BayRaider Posted April 10, 2021 Share Posted April 10, 2021 (edited) 25 minutes ago, NYRaider said: All of the rookie CB's drafted in the first two rounds were pretty bad last season. We didn't address CB at all in free agency which leads me to believe that the staff has faith that Arnette will be a starter. I’m not saying Arnette isn’t going to be the starter. He probably will be the starter for 2021, but at some point he’s going to move to Nickel because he can’t hack it outside. And that means Molden is a wasted pick because he’s definitely not playing on the outside. 25 minutes ago, SodakRaiders said: If Arnette ends up being a quality nickel, I wouldn't consider it a wasted pick. Nickels are on the field most of the game. Anymore a good nickel is as valuable as a stack linebacker. Think you misunderstood. Arnette wouldn’t be the wasted pick, drafting a nickel this year would be, since Arnette will eventually move to that position. Edited April 10, 2021 by BayRaider 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeremy408 Posted April 10, 2021 Share Posted April 10, 2021 1 minute ago, NYRaider said: https://www.pro-football-reference.com/years/2020/defense_advanced.htm He had the highest missed tackle % of any player in the NFL last season. Also played with a cast for most of the season so there's that Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BayRaider Posted April 10, 2021 Share Posted April 10, 2021 There’s still a chance Arnette doesn’t even get another crack on the outside if we sign Sherman. He’d be assigned Nickel duty right away, which is the position he should be playing. He’d be great in that role. The guy is just not an outside corner with those T-Rex arms. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted April 10, 2021 Share Posted April 10, 2021 3 minutes ago, Jeremy408 said: Also played with a cast for most of the season so there's that There were only two CB's in the league that missed more tackles than Arnette last season, they just did it over 16 games while Arnette did it in 9. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted April 10, 2021 Share Posted April 10, 2021 4 minutes ago, BayRaider said: I’m not saying Arnette isn’t going to be the starter. He probably will be the starter for 2021, but at some point he’s going to move to Nickel because he can’t hack it outside. And that means Molden is a wasted pick because he’s definitely nor playing on the outside. How do we know that he is incapable of playing outside CB? Troy Hill was one of the best outside CB's in a heavy zone scheme in 2019 and he's nothing special from a H/W/S perspective. At the combine he was 5'11" 180 with 29" arms and ran a 4.55. https://touchdownwire.usatoday.com/2020/06/16/the-nfls-best-cornerbacks-in-zone-coverage/5/ 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeremy408 Posted April 10, 2021 Share Posted April 10, 2021 5 minutes ago, NYRaider said: There were only two CB's in the league that missed more tackles than Arnette last season, they just did it over 16 games while Arnette did it in 9. I mean philosophically that doesn't change the fact that he had a cast just because he played less games Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted April 10, 2021 Share Posted April 10, 2021 Just now, Jeremy408 said: I mean philosophically that doesn't change the fact that he had a cast just because he played less games I also think it's a stretch to say that he's a good tackler when he had the highest missed tackle rate of any defensive player in the NFL. He was the only player regardless of position to miss 30%+ of his tackles and the #2 CB in terms of missed tackle % missed 24% while Arnette missed 34%. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted April 10, 2021 Share Posted April 10, 2021 11 minutes ago, BayRaider said: There’s still a chance Arnette doesn’t even get another crack on the outside if we sign Sherman. He’d be assigned Nickel duty right away, which is the position he should be playing. He’d be great in that role. The guy is just not an outside corner with those T-Rex arms. With our lack of cap space and Sherman's comments about wanting a 2 year deal and that he wouldn't take a discount, I think that ship has sailed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeremy408 Posted April 10, 2021 Share Posted April 10, 2021 1 minute ago, NYRaider said: I also think it's a stretch to say that he's a good tackler when he had the highest missed tackle rate of any defensive player in the NFL. He was the only player regardless of position to miss 30%+ of his tackles and the #2 CB in terms of missed tackle % missed 24% while Arnette missed 34%. All I said was in response to the tackle rate you mentioned that playing with a cast had something to do with that. Also playing less games means less opportunities to make tackles (which if all but i think two of your seven games were with a cast is difficult). It's like when a running back has a higher yards per carry when they have less carries. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted April 10, 2021 Share Posted April 10, 2021 (edited) 3 minutes ago, Jeremy408 said: All I said was in response to the tackle rate you mentioned that playing with a cast had something to do with that. Also playing less games means less opportunities to make tackles (which if all but i think two of your seven games were with a cast is difficult). It's like when a running back has a higher yards per carry when they have less carries. Playing less games also meant that he had less opportunities to miss tackles as well, yet missed the third most tackles of any CB in the league while playing half of the snaps. I'm not just referencing missed tackle %, I'm referencing the number of tackles that he missed. He missed 14 tackles in 9 games and only two CB's missed more tackles and they both played 16 games. So you'd assume he would've missed even more with more playing time. I think it's a stretch to say he's a good tackler when he was literally the only player in the league to miss 30%+ of his tackles. And was 3rd in missed tackles out of every CB in the league despite only playing half of the season. Edited April 10, 2021 by NYRaider Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeremy408 Posted April 10, 2021 Share Posted April 10, 2021 3 minutes ago, NYRaider said: Playing less games also meant that he had less opportunities to miss tackles as well, yet missed the third most tackles of any CB in the league while playing half of the snaps. I'm not just referencing missed tackle %, I'm referencing the number of tackles that he missed. He missed 14 tackles in 9 games and only two CB's missed more tackles and they both played 16 games. So you'd assume he would've missed even more with more playing time. I think it's a stretch to say he's a good tackler when he was literally the only player in the league to miss 30%+ of his tackles. And was 3rd in missed tackles out of every CB in the league despite only playing half of the season. OK that makes more sense. Because I thought the Miss tackle rate point you were trying to make didn't really make sense. All I'm saying overall is I'd like to see what he looks like without a cast(And a full off-season for that matter LOL) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted April 10, 2021 Share Posted April 10, 2021 2 minutes ago, Jeremy408 said: OK that makes more sense. Because I thought the Miss tackle rate point you were trying to make didn't really make sense. All I'm saying overall is I'd like to see what he looks like without a cast(And a full off-season for that matter LOL) Both point to the fact that he's not a good tackler though. I get your point about less opportunity could result in a skewed %. But he was 3rd in missed tackles for CB overall and only played half of the season. No cast should help but didn't he have wrist/hand issues at Ohio State too? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted April 10, 2021 Share Posted April 10, 2021 Jeff Gladney had 20 missed tackles in 958 snaps. Kyle Fuller had 16 missed tackles in 1,060 snaps. Damon Arnette had 14 missed tackles in 343 snaps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYRaider Posted April 10, 2021 Share Posted April 10, 2021 46 minutes ago, Rich7sena said: Arnette is a good tackler. A big part of tackling as a corner is getting in tackling position and competitiveness. Arnette does a good job of shedding blockers and either making the stop or slowing down the ball carrier enough for a play to be made. He's a plus in run support. 1 minute ago, NYRaider said: Jeff Gladney had 20 missed tackles in 958 snaps. Kyle Fuller had 16 missed tackles in 1,060 snaps. Damon Arnette had 14 missed tackles in 343 snaps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeremy408 Posted April 10, 2021 Share Posted April 10, 2021 (edited) 15 minutes ago, NYRaider said: Both point to the fact that he's not a good tackler though. I get your point about less opportunity could result in a skewed %. But he was 3rd in missed tackles for CB overall and only played half of the season. No cast should help but didn't he have wrist/hand issues at Ohio State too? You can't compare college to the pros though. There's a difference between tackling some guy in the big 10 with a cast And then having to tackle Alvin Kamara Christian McCaffrey the first two weeks of the season with a cast. That's just me being fair. Again I'm not making an excuse but that's a pretty valid reason for why you were missed a lot of tackles. Edited April 10, 2021 by Jeremy408 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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