, not sure where that is coming from at all...just seems massively off compared to the data points everywhere else. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justone2 Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 4 minutes ago, Chrissooner49er said: @Justone2 and @Forge : Joe Jackson had 9 sacks, 14.5 TFL in '18, 6.5 and 11.5 in '17. Montez Sweat had 11.5 sacks, 14 TFL in '18, 10.5 and 15.5 in '17. Per my Athlon Sports NFL Draft 2019 guide. Really i am not saying at this point Sweat is a better player than Jackson is. I just when i have the choice between Sweat in the top 10 and Jackson in the 3rd i go with Jackson. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chrissooner49er Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 1 minute ago, Justone2 said: Really i am not saying at this point Sweat is a better player than Jackson is. I just when i have the choice between Sweat in the top 10 and Jackson in the 3rd i go with Jackson. No, neither am I. I just happened to have that information and chose to share it. No worries. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justone2 Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 4 minutes ago, Forge said: And these are the figures that I mostly come around. I think college reference has sweat with 12 sacks which is a minor difference. LIS, ESPN has him with 8.5, not sure where that is coming from at all...just seems massively off compared to the data points everywhere else. No idea where PFF got the 12 from but even with the 9 that shows on most places. Look i don't say draft Jackson before Sweat because Sweat is the better player at this point. I just don''t think the difference between the two is two rounds. Sweat to me is a bottom of the first top of the second type of guy who will get overdrafted because of the combine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
49erurtaza Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
49erurtaza Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 https://www.google.com/amp/s/247sports.com/nfl/san-francisco-49ers/ContentGallery/San-Francisco-49ers-2019-NFL-predraft-visits-Hakeem-Butler-Jalen-Hurd-130617371/Amp/ Take this how ever you will. But we have only meet with one other interior Dline prospect besides QW who we brought in for top 30 visit. Where at DE we have met with basically all of the top Edge rushers and brought all of them in on visit including Bosa. Idk how to take it as nothing or something. Could be QW will be pick at 2 with us trading up drafting edge at 34. Or since QW is just one top players they just met, but are looking hard at Edge. Or could be nothing lol. And I know McG never meet with us outside of combine interview. But they had no questions off the field or on about him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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