sunnygsm Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 1 minute ago, Blackstar12 said: I still don't get how survived Sam survived he was laying there staring at Jon as he was about to mauled to death. Is there any other character that cheated death more than him on the show? That genuinely felt like a strong moment to kill Sam. Jon sees him and consciously chooses to leave him because the stakes are so high. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr LBC Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 9 minutes ago, Calvert28 said: He's not wrong in the sense that every other person in that episode, dragons included managed to get stabbed wounded and or killed and yet the Wights seemed to miss the good guys most of the time. Outside of a couple of deaths, Arya hit her head which wasn't even the doing of a Wight and seemed that was the only wound she sustained. It may not (and to my memory in several cases is not) be as big a recurring theme in the canon lit, but in the show canon it's been pretty consistent that pretty much every significant character who dies dies when people don't expect it (i.e. not in combat, because people would be expecting that). These characters (especially the ones the audience are built up to care about) die very consistently when it's able to create the biggest shock value. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ragnarok Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 1 hour ago, Calvert28 said: Now this would be interesting. Such as taking a different host such as Arya. I was thinking Bran. They beat Cersei, Bran stands up, eyes go blue, raises the dead. BOOM 26 minutes ago, ET80 said: I sincerely hope this is the case. That seemed too easy, I'm waiting for Quill to punch Thanos in the face and ruin the plan... Agreed. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Broncofan Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 (edited) 41 minutes ago, Calvert28 said: They built up Jon. Melisandre was the one who brought him back and was convinced because of it and even traveled to Dany to convince her of who Jon was. She completely contradicted her conversation with Davos in this episode when she brought up blue eyes. They built him up because without him they don’t get an army that can hold off the horde long enough to get to the Night King. He was a necessary piece without him there is no chance. And it’s either him or Dany who rules after if the No Cersei camp wins. But it didn’t mean he has to be the one dealing the final blow. Keep in mind the green eyes prophecy wasn’t just tonight - it was given in S3 & again last season. I totally get you see that as veering away from the original intent of the books. No argument there. It’s just they didn’t just decide that this year it was clearly a call they made a while back. Keep in mind the S3 prophecy delivered... I’ve made my peace with the fact the TV show decided to veer away from the book canon. I’d rather see some key book elements they went in another direction with (Stoneheart!), but that’s also on GRRM. I can't say that they weren't planning this for some time - the above wasn't talking about just Cersei - we know the Brown eyes were the Freys, and now the Blue Eyes were wights/NK. Cersei has green eyes, so for sure that's the implication. I just don't see how ppl can say this was a last second veer. The books very well painted waiting for the Prince Who Was Promised - I get Arya isn't a prince - but the TV show clearly laid the foundation for this a while ago. Edited April 30, 2019 by Broncofan 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeeEvans Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 1 minute ago, Ragnarok said: I was thinking Bran. They beat Cersei, Bran stands up, eyes go blue, raises the dead. BOOM Agreed. Man, I would take that in a heart beat. The worst ending that could possibly occur is Dany and Jon riding off into the sunset. I would be furious if that happens (which I dont think it will). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackstar12 Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 (edited) Yeah I have a feeling Sam is definitely going to have a position in the new small council. His plot armor is too damn strong lol. Edited April 30, 2019 by Blackstar12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malak1 Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 7 hours ago, LeeEvans said: I've got to agree. She had already gotten trapped by them once and barely got out of the library with only 10 around her and she somehow covers that much ground undetected and then just silently sprints past a circle of wights and white walkers to save the day at the last second just feels a like cheap resolution in my opinion. I've said it before but if she is capable of doing that then what's the point of these next three episodes just have her use her assassin skills and kill all the remaining leaders. Her power has been getting too high for a while now but this episode made her absolutely unstoppable. The other main characters are good fighters but Arya is literally able to kill anyone, anywhere at any time apparently. The balance of power is completely broken now. I think the show would have done well to have Jon and maybe another member fighting the NK and then having Arya slip in and kill him as he was close two defeating the others so at least it wasnt completely all on her own. Isn’t that what she was trained to do? I mean, we seen at Harenhal that Jaqen basically had that skill too, when he killed the Lannister soldier moments before he got to Tywin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calvert28 Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 18 minutes ago, The LBC said: It may not (and to my memory in several cases is not) be as big a recurring theme in the canon lit, but in the show canon it's been pretty consistent that pretty much every significant character who dies dies when people don't expect it (i.e. not in combat, because people would be expecting that). These characters (especially the ones the audience are built up to care about) die very consistently when it's able to create the biggest shock value. Except they can't rely on that now. With 3 episodes left in the entire series it's not who dies now, it's how they die. The purpose of granting them a reprieve for a episode or two to raise tensions can't work now because the audience is just expecting it. We even have polls on who was to die this episode and who is most likely to survive the series, yet them holding off on who's going to die or exit lessons the experience when they have only so much show time left and begins to crunch in the endings of these characters that leave them feeling shallow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calvert28 Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 8 minutes ago, malak1 said: Isn’t that what she was trained to do? I mean, we seen at Harenhal that Jaqen basically had that skill too, when he killed the Lannister soldier moments before he got to Tywin. Exactly. Considering what she was able to do to the most dangerous villain in the series, what chance does Cersei have? Outside of a major twist such as her becoming the Night's Queen or Jaqen finishing the job the Wiaf started since it was he who decided she had to die. Cersei shouldn't survive past the next episode realistically given how powerful the Starks are now not even including 1 or 2 dragons. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malak1 Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 2 minutes ago, Calvert28 said: Exactly. Considering what she was able to do to the most dangerous villain in the series, what chance does Cersei have? Outside of a major twist such as her becoming the Night's Queen or Jaqen finishing the job the Wiaf started since it was he who decided she had to die. Cersei shouldn't survive past the next episode realistically given how powerful the Starks are now not even including 1 or 2 dragons. I actually agree with you. They can definitely wreck Cersei without issue. However, I’m willing to slightly suspend disbelief and skepticism in the name of enjoying the last 3 episodes of the show. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calvert28 Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 27 minutes ago, Broncofan said: They built him up because without him they don’t get an army that can hold off the horde long enough to get to the Night King. He was a necessary piece without him there is no chance. And it’s either him or Dany who rules after if the No Cersei camp wins. But it didn’t mean he has to be the one dealing the final blow. Keep in mind the green eyes prophecy wasn’t just tonight - it was given last season. I totally get you see that as veering away from the original intent of the books. No argument there. It’s just they didn’t just decide that this year it was clearly a call they made a while back. I’ve made my peace with the fact the TB show decided to veer away from the book. I’d rather see some key book elements they went in another direction with (Stoneheart!), but that’s also on GRRM. If the prophecy wasn't in the show then this really wouldn't an issue. H/e it is, and it is very specific, and there in lies the problem. They didn't just rewrite it, they ignored it even after adding it to the show. If they had this planned for years now, they would not have made such an obvious oversight considering they further expanded on the prophecy last season from the books. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sammymvpknight Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 Arya could end the war with Cersei tomorrow if she wanted to. Who needs dragons when you can just pretend to be someone close to Cersei and slit her throat? Don’t need an army for that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calvert28 Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 39 minutes ago, Ragnarok said: I was thinking Bran. They beat Cersei, Bran stands up, eyes go blue, raises the dead. BOOM Agreed. Yea and giving the NK the Snoke treatment would be killer considering how similar his powers are to Bran. Just on a far greater scale. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeeEvans Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 27 minutes ago, malak1 said: Isn’t that what she was trained to do? I mean, we seen at Harenhal that Jaqen basically had that skill too, when he killed the Lannister soldier moments before he got to Tywin. For one thing she wasnt trained near as well or long as other assassins. Secondly Jaqen had to kill one guy in a hall, disguised as a soldier and without any real guards to worry about. Arya on the other hand apparently managed to sneak past tens of thousands of wights swarming the castle and then spring and jump past a circle of wights and white walkers. That's a hell of a lot more than what Jaqen had to do. If Arya is that much of an unstoppable killing machine what are we even waiting for? Send her to Kings Landing and let her kill every single bad guy. We don't even need any of the other characters or to march south at all, Arya's got it. I've got no problems with her being the one to kill, the way it was executed was very poor though. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calvert28 Posted April 30, 2019 Share Posted April 30, 2019 Just now, sammymvpknight said: Arya could end the war with Cersei tomorrow if she wanted to. Who needs dragons when you can just pretend to be someone close to Cersei and slit her throat? Don’t need an army for that. And this is why I wanted them to lose the battle. I was hoping and betting Arya would die this episode for that very reason. She is just too powerful. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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