big_palooka Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 10 hours ago, Rich7sena said: I'm almost 100% certain they go Bosa. He's a tier above everyone else and I view him as being better than his brother. They can figure something else out at left tackle through FA, a trade, or if another guy emerges at the top of the second round. They can't pass up on Bosa if they "win" the pick. Also, teams can start 2 defensive ends. I 100% agree. This just makes me laugh, because when I've said this about passing on James for Miller, I get flack. It's almost like taking the best player available is the smartest approach to the draft? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big_palooka Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 Assuming the Raiders stay at #2 and Bosa goes to AZ at 1, I'd favor trading down. They just drafted Hall round 2 and Hurst who looks like a player. So drafting Williams/Oliver would be a luxury pick IMO. And I don't see value at #2 overall on any other edge players. Dropping back, picking up some additional picks and getting Allen, Ferrell, Burns at better value would be ideal. I'm going full Sashi on this draft. Load up and shotgun the roster with picks with a better chance of landing players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RaidersAreOne Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 Knowing us, we'd probably trade from #2 to #14 for a 2020 3rd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich7sena Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 4 hours ago, big_palooka said: I 100% agree. This just makes me laugh, because when I've said this about passing on James for Miller, I get flack. It's almost like taking the best player available is the smartest approach to the draft? It's not really the same thing. First, the Cardinals are at first overall and the Raiders were at 10 and traded back to 15. This matters because the Cardinals could have their pick of literally anyone and the Raiders only had limited options of probably similarly graded players on their board. As much as we like to pretend we know who is where on any given team's board, we don't know. Second, both defensive end and tackle are generally considered premium positions and safety is not. Let's say Deionte Thompson was considered to be as good a prospect as Bosa, then I could definitely see Arizona taking Williams over Thompson, and they probably should if they already didn't have a solution at the position. It's important to realize that James is not only on an already established defense, but he's also a part of an already established team with a very good offense. Bad teams usually have problems at the most important positions (QB, tackle, pass rush, corner) and it behooves them to get those positions squared away as soon as possible or to make those position groups among the league's best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NCOUGHMAN Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 44 minutes ago, Rich7sena said: It's not really the same thing. First, the Cardinals are at first overall and the Raiders were at 10 and traded back to 15. This matters because the Cardinals could have their pick of literally anyone and the Raiders only had limited options of probably similarly graded players on their board. As much as we like to pretend we know who is where on any given team's board, we don't know. Second, both defensive end and tackle are generally considered premium positions and safety is not. Let's say Deionte Thompson was considered to be as good a prospect as Bosa, then I could definitely see Arizona taking Williams over Thompson, and they probably should if they already didn't have a solution at the position. It's important to realize that James is not only on an already established defense, but he's also a part of an already established team with a very good offense. Bad teams usually have problems at the most important positions (QB, tackle, pass rush, corner) and it behooves them to get those positions squared away as soon as possible or to make those position groups among the league's best. We traded down last year it and still had Derwin and Edmonds the on right in our laps. So it’s possible to trade down and still get “your guy” depending on supply and demand. some players are just so good it doesn’t matter where they play or who they play with just like Mack did here. derwin is special I think he’ll be a better overall player than Ramses when it’s all said and done Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big_palooka Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 41 minutes ago, Rich7sena said: Second, both defensive end and tackle are generally considered premium positions and safety is not. And this is a real problem because guys like James continue to be undervalued despite what they are bringing to the field. And I get the whole argument for taking a tackle. The problem is, that tackle was Kolton Miller, who wasn't a good tackle in college and drafted on athletic traits and potential over actual skill and technique. Raiders would have taken McGlinchey if the 9ers didn't. I'd have felt underwhelmed about it because but at least McGlinchey looked the part and had the technique to say he can be a player for years. Kolton Miller is SOOOOO bad. He fooled everyone when KO was playing healthy. Then got the excuse for being nicked up. Now is healthy and looks poor. Bad feet, bad hands, false steps, putting his head down... just a complete mess out there for week 14. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NCOUGHMAN Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 3 hours ago, big_palooka said: Assuming the Raiders stay at #2 and Bosa goes to AZ at 1, I'd favor trading down. They just drafted Hall round 2 and Hurst who looks like a player. So drafting Williams/Oliver would be a luxury pick IMO. And I don't see value at #2 overall on any other edge players. Dropping back, picking up some additional picks and getting Allen, Ferrell, Burns at better value would be ideal. I'm going full Sashi on this draft. Load up and shotgun the roster with picks with a better chance of landing players. Been saying that this draft imo is really deep and we have tons of holes to fill. No player except imo Josh Allen has a similar player that can be found later for example you miss on devin white you can still get pratt deonte vs Rapp from wash williams bama ot - Dillard ot wash st etc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich7sena Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 4 hours ago, NCOUGHMAN said: We traded down last year it and still had Derwin and Edmonds the on right in our laps. So it’s possible to trade down and still get “your guy” depending on supply and demand. some players are just so good it doesn’t matter where they play or who they play with just like Mack did here. derwin is special I think he’ll be a better overall player than Ramses when it’s all said and done But the Raiders' "guy" was Kolton Miller. It's apparent that the Raiders didn't grade James as high as you did. I also didn't have James as high as others did, but I would have preferred James over Miller based on my own evaluation, not theirs. I ended up having James graded as a linebacker and not a safety because I think his value increases the closer he is to the line of scrimmage. Honestly, I think the Raiders would be wasting much of James' talents if they played him like a traditional 2-high safety. The Chargers had a plan for him, or at least they accommodated the defense to have him do what he does best. 4 hours ago, big_palooka said: And this is a real problem because guys like James continue to be undervalued despite what they are bringing to the field. And I get the whole argument for taking a tackle. The problem is, that tackle was Kolton Miller, who wasn't a good tackle in college and drafted on athletic traits and potential over actual skill and technique. Raiders would have taken McGlinchey if the 9ers didn't. I'd have felt underwhelmed about it because but at least McGlinchey looked the part and had the technique to say he can be a player for years. Kolton Miller is SOOOOO bad. He fooled everyone when KO was playing healthy. Then got the excuse for being nicked up. Now is healthy and looks poor. Bad feet, bad hands, false steps, putting his head down... just a complete mess out there for week 14. Osemele didn't really contribute to when Miller played well during this season--at least from what the film shows. Miller's problems last week was Hubbard's speed and hand rip, and I think Dunlap also beat him fairly clean; it was just not Miller's day. Miller mostly gets no help and while he hasn't played as well as he needs to moving forward, he has had full games and stretches of games where you can clearly see what the Raiders saw in him as a prospect. I'm more concerned about Parker's ability to turn it around. I'm normally the patient type when it comes to prospects but I don't think the team can go into the season with him as the presumptive starter at right tackle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big_palooka Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 Drafting Parker and moving him to the right side made no sense in the first place. He's a pure LT and they overdrafted him and sent him to the right spot. Parker IMO would look the same as Miller on the left side. I honestly think Parker is more of a natural LT and Miller a RT, but what do I know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NJ Raider Posted December 17, 2018 Share Posted December 17, 2018 Was just watching some Ed Oliver clips and I think he looks smaller than hall and hurst. I’m not saying this is the right idea, but do you think he could move to end? Seems plenty quick and athletic enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Humble_Beast Posted December 17, 2018 Author Share Posted December 17, 2018 1 hour ago, big_palooka said: Drafting Parker and moving him to the right side made no sense in the first place. He's a pure LT and they overdrafted him and sent him to the right spot. Parker IMO would look the same as Miller on the left side. I honestly think Parker is more of a natural LT and Miller a RT, but what do I know. okay downer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich7sena Posted December 18, 2018 Share Posted December 18, 2018 18 minutes ago, Humble_Beast said: next to nothing.. your just the local 10 year in community college student , who likes to bash the Raiders and Gruden... Seems unnecessary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Humble_Beast Posted December 18, 2018 Author Share Posted December 18, 2018 Just now, Rich7sena said: Seems unnecessary. he always gets away just calling people names without any punishment..... never adding anything to discussions Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big_palooka Posted December 18, 2018 Share Posted December 18, 2018 1 hour ago, Humble_Beast said: okay downer Reported Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
big_palooka Posted December 18, 2018 Share Posted December 18, 2018 40 minutes ago, Humble_Beast said: he always gets away just calling people names without any punishment..... never adding anything to discussions Would it help if I make a bunch of lists that people can just scroll past instead? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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