2022 DRAFT THREAD - QB’s Wanted

[lavar703]

2 minutes ago, J-ALL-DAY said:

If Jimmy G is your QB for 2021, what are your expectations for the team? 

Not much more than what they are with Heinecke. I expect Jimmy to miss some games if he’s here. 

[J-ALL-DAY]

1 minute ago, lavar703 said:

Not much more than what they are with Heinecke. I expect Jimmy to miss some games if he’s here. 

Him missing some games is almost a lock lol.

I see, I think he can get you guys to 10-7 or 11-6 with a shot at winning the division.

[turtle28]

10 minutes ago, lavar703 said:

Not much more than what they are with Heinecke. I expect Jimmy to miss some games if he’s here. 

I think it all depends on how good our D is, if Logan can be ready to go in the beginning of the year & how ready he is & if Samuel can stay healthy next year. Which is the case regardless of who our QB is. I’d also say if we got Wentz or Winston that it be similar to getting Jimmy G, maybe a bit better w/ Winston but the issue w/ Winston is maturity & if him and Ron can get a long.

If we can run the ball consistently & play good/great defense like the 49ers did in 2019 & 2021 with Jimmy G as their QB I think Jimmy G will have us as a playoff team we can win 9 to 11 games.
 

He’s a much more consistent passer than Heinicke from the pocket. Jimmy G compares to Kirk Cousins as a QB IMO or that level of QB, ranked somewhere in the teens. Heinicke is a bottom quarter of the league starter/good back up. Jimmy G is better than that, especially from the pocket.

Edited March 5, 2022 by turtle28

[turtle28]

6 minutes ago, J-ALL-DAY said:

Him missing some games is almost a lock lol.

I see, I think he can get you guys to 10-7 or 11-6 with a shot at winning the division.

[J-ALL-DAY]

3 hours ago, turtle28 said:

So stop being cowards and give us a 3rd rounder for him!!!!!!!!

[turtle28]

40 minutes ago, J-ALL-DAY said:

So stop being cowards and give us a 3rd rounder for him!!!!!!!!

I’d do it in a heartbeat if we don’t get Rodgers, Carr, Wilson or Watson.

[MacDog]

20 hours ago, e16bball said:

I feel like it’s relatively obvious that he has the highest ceiling. 

And having the lowest floor is largely irrelevant to discussion of his ceiling, though it may be true. I’m not particularly convinced that it is true, though — guys who can run and make plays outside the pocket have at least some ability to compete at the NFL level, even if they never move past the baseline provided by their physical gifts. Matt Corral has never demonstrated the ability to meaningfully read a defense, for example, and his physical capabilities are lesser than those of Willis. How is his floor higher?

So the most athletic guy has the highest upside, even if he can't read defenses? 

I don't think that is how this works, except on the internet.

[offbyone]

14 hours ago, J-ALL-DAY said:

If Jimmy G is your QB for 2021, what are your expectations for the team? 

No qb will matter if our defense doesn't start balling.  

[turtle28]

6 hours ago, MacDog said:

So the most athletic guy has the highest upside, even if he can't read defenses? 

I don't think that is how this works, except on the internet.

It’s more than that, Willis has the strongest arm too by far in this draft. From all accounts he’s a very grounded, great, mature person and a hard worker. He needs to sit this year to develop but I could see him developing into a top 10 QB w/in 5 years. 
 

That being said, I think Pickett becomes a top 10 type QB in sooner. If we drafted Pickett, I think there’s a chance he could start this year. He’s the most NFL ready QB in this draft in a pro style offense w/ Howell being the next one IMO.

Willis, Corral & Ridder, are QBs we’d want to run a more zone read/RPO type offense with as young QBs bc they’re not NFL ready in terms of reading defenses and working from the pocket IMO.

[e16bball]

12 hours ago, MacDog said:

So the most athletic guy has the highest upside, even if he can't read defenses? 

I don't think that is how this works, except on the internet.

I think implicit in the concept of “ceiling” is that it’s the best-case scenario for that player. If he becomes as good as he possibly can be, full stop, how good will he be?

To me, that involves isolating the things he can change/learn/grow/be taught from the things that are always going to be constant, that are just part of his natural traits and basic capabilities. In the “best case scenario” for any particular player, you are assuming that he will master the things that can be learned and developed and taught over time. Because that can happen. You cannot, however, assume that a player will magically learn to run faster, be more elusive, have a stronger arm, etc. Because that can’t happen. 

In short, their ceiling does hinge largely on their athleticism. With QBs in particular, it definitely also relies upon their natural intelligence and processing ability, and probably to some degree on their character/personality. In theory, I suppose a guy could develop leadership and charisma and work ethic and dedication to his craft — but I don’t really think that happens very much. You kind of are who you are, in that regard. 

Moving to Willis specifically, then, through the lens of his inherent (“constant”) traits, we know right off the bat that he has the strongest arm of these guys by a country mile. One of the stronger arms of all the guys that have come through the process. We know that he’s the fastest of all these guys, as well as the best runner — the quickest, most elusive, the best contact balance, etc. We know that people rave about his character (on and off the field) and his dedication to football. I don’t have much information about his natural intelligence, nor that of the other guys. That’s an unknown for me, having never met them. 

His negatives are that his accuracy comes and goes, that (relatedly) his footwork in the pocket leaves something to be desired, and that he plays in an offense that requires him to execute a highly scripted and schemed offense that is very simplified compared to NFL passing games and doesn’t require a lot of full-field reads.

[As to that last item, it should be noted for the record that the only guy I watched doing much in the way of effective full-field reads last season was Kenny Pickett. Corral and Willis both run that schemed-up RPO stuff, and Howell was basically reading one to two and then taking off all year.]

In any event, those are all things that can be coached. In terms of accuracy, I used to think that was largely a fixed variable, but Josh Allen has proven that with good coaching, an excellent athlete can refine his mechanics and become a more consistently accurate thrower. In terms of footwork, Patrick Mahomes has demonstrated that even guys with awful footwork coming into the league can clean that up (to some degree at least) and be superstars, especially if they have the ability to throw off various platforms and on the move/outside the pocket. And the truth is, the idea that lots of these guys come into the league “reading defenses” at an NFL level is a little naive. Yes, some (like Pickett) played in more pro-style offenses. But almost every player coming into the league is learning that skill on the fly, often for 10+ years before they master it. 

Willis is clearly the only guy in this class who is physically capable of reaching the level that guys like Mahomes and Allen and Herbert have reached. I don’t know if he’ll get there — but that’s not really relevant to the concept of a ceiling, is it? If we want to talk about what’s “likely,” we can start talking about projections and expected value and things of that sort. But ceiling is just what happens if it all clicks and he becomes the best player he’s possibly capable of being. And Willis’s is pretty clearly higher than the rest of these dudes this year. 

[ARTMONK HOF]

I wouldn’t hate these 4 picks:

1st Round- Malik Willis QB/Liberty

2nd Round- Roger McCreary CB/Auburn

3rd Round- Damone Clark LB/LSU

4th Round- Zamir White RB/Georgia

 

 

 

[turtle28]

17 hours ago, ARTMONK HOF said:

I wouldn’t hate these 4 picks:

1st Round- Malik Willis QB/Liberty

2nd Round- Roger McCreary CB/Auburn

3rd Round- Damone Clark LB/LSU

4th Round- Zamir White RB/Georgia

Depends on if we upgrade FS in FA for me. If we don’t upgrade FS in FA like I really think we should along with MLB, we really should take one of the FS prospects in round 2 or 3, or a MLB, or Vice versa.

Edited March 7, 2022 by turtle28

[ovfd55]

My gut feeling on the QBs information coming out of combine

Packers don't want to trade Rodgers,if they do it will be to Broncos.

Only 3 Vets QBs look to be tradable and they all have a big hang ups that going to prevent that from happening Soon
-Watson-Legal issues til at least April
-Jimmy G-Having Surgery so with holds deal
-Matt Ryan-Contract really prevents Falcons from doing anything til after June 1st

Bonus Wentz could be cut or traded if Colts find a way to get a better QB which doesn't look likely 

Free Agent
Trubisky-Most likely to come here and most connected to us but Giants  are a real threat with Bills connections

Dark Horse-Mariota if we lose out on Trubisky I'd expect Mariota to be the guy.

Draft
All I heard from Ron and GM is need a Vet so think going QB at 11 isn't likely but if we swing and miss on trades a Trubisky could see us trading back into late 1st and taking Ridder who has connections to the front office
 

[turtle28]

14 hours ago, ovfd55 said:

My gut feeling on the QBs information coming out of combine

Packers don't want to trade Rodgers,if they do it will be to Broncos.

Only 3 Vets QBs look to be tradable and they all have a big hang ups that going to prevent that from happening Soon
-Watson-Legal issues til at least April
-Jimmy G-Having Surgery so with holds deal
-Matt Ryan-Contract really prevents Falcons from doing anything til after June 1st

Bonus Wentz could be cut or traded if Colts find a way to get a better QB which doesn't look likely 

Free Agent
Trubisky-Most likely to come here and most connected to us but Giants  are a real threat with Bills connections

Dark Horse-Mariota if we lose out on Trubisky I'd expect Mariota to be the guy.

Draft
All I heard from Ron and GM is need a Vet so think going QB at 11 isn't likely but if we swing and miss on trades a Trubisky could see us trading back into late 1st and taking Ridder who has connections to the front office
 

I don’t think Trubisky is will go to the Giants bc they have Daniel Jones & he’d have to compete with him to be their starter.

If the Steelers don’t get Jimmy G (which I think they could) I think Trubisky is will go there to compete w/ Rudolph & Haskins for the starting job.

That leaves us with choosing between Bridgewater, Mariota, Tyrod or Winston.

Hurney signed Bridgewater to Carolina which means he could be an option for us. We considered trading for Mariota last year but either the Raiders didn’t want to trade him or they were asking too much so we didn’t trade for him and we signed Fitz instead.

I think Winston re-signs in New Orleans. They seemed to like him there or at least they tolerated him, and he did well there with not turning the ball over which was a major improvement for him vs when he started in Tampa and had 30 ints a few years ago.

So in the end I think we either sign Bridgewater or Mariota and I lean towards Mariota. Now, I would hope we draft someone in round 1 as well, but Rivera, the Marty’s & Scotty may run it back with just Heinicke & Kyle Allen to compete with Mariota for the starting job. I wouldn’t be happy about that, but they may do that. 
 

If they don’t take a QB in round 1, I’m with @taylor made, I want Devin Lloyd unless we sign a FA upgrade at MLB. If we do get a FA LB like Demario Davis if he’s cut or someone else, then I hope we take WR like Olave or Garrett Wilson or Daxton Hill (FS Michigan).

[ripsean21]

As much as I hope we take Willis because his tools and his personality I think is the same reason I have a feeling about Ridder and his growth potential. I think Ridder with talent around him early if he gains confidence and wins early and learns to elevate and use his tools he can be a good player. Like the is true development potential.