vegas492 Posted October 27, 2020 Share Posted October 27, 2020 I'm looking at that 2014 draft...it emphasizes a few things.... Lions took Ebron at TE at #10 overall. When you draft a TE that high, you usually end up missing out on others players that actually help wreck games. They missed out on.....Taylor Lewan, T. Odell Beckah, WR. Aaron Donald, DT. Kyle Fuller, CB. Next tight end off of the board was Austin Seferian-Jenkins. He went to Tampa. #38 overall. Jace Amaro went #49 overall to the Jets. Troy Niklas went #52 overall. They all missed out on Davante Adams, Allen Robinson, Jimmy Garapollo and Jarvis Landry. Maybe we shouldn't complain about not taking a TE high ever again. And man, that was a great WR class. Evans, OBJ, Cooks, Adams, Robinson, Landry. The misses were Watkins, Benjamin, Marquise Lee, Jordan Matthews and Latimer. Thinking that was the year we got Adams, Abbrederis and Janis. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
packfanfb Posted October 27, 2020 Share Posted October 27, 2020 3 minutes ago, Outpost31 said: How. Answer how. If it's as easy as you constantly act like it is to have a 30 million dollar QB, elite EDGE defenders, an elite DL, an elite LT, an elite WR, legit safeties, legit corners, legit OL, elite RB, elite backup RB... If it's that ****ing easy you should be able to tell me how the Packers could fit an extra 5 million in cap space last year and an extra 16 million in cap space this year. Your complete and total lack of perspective and how the salary cap and draft capital game works is getting old as hell. A gm cannot **** out cap space and vomit draft capital. I already answered this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacReady Posted October 27, 2020 Share Posted October 27, 2020 Just now, packfanfb said: I just said, I'd gladly trade Amos for Robinson. Throw in the Turner signing if necessary. I would have gone younger/cheaper at those positions and taken Robinson. Alright, so who is your starting guard all of last year against the best DL in football in the Championship game? And who was your starting safety? Due to less protection, you gain maybe 1 point per game. Green and Redmond at safety last year and you're giving up 3 more points per game. Congratulations, we now lose before we get to the Championship game. What if I told you that losing Turner actually means you lose Turner? What if I told you that losing Amos actually means you lose Amos? Who are you replacing those two starters with? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beekay414 Posted October 27, 2020 Share Posted October 27, 2020 Just now, packfanfb said: Maybe let's us keep up with them to actually make it a game. It's hard against good teams when you have one good WR. We've gone over this. Yes, we have. We don't just have one good WR. Thanks for playing. Again. Allen Robinson doesn't make any difference for this team last year. Allen Robinson can't stop the run. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacReady Posted October 27, 2020 Share Posted October 27, 2020 Just now, packfanfb said: I already answered this. Yeah, you said you'd give up two starters for one starter. You decided to give up 2 more points per game to score one more point per game. #zeroperspective Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacReady Posted October 27, 2020 Share Posted October 27, 2020 Just now, beekay414 said: Yes, we have. We don't just have one good WR. Thanks for playing. Again. Allen Robinson doesn't make any difference for this team last year. Allen Robinson can't stop the run. And he can't block either. Lol. Rodgers had like 2 seconds to throw in that Championship game and he thinks making the OL worse and the WR better changes that game. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
packfanfb Posted October 27, 2020 Share Posted October 27, 2020 (edited) 7 minutes ago, Outpost31 said: Alright, so who is your starting guard all of last year against the best DL in football in the Championship game? And who was your starting safety? Due to less protection, you gain maybe 1 point per game. Green and Redmond at safety last year and you're giving up 3 more points per game. Congratulations, we now lose before we get to the Championship game. What if I told you that losing Turner actually means you lose Turner? What if I told you that losing Amos actually means you lose Amos? Who are you replacing those two starters with? Hard to answer the first two questions because again, if we spend that capital on Robinson, the butterfly effect occurs and maybe we draft differently (another G or S perhaps). But, you would have started with Lane Taylor (not knowing whether he was about to suffer a season-ending injury or not at the time). Plus, wasn't Turner our worst OL last year, by a pretty decent margin, prompting us to kick him out to OT anyways? Hell, go with Patrick there. Safety -- probably a draft pick along with Savage or a cheaper FA, journeyman type player. Drop down from Amos? Sure, but let's not act like Amos has been an all-pro. He's been good. Here's the method to my madness (which you of all people should agree with): With Mike Pettine as our DC, I would rather have a team like 2011 -- meaning an outstanding offense that has the ability to at least keep us in games (i.e. the Chiefs), because the alternative is to sacrifice on offense to build up the defense, which we have seen over the last few years that we can keep adding as many top guys as we want -- they still play for Mike Pettine. There's a hard ceiling there in terms of our defense. It will never be a top unit under Pettine, ever. So why not go the other way and give Rodgers a top unit of weapons again? That's why I would favor Robinson over some of these other guys. Edited October 27, 2020 by packfanfb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vegas492 Posted October 27, 2020 Share Posted October 27, 2020 3 minutes ago, Outpost31 said: Alright, so who is your starting guard all of last year against the best DL in football in the Championship game? And who was your starting safety? Due to less protection, you gain maybe 1 point per game. Green and Redmond at safety last year and you're giving up 3 more points per game. Congratulations, we now lose before we get to the Championship game. What if I told you that losing Turner actually means you lose Turner? What if I told you that losing Amos actually means you lose Amos? Who are you replacing those two starters with? I'll play.... Starting safety is.....Redmond. Clearly downgrade...especially with a rookie FS next to him. Starting guard is....Patrick? Turner wasn't great last year, so maybe that is a wash...but that is one huge "maybe". But now we have another WR. In a game when San Fran ran all over us and our offense was hardly on the field...and when it was, it couldn't block. That move would have made no difference in that game. Prior games or the whole year? Man. I'm trying to spin this so that it is a plus to have Robinson. But Amos is the steady influence in that secondary. I don't see Robinson moving the needle for wins more than what we got with Amos and Turner. 13 wins is tough to improve upon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacReady Posted October 27, 2020 Share Posted October 27, 2020 Just now, vegas492 said: I'm looking at that 2014 draft...it emphasizes a few things.... Lions took Ebron at TE at #10 overall. When you draft a TE that high, you usually end up missing out on others players that actually help wreck games. They missed out on.....Taylor Lewan, T. Odell Beckah, WR. Aaron Donald, DT. Kyle Fuller, CB. Next tight end off of the board was Austin Seferian-Jenkins. He went to Tampa. #38 overall. Jace Amaro went #49 overall to the Jets. Troy Niklas went #52 overall. They all missed out on Davante Adams, Allen Robinson, Jimmy Garapollo and Jarvis Landry. Maybe we shouldn't complain about not taking a TE high ever again. And man, that was a great WR class. Evans, OBJ, Cooks, Adams, Robinson, Landry. The misses were Watkins, Benjamin, Marquise Lee, Jordan Matthews and Latimer. Thinking that was the year we got Adams, Abbrederis and Janis. I have been saying this for 10,000 years. You got great receivers, inside linebackers, tight ends and **** OL/DL/EDGE/CB/QB and it means **** all. You get your ILB in two spots: 3rd-undrafted or FA> You get your WR in one spot: 2nd-4th with occasional 5th-7th flyers. You get your TE in one spot: 2nd-undrafted You get your IOL in one spot: 2nd-undrafted You put your big money and big pick investments into big money, big pick positions. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
packfanfb Posted October 27, 2020 Share Posted October 27, 2020 8 minutes ago, Outpost31 said: Yeah, you said you'd give up two starters for one starter. You decided to give up 2 more points per game to score one more point per game. #zeroperspective I mean that's just an opinion, which is fine. You value Amos/Turner more than Robinson. Cool. I don't. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacReady Posted October 27, 2020 Share Posted October 27, 2020 Just now, packfanfb said: Here's the method to my madness (which you of all people should agree with): With Mike Pettine as our DC, I would rather have a team like 2011 -- meaning an outstanding offense that has the ability to at least keep us in games (i.e. the Chiefs), because the alternative is to sacrifice on offense to build up the defense, which we have seen over the last few years that we can keep adding as many top guys as we want -- they still play for Mike Pettine. There's a hard ceiling there in terms of our defense. It will never be a top unit under Pettine, ever. So why not go the other way and give Rodgers a top unit of weapons again? That's why I would favor Robinson over some of these other guys. Name one single time in NFL history that method has worked. Once. Just one single time. Any year. In any year since the Super Bowl has happened, name one single team that has won the Super Bowl after putting all their chips into offense. Go ahead and try it. It's gonna be fun because I already know which teams you're going to list and I already know why you're wrong. I want Super Bowl wins. You want offense. There's a distinct difference. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Packerraymond Posted October 27, 2020 Share Posted October 27, 2020 14 minutes ago, Outpost31 said: How. Answer how. If it's as easy as you constantly act like it is to have a 30 million dollar QB, elite EDGE defenders, an elite DL, an elite LT, an elite WR, legit safeties, legit corners, legit OL, elite RB, elite backup RB... If it's that ****ing easy you should be able to tell me how the Packers could fit an extra 5 million in cap space last year and an extra 16 million in cap space this year. Your complete and total lack of perspective and how the salary cap and draft capital game works is getting old as hell. A gm cannot **** out cap space and vomit draft capital. Sub out Graham and Amos/Turner. Sub in Robinson. Boom, easy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacReady Posted October 27, 2020 Share Posted October 27, 2020 Just now, packfanfb said: I mean that's just an opinion, which is fine. You value Amos/Turner more than Robinson. Cool. I don't. It's an opinion backed up by 52 years of Super Bowls without a single outlier. That's cool you want to get to Championship games though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vegas492 Posted October 27, 2020 Share Posted October 27, 2020 1 minute ago, Outpost31 said: I have been saying this for 10,000 years. You got great receivers, inside linebackers, tight ends and **** OL/DL/EDGE/CB/QB and it means **** all. You get your ILB in two spots: 3rd-undrafted or FA> You get your WR in one spot: 2nd-4th with occasional 5th-7th flyers. You get your TE in one spot: 2nd-undrafted You get your IOL in one spot: 2nd-undrafted You put your big money and big pick investments into big money, big pick positions. Yup. That draft reinforces that. I'd argue that you can take a WR in round one, if you are picking in the back third. But you do that only when the premium positions are gone or very iffy and you have a great WR staring at you. I'm argue, just a little, that even the second round is too high for a TE. I'm also not violently opposed to ILB with the back third of the first round. But again, there had better be no corner/DL/EDGE there that is close in a grade. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacReady Posted October 27, 2020 Share Posted October 27, 2020 Just now, Packerraymond said: Sub out Graham and Amos/Turner. Sub in Robinson. Boom, easy. Keep reading. Answer who your starting safety is. Answer who your starting RG is. Answer that and have a team that can GET to the NFC Championship game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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