2020 Green Bay Packers Defensive Line

[deathstar]

 

Edited July 1, 2020 by deathstar

[Beast]

Love Clark, he's a great player.

Hopefully someone else steps up with him. I don't have too much hope for Lowry and Lancaster, but they could slightly improve, at least become more consistent with their brighter spots.

Keke is the one DL I really think MIGHT take a good jump in production one of these days. Adams, well, seems like he might be a bust (at least so far), after large potential.

Heater seems to always make the roster his first year with a team and then fails to make it the next year.

[Shanedorf]

from Ben Fennell

Kenny Clark was 3rd among iDL with 69 QB pressures in 2019... Absolute beast.

[Beast]

12 minutes ago, Shanedorf said:

from Ben Fennell

Kenny Clark was 3rd among iDL with 69 QB pressures in 2019... Absolute beast.

And he got banged up at one point of the season, as (I believe) an ankle injury slowed him up some.

And this article

https://www.si.com/nfl/packers/news/packers-key-defensive-line

"The starting point, of course, will be Clark, who has developed into one of the elite three-down interior defensive linemen in the league. Among the 82 who rushed the passer at least 200 times, Clark finished sixth in ProFootballFocus.com’s pass-rushing productivity, a metric that measures sacks, hits and hurries per pass-rushing snap. Among the 63 who played at least 200 run-defending snaps, he finished seventh in PFF’s run-stop percentage, a metric that essentially measures impact tackles. Clark was the only lineman in the league to finish in the top 16 in both stats; Clark, meanwhile, was in the top seven."

 

[MrBobGray]

We really don't talk about Kenny enough.  I don't talk about Kenny enough.  Not even joking I don't know why all of my posts aren't six paragraphs of loving prose dedicated entirely to the efficiency and efficacy with which our stout stalwart thwarts the designs of the opposition.  

And I'll die on the hill that he's currently the best player on the team.  I love Adams, Bahk and Rodgers, but nobody's been as consistently dominant over the past few years as Ken Clark, Attorney at Law.  He can win with power, quickness, and/or technique, and increasingly its the "and".  He stuffs the run, he can rush the passer, he's only missed four games in four years, and he's only....let's see here....24 years old?  That can't possibly be right, I need to stop drinking and reading birthdays.  Can you imagine if such a ridiculous monster of a DL was only 24?  Absolute fanciful madness.  We'll have none of that whimsy here.

Sometimes I just lay in bed, listening to the breeze as it winds its way through the night, and picture a future where Gary just fully knocks it out of the park.  Makes perfect, flush contact with his talent, sends it right into the stratosphere.  Imagine that DL group, lined up week one, face to face with what Minnesota will no doubt insist is definitely not their real offensive line, their real offensive line is way hotter and goes to school in Canada and you wouldn't know them and they definitely wouldn't have been thrown around like that, like small, helpless children in the uncaring grasp of an angry sea.  

 

Edited July 16, 2020 by MrBobGray

[Shanedorf]

ROUND 1: (No. 27 overall)
THE PICK: KENNY CLARK, DT, UCLA

AFC scout: "Strong at the point of attack. Stout. I see him as a two-down player. I don't see him as a third-down player. He's a bull rusher. Most of the guys that play nose tackle are bull rushers."

AFC scout: "He's innately tough, strong and mature. Second round. I don't like him in the first. 100% he'll be there at 27. That's a solid player. He's probably the best run stopper."

AFC scout: "He goes 11 to 20. He's a strong, physical guy. He's got power-rush ability. Only thing I didn't like was his stance. Sometimes he goes in a frog stance with his weight in the butt and so his first move has to be up. He's a natural nose tackle. He's (lighter) but he's strong. Excellent power to control the point of attack. He can play a 3-technique, too. He played H-back against Virginia and caught a touchdown pass."

NFC scout: "I really like him a lot."

NFC scout: "You could take him in the first."

AFC scout: "Space eater. He can also be a 3-technique. He's just very stout. I think the wrestling background helps when it comes to his leverage. Not very long. He's about leverage. Being able to lower your body weight and fight against block pressure as you feel it coming against you. He can do that from a technique standpoint. He knows how to play in there and hold up."

NFC scout: "He gives you some versatility. He can two-gap. If you want to move him over in nickel he can come off the ball. He can use a four-point (stance) and he'll two-gap the center. He keeps his balance and doesn't get rolled up real easy. But you can move him over a man and he drops that back leg and he has some quickness. I don't know that he's a star but he's a good player."

NFC scout: "Good player. He's probably the best blend of athletic ability and strength."

AFC scout: "His No. 1 thing is strength and explosiveness at the point of attack. I think he can rush the passer. He is an outstanding defensive tackle. He's got awareness and balance. He can handle the doubles and invert the nose. Does it all the time. Really a good football player."

AFC scout: "Very similar to (Andrew) Billings."

AFC scout: "I'd take (Vernon) Butler over Clark. Clark is OK. I'm not real enthused about him. He'll be a pocket pusher. Second rounder. Butler has up side and can play all three positions."

[OneTwoSixFive]

Carolina did not take up the 5th year option with Vernon Butler.............so that AFC scout got it wrong (wonder which team he was with).

[MrBobGray]

Scouts were pretty accurate on this one actually.  Hard to predict leverage/toughness/effort guys ascending to stardom, because so much of it is entirely on the person.  Kenny's a monster because of a ton of hard work and effort refining his game; his pass rush skills are night and day from when he came into the league.  He took a lot from playing with Mike D too I believe, there's a lot of Mike's game in Kenny's on the rush and it plays even better for him than it did Daniels given his significant size/strength advantage (and with no difference in quickness).  

 

[AlexGreen#20]

1 hour ago, MrBobGray said:

Scouts were pretty accurate on this one actually.  Hard to predict leverage/toughness/effort guys ascending to stardom, because so much of it is entirely on the person.  Kenny's a monster because of a ton of hard work and effort refining his game; his pass rush skills are night and day from when he came into the league.  He took a lot from playing with Mike D too I believe, there's a lot of Mike's game in Kenny's on the rush and it plays even better for him than it did Daniels given his significant size/strength advantage (and with no difference in quickness).  

 

Clark was also a baby coming into the league. Hard to really know how much physical development he had left.

[MrBobGray]

20 minutes ago, AlexGreen#20 said:

Clark was also a baby coming into the league. Hard to really know how much physical development he had left.

Yeah, another good point, completely forgot to mention that.  Almost impossible to know if a guy at 20 is about to explode into his prime, or if he's already in it (see: Okoye, Amobi).

[Beast]

22 hours ago, Shanedorf said:

NFC scout: "He gives you some versatility. He can two-gap. If you want to move him over in nickel he can come off the ball. He can use a four-point (stance) and he'll two-gap the center. He keeps his balance and doesn't get rolled up real easy. But you can move him over a man and he drops that back leg and he has some quickness. I don't know that he's a star but he's a good player."

I thought the above about Clark before the draft and I saw the Packers selecting him coming, as he was perfectly a Ted Thompson type selection to me.

Honestly, I didn't want him, as I thought he'd be a better Pickett, but not great (I was wrong here).

I wanted DT Chris Jones, because his upside pass rush potential, which the Chiefs grabbed at #37 and they seem pretty happy, considering they just gave him 20 million, per year new deal.

But I come around on Clark after the draft reading that he SERIOUSLY stayed on the field for a ridiculous high % of the defensive snaps in college, where some of the others I was comparing and contrasting him with were only playing 35% of the snaps as their team believed heavily in rotating the DTs to keep them fresh, where Clark just stayed on the field pretty much all season long, and his lows we not as bad as some of the other guys, and he was wearing down as the game wen taking, but that made it make sense why he was wearing down more than others. Also his young age and ability to keep improving.

 

Also Packers did great to avoid DT Robert Nkemdiche and DT Vernon Butler whom were two of the next three picks following Clark. So the Packers got it right, I still don't understand why Chris Jones was rated so low behind these guys.

Edited July 18, 2020 by Beast

[Shanedorf]

[vegas492]

PFF sent me an article....NFL defensive line rankings: All 32 units entering the 2020 NFL season.

I'll summarize....

• First is the Pittsburgh Steelers.  Anchored by TJ Watt (whom they say is playing at a defensive player of the year level) and Cam Heyward (best interior defender outside of Donald)
• Second is Philly Eagles.  Blessed with star power, Fletcher Cox and depth with Brandon Graham, Javon Hargrave, Malik Jackson and Derek Barnett.
• Third is ....Washington's Whatevers?  Counting a lot on Young, whom they say is better than any Bosa and Garrett during college.  Boosted by Kerrigan, Montez Sweat, Payne, Allen and Ioannidis.
• Fourth is San Fran.  Bosa, Armstead, Kinlaw, Thomas.  All that despite losing Buckner.
• Fifth is Green Bay.  Whaaaaat?  "Kenny Clark has developed into the modern-day prototype for NFL nose tackles."  62 pressures and an 87 pass rush grade, ranking first for nose tackles.  Z led the league in total pressures with 93.  Preston had 55 pressures.  "Dean Lowry is a former fourth round pick who has dramatically outperformed his draft slot but may never be anything beyond solid."  Little mention of Lancaster as a "run-first presence".  "The Packers will also look for a major step forward from Rashan Gary, last year's first round pick.  The former Michigan star played just 244 snaps as a rookie and made little impact, earning a PFF grade in the 50's.  His college career suggested he was a reach in the first round, despite his athleticism, so his development is a salient factor for this defensive front."
• Sixth is the Bears.  "At his best, Mack is a game-changing force along the defensive front, but ti's now three seasons since he last posted a pass-rushing grade above 90, and 2019 was the lowest overall grade of his career."  Hick's return should help Mack, if Hicks can remain healthy.  "Quinn is less versatile in terms of alignment and stance than Floyd is and needs to be deployed with his hand in the dirt to effectively get after the QB."
• Broncos.
• Rams
• Chargers
• Bengals

That rounds out the top 10.

[Brat&Beer]

Lowry's effectiveness decreased as his role increased. I think he was better as a backup/role player than as a full time starter. If Keke can emerge and give the Packers some of what they had with Mike Daniels, that might help Lowry. Lancaster works hard, but is JAG. 

[MrBobGray]

Lowry's just a match-up guy.  6'6" with 31" arms means he's starting off at a disadvantage in both the run and pass game, so if he can't really leverage his positives (very quick feet at scale, plays with great effort, can absolutely run it down from the backside despite his size) he's in for a long day.  Really struggles to keep people out of his body at times, and he's never going to be the low man on a run play inside.  But you can still do a lot with that guy; if they just let him roll at 5T with an actual player at the 3 instead of the list of tragedies we put out there with him, he'd look a lot better to fans.