Nabbs4u Posted August 24, 2019 Share Posted August 24, 2019 13 minutes ago, Heinz D. said: 26 minutes ago, Nabbs4u said: Nothing has changed though? Oh...sure. You all can play "let's pretend". I'm not going there. I stand by my post. Nothing has changed other than Giants fans having some semblance of hope that this translates into the regular season. It might, it might not. Won't know for sure until REAL games are played. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gmen Posted August 24, 2019 Share Posted August 24, 2019 2 minutes ago, Nabbs4u said: I stand by my post. Nothing has changed other than Giants fans having some semblance of hope that this translates into the regular season. It might, it might not. Won't know for sure until REAL games are played. People act like defenders aren’t even trying out there in the preseason. You know a lot of those defenders are trying to earn a roster spot. They’re fighting for an opportunity to make a living playing football. They’re trying their butts off. Furthermore, Jones was going up against the Bengals first stringers last night. I put more stock in preseason than I do in college football games. But if preseason is so easy, what do we make of Baker’s 10/26, 72 yards, 1 int performance tonight? 🤔 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soko Posted August 24, 2019 Share Posted August 24, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, Heinz D. said: Plenty of people, including folks around here, said he flat-out sucked, and was a sure fire bust. You can pretend otherwise, but that doesn't change things. I’m not pretending otherwise. I’m saying that a couple preseason games don’t make a player not-a-bust. Even a stellar rookie season doesn’t clear a player of the bust label (see: RG3, Vince Young, Michael Clayton, etc.). Preseason is preseason. Starters hardly play, and when they do, they hardly go full speed. The games don’t mean anything. Coaches don’t game plan. Defenses stay vanilla. You have a handful of non-NFL talent playing significant snaps. You don’t prove your skill or worth as a player, let alone a first rounder, during the preseason. You earn it playing games that matter against NFL starters. As I said, Jones has looked better so far than most probably expected. But he hasn’t proven anything yet. None of the rookies have. Edited August 24, 2019 by Yin-Yang 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thelonebillsfan Posted August 24, 2019 Share Posted August 24, 2019 Preseason Preseason. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gmen Posted August 24, 2019 Share Posted August 24, 2019 12 minutes ago, Yin-Yang said: Even a stellar rookie season doesn’t clear a player of the bust label (see: RG3, Vince Young, Michael Clayton, etc.). This isn’t due to lack of talent. There are usually circumstance that derail careers. Usually it’s injuries, laziness or substance abuse. Hard to imagine Jones having these issues. Knock on wood for staying healthy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soko Posted August 24, 2019 Share Posted August 24, 2019 (edited) 10 minutes ago, Gmen said: This isn’t due to lack of talent. There are usually circumstance that derail careers. Usually it’s injuries, laziness or substance abuse. Hard to imagine Jones having these issues. Knock on wood for staying healthy. With FRPs, it’s hardly ever due to lack of talent. Players with little or no talent aren’t usually drafted in the first round (there are exceptions, of course). Sometimes they get injured, sometimes they make bad choices, sometimes they get lazy, sometimes they never develop their games. There are a bunch of reasons, but it happens even after promising or even great rookie seasons. Which reinforces the whole “it’s way too early to pivot on Daniel Jones” point. Edited August 24, 2019 by Yin-Yang Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gmen Posted August 24, 2019 Share Posted August 24, 2019 1 minute ago, Yin-Yang said: Which reinforces the whole “it’s way too early to pivot on Daniel Jones” point. Well can we at least pivot to saying he looks like a first round pick? Because there were plenty of people that suggested he had no business being drafted in the first round, let alone #6 overall. Some had him as a fourth round prospect. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bonanza23 Posted August 24, 2019 Share Posted August 24, 2019 50 minutes ago, Gmen said: People act like defenders aren’t even trying out there in the preseason. You know a lot of those defenders are trying to earn a roster spot. They’re fighting for an opportunity to make a living playing football. They’re trying their butts off. Furthermore, Jones was going up against the Bengals first stringers last night. I put more stock in preseason than I do in college football games. But if preseason is so easy, what do we make of Baker’s 10/26, 72 yards, 1 int performance tonight? 🤔 100%. You get it my man! I told you last week Garrett Gilbert is the new starter for the Browns. So far based on preseason Baker sucks and Gilbert is up there with the great Jones. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soko Posted August 24, 2019 Share Posted August 24, 2019 18 minutes ago, Gmen said: Well can we at least pivot to saying he looks like a first round pick? Because there were plenty of people that suggested he had no business being drafted in the first round, let alone #6 overall. Some had him as a fourth round prospect. Sure? Preseason performance mean’s next to nothing, IMO. It’s real use is fleshing out the bottom of the depth chart and deciding on some week 1 playing time at positions of uncertainty, but I’m not going to formulate opinions based on the preseason. Especially for a QB. Jarrett Stidham looks like a FRP if we’re going off preseason, ffs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gmen Posted August 24, 2019 Share Posted August 24, 2019 14 minutes ago, Bonanza23 said: 100%. You get it my man! I told you last week Garrett Gilbert is the new starter for the Browns. So far based on preseason Baker sucks and Gilbert is up there with the great Jones. Sarcasm is anger’s ugly cousin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bonanza23 Posted August 24, 2019 Share Posted August 24, 2019 7 minutes ago, Gmen said: Sarcasm is anger’s ugly cousin Absolutely not sarcasm, I’m only posting preseason stats and the obvious conclusion. Garrett > Mayfield. You yourself noted that with your post. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gmen Posted August 24, 2019 Share Posted August 24, 2019 1 minute ago, Bonanza23 said: Absolutely not sarcasm, I’m only posting preseason stats and the obvious conclusion. Garrett > Mayfield. You yourself noted that with your post. I think this goes to @Yin-Yang’s point that we shouldn’t jump on gun on calling players a success prematurely. How much do we really know about Mayfield? All we know is that he can pad stats against bottom 5 defenses. He couldn’t even win Rookie of the year. Daniel Jones is not impressed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bonanza23 Posted August 24, 2019 Share Posted August 24, 2019 2 minutes ago, Gmen said: I think this goes to @Yin-Yang’s point that we shouldn’t jump on gun on calling players a success prematurely. How much do we really know about Mayfield? All we know is that he can pad stats against bottom 5 defenses. He couldn’t even win Rookie of the year. Daniel Jones is not impressed. I guess you just aren’t getting my point, preseason stats suggest Mayfield is doodoo. Garrett I will wager will get the starting gig over him. Preseason case closed. Thanks for your beautiful assessment of preseason performance! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heinz D. Posted August 24, 2019 Share Posted August 24, 2019 1 hour ago, Yin-Yang said: I’m not pretending otherwise. I’m saying that a couple preseason games don’t make a player not-a-bust. Even a stellar rookie season doesn’t clear a player of the bust label (see: RG3, Vince Young, Michael Clayton, etc.). RG3 and Vince Young weren't truly "busts", though... 1 hour ago, Yin-Yang said: As I said, Jones has looked better so far than most probably expected. But he hasn’t proven anything yet. None of the rookies have. He hasn't "proven" that he's "looked better so far than most probably expected"? I'm not following. Seems like you're taking steps to prove my main point...while apparently disagreeing with me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soko Posted August 24, 2019 Share Posted August 24, 2019 (edited) 27 minutes ago, Heinz D. said: RG3 and Vince Young weren't truly "busts", though... Sure they were. One is a backup that can’t stay healthy and the other is out of the league. Quote He hasn't "proven" that he's "looked better so far than most probably expected"? I'm not following. Seems like you're taking steps to prove my main point...while apparently disagreeing with me. Jones has looked better than most probably expected in preseason, yes. Jones has not proven he’s a quality NFL player yet, he’s. Where’s the confusion? I thought I laid things out simply. Let’s go simpler: Preseason = not enough to determine whether a guy is worth a FRP or whether or not a guy will suck as a player. Edited August 24, 2019 by Yin-Yang 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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