2021 NFL Draft Thread

[Jeremy408]

17 minutes ago, NYRaider said:

They were 5th in the NFL in sacks and had one of, if not the, best defensive lines in the league with JPP, Veta, Suh, and Barrett. And although none of their DB's were Pro Bowlers, Carlton Davis, Antoine Winfield Jr, Jordan Whitehead, SMB, and Jamal Dean is a very good young collection of DB's. They were also top 5 in turnovers forced last season as well. 

The Saints had Cam Jordan, Marshon Lattimore, and Marcus Williams. 

The Rams had Aaron Donald, Jalen Ramsey, and John Johnson III.

The Steelers had TJ Watt, Stephen Tuitt, Bud Dupree, Steven Nelson, and Minkah Fitzpatrick. 

The Ravens had Matt Judon, Calias Campbell, Marlon Humphrey, and Marcus Peters.

The Chiefs had Chris Jones, Frank Clark, and Tyran Mathieu. 

The best defenses in the league have guys that can consistently generate pressure and DB's that make plays. 

DBs look a lot better when the pass rush is there and they look a lot worse when the pass rush isn’t there.

DB make more plays when the ball comes out in four seconds or less

Edited April 11, 2021 by Jeremy408

[Bitty 2.0]

15 hours ago, NYRaider said:

He blamed Carr's fumbles on the fact that his wife was in labor but fumbles have been an issue with him his entire career. Does he have like 90 kids? 

You should not talk about Carr. If it was up to you the Raiders would have trade Carr and 3 1st round draft picks for Watson, who probably will never play again.

[NYRaider]

5 hours ago, Bitty 2.0 said:

You should not talk about Carr. If it was up to you the Raiders would have trade Carr and 3 1st round draft picks for Watson, who probably will never play again.

What does that have to do with Carr consistently fumbling? 

[OnlyGlove]

Rather have JOK over Parsons and its not close.  

[Jeremy408]

Just now, OnlyGlove said:

Rather have JOK over Parsons and its not close.  

Oh wow. Why?

[OnlyGlove]

1 minute ago, Jeremy408 said:

Oh wow. Why?

 

 

Parsons processing isn't very good and is getting overlooked.  His best suited in a system where he can be used in constant Blitz yet we won't be allowing him to do that.  He kind of reminds me of Darren Lee coming out. 

JOK has much better processing and can play in the nickle on early downs.  Reminds me of Myles Jack, who Gus Bradley drafted. 

[NYRaider]

23 minutes ago, OnlyGlove said:

Rather have JOK over Parsons and its not close.  

I just think JOK is somewhat redundant with Littleton and Morrow on the roster. 

[BayRaider]

46 minutes ago, OnlyGlove said:

 

 

Parsons processing isn't very good and is getting overlooked.  His best suited in a system where he can be used in constant Blitz yet we won't be allowing him to do that.  He kind of reminds me of Darren Lee coming out. 

JOK has much better processing and can play in the nickle on early downs.  Reminds me of Myles Jack, who Gus Bradley drafted. 

Seems like complaints I heard about Devin White...

 

Parsons is more Devin White and he doesn’t resemble Darron Lee in any single way. That’s a really bad comp imo.

JOK is half the prospect Parsons is. 

[Trojan]

Parsons would play SLB and blitz gaps and take an edge. JOK is a coverage LB that is undersized. They aren't the same position. JOK would play Nick or Cory (Littleton's is his best projection spot) position -- none of those three are good fits at SLB.


Base End 5-technique (on OT):  Michael Bennett -> Clelin Ferrel / David Irving
Nose Tackle 1-technique (shaded C): Ahtyba Rubin -> Johnathan Hankins
Under Tackle 3-technique (C/G Gap): Brandon Mebane -> Solomon Thomas/Mo Hurst/Quinton Jefferson
Edge Rusher/LEO 9-technique (wide off OT):  Cliff Avril -> Yannick Ngakoue/Maxx Crosby

SLB (blitz/gap shoot): Bruce Irvin -> Micah Parsons type
MLB (leader of defense/zone coverage and gap control/stack and shed): Bobby Wagner -> Nick Kwiatkoski
WLB (Coverage/Range): KJ Wright -> Cory Littleton

Boundary CBs need long arms to initiate contact disrupting off the line, and fluid hips to turn and stay at the WRs side down the field. If they work the WR closer to the sideline that would be a massive plus as it narrows the throwing window dramatically. Damon Arnette's arms (30") are not the prototype here, but he projects well to the slot option and in some packages would man up on the TE. Trayvon Mullen also has short arms at 31", but 32-34" is kinda the goal so it's not far off. A Jaycee Horn is the type of bully with 33" arms that fits the prototype and range for 17th pick. Horn as CB1, but he needs to work on not getting flagged, Mullen as CB2, and Arnette as nickel makes sense. Tyson Campbell has 32" in the second round range for another option. Caleb Farley is the best fit, but has the back issue that needs clearing and without the back issue won't be available.

Free safety in our scheme needs range, and we don't have it. The best fit is a healthy (good luck) Malik Hooker in FA on a cheap 1 year deal, or Earl Thomas who is issues off the field. I haven't found a really deep rangey type in the draft class that I am like "oh this is the dude", but it might be Jamar Johnson.

Strong Safety is a lower zone defender that punishes crossing routes and plays the box and stops runs cold. That would be Abram and Joseph.

Edited April 11, 2021 by Trojan

[jimkelly02]

45 minutes ago, NYRaider said:

I just think JOK is somewhat redundant with Littleton and Morrow on the roster. 

Yeah..:: I just don’t see the value added of spending #17 on JOK.  If we didn’t have FS and RT to lock up long term then Id get it.  I think Morrow could have a pretty darn good year.

 

1 hour ago, OnlyGlove said:

 

 

Parsons processing isn't very good and is getting overlooked.  His best suited in a system where he can be used in constant Blitz yet we won't be allowing him to do that.  He kind of reminds me of Darren Lee coming out. 

Parsons landing spot and he’s used will determine his level of success.  He’s one of those players that needs the scheme to have other players compromise to minimize his problems.  His recognition is so hit or miss.  I think he’ll become a decent zone coverage guy or man vs RBs and most TEs simply because with his speed and size he can stay with anyone, but don’t expect him to make plays on the ball often.

[NYRaider]

6 minutes ago, jimkelly02 said:

Yeah..:: I just don’t see the value added of spending #17 on JOK.  If we didn’t have FS and RT to lock up long term then Id get it.  I think Morrow could have a pretty darn good year.

Parsons landing spot and he’s used will determine his level of success. 

Yeah I thought Morrow played well last year and I have faith that Littleton will bounce back. 

I think that's the case for most prospects though. Isaiah Simmons was viewed as a can't miss, generational type of prospect, and struggled last year in Arizona because they misused him. 

[jimkelly02]

15 minutes ago, Trojan said:

Parsons would play SLB and blitz gaps and take an edge. JOK is a coverage LB that is undersized. They aren't the same position. JOK would play Nick or Cory (Littleton's is his best projection spot) position -- none of those three are good fits at SLB.


Base End 5-technique (on OT):  Michael Bennett -> Clelin Ferrel / David Irving
Nose Tackle 1-technique (shaded C): Ahtyba Rubin -> Johnathan Hankins
Under Tackle 3-technique (C/G Gap): Brandon Mebane -> Solomon Thomas/Mo Hurst/Quinton Jefferson
Edge Rusher/LEO 9-technique (wide off OT):  Cliff Avril -> Yannick Ngakoue/Maxx Crosby

SLB (blitz/gap shoot): Bruce Irvin -> Micah Parsons type
MLB (leader of defense/zone coverage and gap control/stack and shed): Bobby Wagner -> Nick Kwiatkoski
WLB (Coverage/Range): KJ Wright -> Cory Littleton

Boundary CBs need long arms to initiate contact disrupting off the line, and fluid hips to turn and stay at the WRs side down the field. If they work the WR closer to the sideline that would be a massive plus as it narrows the throwing window dramatically. Damon Arnette's arms (30") are not the prototype here, but he projects well to the slot option and in some packages would man up on the TE. Trayvon Mullen also has short arms at 31", but 32-34" is kinda the goal so it's not far off. A Jaycee Horn is the type of bully with 33" arms that fits the prototype and range for 17th pick. Horn as CB1, but he needs to work on not getting flagged, Mullen as CB2, and Arnette as nickel makes sense. Tyson Campbell has 32" in the second round range for another option. Caleb Farley is the best fit, but has the back issue that needs clearing and without the back issue won't be available.

Free safety in our scheme needs range, and we don't have it. The best fit is a healthy (good luck) Malik Hooker in FA on a cheap 1 year deal, or Earl Thomas who is issues off the field. I haven't found a really deep rangey type in the draft class that I am like "oh this is the dude", but it might be Jamar Johnson.

Strong Safety is a lower zone defender that punishes crossing routes and plays the box and stops runs cold. That would be Abram and Joseph.

I fully agree Parsons would be best served playing SAM for us.  I think he could really shine in that role.  You have to limit his responsibilities and recognition and let him fly.

[jimkelly02]

27 minutes ago, NYRaider said:

Yeah I thought Morrow played well last year and I have faith that Littleton will bounce back. 

I think that's the case for most prospects though. Isaiah Simmons was viewed as a can't miss, generational type of prospect, and struggled last year in Arizona because they misused him. 

Yeah I mean all prospects level of success is determine to some degree by where they end up and how they are used.  But that’s not what I was saying.  My postion Parsons, more than most 1st round picks, level of success will be tied directly to how he’s used.  He had tremendous ability but also has some real weaknesses.  I don’t think he’s capable of succeeding to the level of what’s currently expected of him unless he goes to a team that crafts a role within the defense to suit his strengths and weaknesses.

[jimkelly02]

1 hour ago, Trojan said:

Parsons would play SLB and blitz gaps and take an edge. JOK is a coverage LB that is undersized. They aren't the same position. JOK would play Nick or Cory (Littleton's is his best projection spot) position -- none of those three are good fits at SLB.


Base End 5-technique (on OT):  Michael Bennett -> Clelin Ferrel / David Irving
Nose Tackle 1-technique (shaded C): Ahtyba Rubin -> Johnathan Hankins
Under Tackle 3-technique (C/G Gap): Brandon Mebane -> Solomon Thomas/Mo Hurst/Quinton Jefferson
Edge Rusher/LEO 9-technique (wide off OT):  Cliff Avril -> Yannick Ngakoue/Maxx Crosby

SLB (blitz/gap shoot): Bruce Irvin -> Micah Parsons type
MLB (leader of defense/zone coverage and gap control/stack and shed): Bobby Wagner -> Nick Kwiatkoski
WLB (Coverage/Range): KJ Wright -> Cory Littleton

Boundary CBs need long arms to initiate contact disrupting off the line, and fluid hips to turn and stay at the WRs side down the field. If they work the WR closer to the sideline that would be a massive plus as it narrows the throwing window dramatically. Damon Arnette's arms (30") are not the prototype here, but he projects well to the slot option and in some packages would man up on the TE. Trayvon Mullen also has short arms at 31", but 32-34" is kinda the goal so it's not far off. A Jaycee Horn is the type of bully with 33" arms that fits the prototype and range for 17th pick. Horn as CB1, but he needs to work on not getting flagged, Mullen as CB2, and Arnette as nickel makes sense. Tyson Campbell has 32" in the second round range for another option. Caleb Farley is the best fit, but has the back issue that needs clearing and without the back issue won't be available.

Free safety in our scheme needs range, and we don't have it. The best fit is a healthy (good luck) Malik Hooker in FA on a cheap 1 year deal, or Earl Thomas who is issues off the field. I haven't found a really deep rangey type in the draft class that I am like "oh this is the dude", but it might be Jamar Johnson.

Strong Safety is a lower zone defender that punishes crossing routes and plays the box and stops runs cold. That would be Abram and Joseph.

Your absolutely spot on about the preferences arm length, etc etc .... but I will say for having shorter arms Arnette is pretty good at pressing at the line.

[NYRaider]

2 hours ago, jimkelly02 said:

Yeah I mean all prospects level of success is determine to some degree by where they end up and how they are used.  But that’s not what I was saying.  My postion Parsons, more than most 1st round picks, level of success will be tied directly to how he’s used.  He had tremendous ability but also has some real weaknesses.  I don’t think he’s capable of succeeding to the level of what’s currently expected of him unless he goes to a team that crafts a role within the defense to suit his strengths and weaknesses.

Agreed. Devin White is a perfect example of this, he was statistically the worst LB in coverage in the NFL last season, but Tampa used him as a blitzer frequently to take advantage of his strengths. He was sent on a blitz on 10% of his snaps and finished the season with 9 sacks, 15 TFL, and 16 QB hits.