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swede700

Week 10: VIKINGS (3-5) at Bears (5-4)

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40 minutes ago, Ozzy said:

Yeah Wonnum has played great but is great at pass rushing, needs to get better against the run and Holmes is better at the point of attack as of right now but sure that will change quickly.   

 

Mata'afa had his best game as a pro no doubt about it.  Sure Rashaad Coward on the Bears is awful and played really bad in that game, but still Mata'afa was outstanding getting pressure and showed real energy and quickness as a pass rusher.  Is wonderful for him, especially since he was cut and put on the Practice squad at one point this year, think if the Vikings lost him off of that move, would have been awful.  Kind of surprised he is not used more as a DT pass rusher on passing downs but was a little in that game.  Where has James Lynch been, has he been hurt these last two games, I have not seen him in there at all.  

And think if they had Kenny Willekes, would be just another promising young DL to use who plays with passion and intensity.

 

The D has been great and since they are without Holton Hill, Hughes, Dantzler and Harrison Hand that is wildly impressive.  Gladney has really played well and so has Boyd who looks very legit at times.  Chris Jones is a little bit of a weak link but hopefully they can get Hughes, Hand or Dantzler back soon.  With how they have looked Hill could easily be on his way out, Gladney in his short time is better than Holton Hill ever has been especially as a tackler.  Whatever they do with few corners on the roster, similar to the Saints playoff game last year.  They need to play like that more often, I love how they are mixing up the coverage and changing things up.  

 

Oddly enough Eric Wilson is better than Anthony Barr especially in terms of coverage.  Not sure what they will do with Barr since the NFL is going more 5 DBs on the field so that means two LBs and not sure Barr would be better out there than Wilson has been.  That will be hard to pay Eric Wilson next year, he is a legit starter in this league.  They might have to think about cutting Barr who was great years back but is simply not good enough in coverage compared to Wilson.

Extending Wilson and trading Barr would be the right move. Would save some money for a player who frankly makes more plays. I’m fine giving up a little in the run game, the DTs really need to be upgraded and that would do more to help than Barr. Not sure what Barr would fetch for trade comp with that injury and cap hit.

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6 minutes ago, vikingsrule said:

Extending Wilson and trading Barr would be the right move. Would save some money for a player who frankly makes more plays. I’m fine giving up a little in the run game, the DTs really need to be upgraded and that would do more to help than Barr. Not sure what Barr would fetch for trade comp with that injury and cap hit.

Yeah either way I doubt Barr would be out played by Wilson in the future with how the game is played now.  I have mentioned before I would not mind Barr playing more of a DE role, but I know Zimmer loves the guy and if he can pick up his level of play he is easily one of the best OLBs in the game.  But he would have to pick it up and stay healthy and greatly improve as a pass rusher or be used more as a pass rusher.  

Would not mind keeping him but moving on from him to keep Wilson would not be an awful idea, and Dye has looked solid as well and Cameron Smith when healthy has potential also.

 

Eric Wilson, Odenigbo and Anthony Harris are the big FAs this up coming off season obviously.  Anthony Harris has now done as well as he did last year but has been key in allowing Harrison to move around and Anthony play deep in coverage with allows Harrison flexibility.  Not sure we could just replace Anthony and no young safety on the roster looks like he could take his spot obviously.  Dozier and Hercules are free agents as well so would be very key to bring them back also.  

 

Odenigbo will be key also but honestly he has not done great this year, in a bigger role with more PT he has been productive but not dominant.  Then again getting a quality DL would be harder than getting a quality S in this draft.

 

2nd round they could get a variety of players who still could be on the board depending on how things turn out.  

Caden Sterns Texas JR
Andre Cisco Syracuse JR
Bubba Bolden Miami FL RS JR
Brady Breeze Oregon RS
Paris Ford Pitt RS JR
Isaiah Pola-Mao USC RS JR
JR Pace Northwestern
BJ Foster Texas JR
Shaun Crawford Notre Dame RS
Elijah Molden Washington
Richie Grant UCF

 

All can play with range and deep coverage and all would be around 2nd round potentially through the 4th round.  Sterns or Cisco could go 1st maybe but could also drop, would love Bubba Bolden with his range but does have an injury history.  LeCounte doubt he could get but would love, same with Holland.  Assuming Holland and Breeze declare on Oregon, both did sit out the season oddly enough, especially odd for Breeze very odd why he sat out this year, I can see Holland who is a 1st round pick.

 

With Harrison Hand curious if they would try him at safety, I think he could pull it off and has some size to him as a corner.  Especially with Boyd playing so well, he could be a future starter potentially along with Gladney and Hughes, then again Hughes plays better in the slot arguably as does Gladney who is a hell of a tackler and has been very tough and physical this year.
 

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6 hours ago, twotonebluenation said:

I love how fired up Zimmer gets on the sideline. Seeing him rip into the special teams coach, then seeing the special teams coach all fired up when they make a play. Awesome stuff. I was looking and saw how many picks you guys had this year and damn, it was a lot. Outside of Jefferson who else is looking the most promising this year? I have been reading that Gladney has not looked great.

Who the hell said Gladney did not look great?  Kid is legit, tough as hell, physical tackler and reads plays well and competes hard plus plays with emotion and passion.  Sure has got beat but around the line of scrimmage in the slot and on short passes he has done very well.  If kept in that slot and not asked to cover deep with his back to the ball he could do very well.  Arguably Gladney has played better tackling and making plays than Mike Hughes has at any point in his short injury filled career.  Also could argue Alexander never looked that good in the slot tackling that Gladney has especially the past few weeks.

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I think either trading or cutting Barr is just a hopeful wish for some people here.  I don't see it happening.  The reason Barr is valued is because of all the things he does at his size.  No, he doesn't make the splash plays, but I'm also not sure what Zimmer has to change about his defensive play-calling/scheme when Wilson is in there instead of Barr.  I imagine he does have to cover up some things because of the differences between Barr and Wilson, so Wilson may seem more effective from the outside looking in, but that may not be the case.    

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7 minutes ago, SteelKing728 said:

With the development of Mata'afa and Wonnum, we might not need to use a high pick DE this draft.

When have they ever used a high pick on a DE?  The last time the Vikings took a DE in the first 2 rounds was Erasmus James in '05.

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3 minutes ago, swede700 said:

When have they ever used a high pick on a DE?  The last time the Vikings took a DE in the first 2 rounds was Erasmus James in '05.

Well we traded a 2nd for Ngakoue, so they at least valued the position high enough to trade for an established player.

Plus, there was talk (rumorville) that we were looking at K'Lavon Chaisson in the draft if he was there and Jefferson was gone, I believe.

However, circumstances might have dictated that. Our history the last 15 years show otherwise.

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13 minutes ago, swede700 said:

When have they ever used a high pick on a DE?  The last time the Vikings took a DE in the first 2 rounds was Erasmus James in '05.

Traded a first and multiple thirds for Allen in 2008.

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Just now, vikingsrule said:

Traded a first and multiple thirds for Allen in 2008.

I don't consider them (along with Ngakoue that Steve mentioned) in the equation.  They didn't use a high draft pick on a young DE...both Allen and Ngakoue were developed players, not ones that had to be developed.

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11 minutes ago, swede700 said:

I don't consider them (along with Ngakoue that Steve mentioned) in the equation.  They didn't use a high draft pick on a young DE...both Allen and Ngakoue were developed players, not ones that had to be developed.

Failure to develop led to the Allen trade. Then they started hitting on the mid round DEs and that has worked out well the past decade. It helps when you get players with the longevity of Allen, Griffen and Robison to allow for backups to develop, in the case of Hunter and Odinigbo. Seems Wonnum is the only one of the drafted bunch who’s actually starting right away and essentially forced the Ngakoue trade.

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2 minutes ago, vikingsrule said:

Failure to develop led to the Allen trade. Then they started hitting on the mid round DEs and that has worked out well the past decade. It helps when you get players with the longevity of Allen, Griffen and Robison to allow for backups to develop, in the case of Hunter and Odinigbo. Seems Wonnum is the only one of the drafted bunch who’s actually starting right away and essentially forced the Ngakoue trade.

Wonnum actually had a similar rule to hunter in his rookie year i think except had was backing up better starters so maybe didn't play as much

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That Scott Chricton guy never did much for us though. I think we drafted him in the 3rd round in 2014.

I wonder what his issue was..

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On 11/18/2020 at 7:29 AM, vikingsrule said:

Failure to develop led to the Allen trade. Then they started hitting on the mid round DEs and that has worked out well the past decade. It helps when you get players with the longevity of Allen, Griffen and Robison to allow for backups to develop...

Ray Edwards too.

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