Cardiac Cats at Cowboys, a winning GDT

[Rtnldave]

8 minutes ago, D82 said:

What? Playing "old-school" football is what Garrett tried to do for a decade. It didn't work. 

 

Okay, but I watched the Iggles do this going for it on every 4th down, going for 2 all the time etc. I worked 1 year out of 4. And I still say it was a fluke. Even at that, it's 25%. Not a very high percentage.

[resilient part 2]

23 minutes ago, Matts4313 said:

Maybe I am misremembering, but didnt you also make some sort of comment about benching DLaw for Parsons? Maybe that wasnt you. 

 

Just seems odd to me how so many people want to change a winning forumla. 

A Brown has not been a quality CB since he's been here. we have drafted CBs high up just to improve that area. A Brown has still not played overly well this season. taking him out some, wouldn't suggest to me that is changing a "winning formula" but rather saying, let's try to improve that unit if possible.

Edited October 5, 2021 by resilient part 2

[DaBoys]

1 hour ago, resilient part 2 said:

A Brown has not been a quality CB since he's been here. we have drafted CBs high up just to improve that area. A Brown has still not played overly well this season. taking him out some, wouldn't suggest to me that is changing a "winning formula" but rather saying, let's try to improve that unit if possible.

I mostly agree but Joseph is a rookie currently on IR. He can’t play right now.

 

Also Joseph was horrible in preseason so... idk

[Nextyearfordaboyz]

1 hour ago, Rtnldave said:

Trust the process.

How'd that work out for the 76ers? 

All those 1st rounders and the only guy they are keeping is Joel.

I know it's a different sport, but the phrase "the process" is just another sorry euphemism drummed up to mask stupidity.

What gets me is how many people keep buying this ish.

Trust it when they hoist Vince for the 6th time. Until then, play smart, sound, fundamental football. Know your assignment, execute, beat your guy and move on.

You do that and they can do nothing about it.

Process over outcome is literally (and I mean literally) fundamental to any sort of long term or repeatable success.

Knowing your assignment and executing consistently is not counter to good process… it’s part of it.

As is making mathematically sound decisions, like being aggressive on 4th downs.

[Rtnldave]

6 hours ago, Nextyearfordaboyz said:

Process over outcome is literally (and I mean literally) fundamental to any sort of long term or repeatable success.

Knowing your assignment and executing consistently is not counter to good process… it’s part of it.

As is making mathematically sound decisions, like being aggressive on 4th downs.

Okay, let's see how that works out for them. I want to make note that if they start turning the ball over on downs or not converting 2 points over the kicking the 1 and it begins to cost them, who will NOT complain and remind themselves that it is all part of the process?

I already know the answer. Everyone will blame the HC or perhaps the play calling. But the process will remain.

You described your point very well, and I agree with your definition of the process and how executing is all a part of it.

But that, to me, sounds like a convienent excuse for defending an ideal rather than the reality of if the aggressiveness that goes with using the process should backfire, admitting that maybe we got too cocky or aggressive and it hurt us.

You see, I have learned 1 thing about thus team in 25 years. No matter how talented they are, they always found a way to F it up.

I'm just hoping you are right and this doesn't turn out to be the thing that kills them in the end.

[Nextyearfordaboyz]

3 hours ago, Rtnldave said:

I'm just hoping you are right and this doesn't turn out to be the thing that kills them in the end.

I’ve used this analogy before, but it’s the best way I can think of to explain it:

Let’s say you are playing Blackjack, and you get dealt a 19. You hit, and the dealer gives you a 2. Did you make the right decision?

No, you didn’t. You made the wrong decision that ended in an advantageous outcome in the short term. In the long run, you are going to lose a lot of money hitting on 19s.

That’s why you should applaud good decisions, regardless of whether they work out or not. You can’t look at one outcome and think “that didn’t work, so it was stupid”. We are dealing with uncertainties here. You make the best decision you can with the information you have.

The Cowboys don’t make every decision right, by my estimation. But a lot of “old football” has been proven wrong. The math is clear on 4th down aggressiveness.

[resilient part 2]

13 hours ago, DaBoys said:

I mostly agree but Joseph is a rookie currently on IR. He can’t play right now.

 

Also Joseph was horrible in preseason so... idk

👀 though I read he was off the IR. feeling this BIG right now. 

[resilient part 2]

Want to announce that I am officially with-drawing from Gambling. I set aside some "play money" and I had hope to grow it. I came so damn close for 3 weeks in a row, yet every week I would lose one single game. Now I have no play money left and refuse "cash out" any more from my Savings..

It was both fun and very stressful. 

My full attention and Football gratifications will now be solely on Dallas. 

Go DALLAS!!

[Texas_OutLaw7]

16 minutes ago, resilient part 2 said:

Want to announce that I am officially with-drawing from Gambling. I set aside some "play money" and I had hope to grow it. I came so damn close for 3 weeks in a row, yet every week I would lose one single game. Now I have no play money left and refuse "cash out" any more from my Savings..

It was both fun and very stressful. 

My full attention and Football gratifications will now be solely on Dallas. 

Go DALLAS!!

Should have invested in SHIBA instead

[resilient part 2]

14 minutes ago, Texas_OutLaw7 said:

Should have invested in SHIBA instead

Wow.. apparently you are right. 

[Rtnldave]

8 hours ago, Nextyearfordaboyz said:

I’ve used this analogy before, but it’s the best way I can think of to explain it:

Let’s say you are playing Blackjack, and you get dealt a 19. You hit, and the dealer gives you a 2. Did you make the right decision?

No, you didn’t. You made the wrong decision that ended in an advantageous outcome in the short term. In the long run, you are going to lose a lot of money hitting on 19s.

That’s why you should applaud good decisions, regardless of whether they work out or not. You can’t look at one outcome and think “that didn’t work, so it was stupid”. We are dealing with uncertainties here. You make the best decision you can with the information you have.

The Cowboys don’t make every decision right, by my estimation. But a lot of “old football” has been proven wrong. The math is clear on 4th down aggressiveness.

I LOVE the analogy. As I teacher I live for these things. And I appreciate how clearly you put your POV.  But I will stand by my last post. If these aggressive moves prove to cost them a game or a seeding spot or whatever, I am going to hold you, and others that support it, to your views today.

Edited October 5, 2021 by Rtnldave

[Rtnldave]

6 hours ago, resilient part 2 said:

Want to announce that I am officially with-drawing from Gambling. I set aside some "play money" and I had hope to grow it. I came so damn close for 3 weeks in a row, yet every week I would lose one single game. Now I have no play money left and refuse "cash out" any more from my Savings..

It was both fun and very stressful. 

My full attention and Football gratifications will now be solely on Dallas. 

Go DALLAS!!

Glad to hear it Res. Funny thing though, isn't odd that week in and week out some group of people that nobody ever sees on TV or hears on radio can arbitrarily come up with a series of numbers that involves 22 grown men at any given time and several officials, weather conditions, injuries, personal lives, illnesses of all individuals involved and, darn it, they ALWAYS come out on top in the end. Otherwise they would cease to exist.

[Matts4313]

🤪

This conversation makes my head spin, tbh. 

[Nextyearfordaboyz]

2 hours ago, Rtnldave said:

I LOVE the analogy. As I teacher I live for these things. And I appreciate how clearly you put your POV.  But I will stand by my last post. If these aggressive moves prove to cost them a game or a seeding spot or whatever, I am going to hold you, and others that support it, to your views today.

Already twice this season (LAC and Carolina), we have had 1st quarter, 4th down conversions in our own territory, on eventual TD drives. Are you going to factor those into your calculations about playoff seeding? Who knows what happens in those games if we punt instead.

I’m sure an aggressive call will bite us at some point. When you are dealing with uncertainty, you can’t be right every time. You try to make decisions that maximize your chances of being successful. In a short, idiosyncratic season, it won’t always work out.

So no, my views on the decision making will not change. That’s the point. I don’t kick myself when I stand pat on 19 and later find out that the next card was a 2.

[Rtnldave]

12 minutes ago, Nextyearfordaboyz said:

Already twice this season (LAC and Carolina), we have had 1st quarter, 4th down conversions in our own territory, on eventual TD drives. Are you going to factor those into your calculations about playoff seeding? Who knows what happens in those games if we punt instead.

I’m sure an aggressive call will bite us at some point. When you are dealing with uncertainty, you can’t be right every time. You try to make decisions that maximize your chances of being successful. In a short, idiosyncratic season, it won’t always work out.

So no, my views on the decision making will not change. That’s the point. I don’t kick myself when I stand pat on 19 and later find out that the next card was a 2.

Well, using your analogy, if you stayed at 19 and won, I guess you wouldn't kick yourself. If you lost and found out the next card was a 2 and you could have won by a point, I guess you would.

But again, let's see how this plays out. Because we were losing by 1 at halftime. Granted, it didn't matter in the 2nd half because we beat them in every way a team could get beat. 

But there are better teams ahead then Car. 

And I know this forum. If we go up 13 to 7 in a tight game against a quality opponent, better than Car, and go for 2 and blow it, like the 2 times we didn't convert this week, and the other team goes down and scores and wins 14 to 13 and now we go from hosting a Div game to a WC game, many on here will be calling for McCarthy's or Moore's head.

That's when I am calling BS and saying, nope it's all about the process.

In short, you like being aggressive, I like playing it safe. As to which one is smarter? Time will tell.