Joe Barry'd again

[incognito_man]

5 minutes ago, Packerraymond said:

 Great NFL defenses are multiple. Base 3-4 has more weight in the front 7 than a base 4-3. Get the right personnel on the field and get your team playing gap disciplined football. 

Talking past each other. 

The larger point is we're small on defense too much and our run defense suffers from that enough that it's probably costing us games

[Mr. Fussnputz]

8 minutes ago, MacReady said:

It's really not. The 3-4 naturally taxes the IDL considerably more. We need to stop acting like there's not a difference. Every defense making waves is adding more beef on the line. They're not doing anything unique otherwise. The names are meaningless. Their philosophies are not.

The 3-4 was created on the context of confusion. The confusion is gone.

I remember Don Shula (yeah, it was a long time ago!) explaining the 3-4 concept. It was predicated on playing a zone pass defense. Against the run you had a 7 man front. If it was a pass, 3 of the 4 LBs dropped into zone to cover 3 of the 4 shallow zones. The 4th LB blitzed. The QB and O-Linemen didn't know which one it would be. The fourth shallow zone was occupied by one of the DBs, and the other 3 DBs took the three deep zones. How they rotated that was part of the confusion. Shula claimed that with 7 people in those zones, it would be almost impossible to complete a pass. Sure. 

The key was having 3 biggies inside to stop the run. Barry has gotten far away from that concept. If Barry keeps running his 2-4 defense, we're going to see 100 yard rushers every week, our defense will be gashed and gassed. You're absolutely right. He's asking our D-line to do the impossible. The man must be dumb as a box of rocks.

[MacReady]

11 minutes ago, Packerraymond said:

 Great NFL defenses are multiple. Base 3-4 has more weight in the front 7 than a base 4-3. Get the right personnel on the field and get your team playing gap disciplined football. 

Barry can’t do any of those things.

Too many subs for a player to get into the game. Subs should be for a breather only. Stick to 11 players, sub when necessary. Gotta let them get a feel for their opponent and just keep them fresh. Barry seems to think he needs to sub players all game. I watched for LVN every single play last night. There was no rhyme or reason to which snaps he played.

He clearly can’t get them to play disciplined gap football, either.

Simplify pressure and run stopping predicated on beating the guy across from you. Get creative with pass coverage.

Those are what good defenses do.

[Packerraymond]

Just now, MacReady said:

Barry can’t do any of those things.

Too many subs for a player to get into the game. Subs should be for a breather only. Stick to 11 players, sub when necessary. Gotta let them get a feel for their opponent and just keep them fresh. Barry seems to think he needs to sub players all game. I watched for LVN every single play last night. There was no rhyme or reason to which snaps he played.

He clearly can’t get them to play disciplined gap football, either.

Simplify pressure and run stopping predicated on beating the guy across from you. Get creative with pass coverage.

Those are what good defenses do.

I'm not arguing for keeping BArry, would've never been hired in the first place if it were up to me. We'd have Eviro. 

I'm saying the 4-3/3-4 debate is dead. Defenses are multiple now. We need a good DC and it won't matter what our base is. 

[MacReady]

28 minutes ago, Packerraymond said:

I'm not arguing for keeping BArry, would've never been hired in the first place if it were up to me. We'd have Eviro. 

I'm saying the 4-3/3-4 debate is dead. Defenses are multiple now. We need a good DC and it won't matter what our base is. 

And my point is… In order to be difficult as a defense, you do what teams don’t do.

No defense ever sparked the attention of the NFL by doing what every other team is doing.

 

[Isherwood]

Barry’s gotta go. Simple as 

[{Family Ghost}]

1 minute ago, Isherwood said:

Barry’s gotta go. Simple as 

It was the head scratcher of the year when LaFleur elected to keep the well below average, Joe Barry.  There were several proven good DC's available on the market and LaFleur signed up for more subpar coordinating from Joe Barry.  Kind of calls into question LaFleur's decision making and ability to head up an organization.

[ReadyToThump]

1 hour ago, Packerraymond said:

I'm not arguing for keeping BArry, would've never been hired in the first place if it were up to me. We'd have Eviro. 

I'm saying the 4-3/3-4 debate is dead. Defenses are multiple now. We need a good DC and it won't matter what our base is. 

The Packers base defense is the nickel, even in obvious run downs, and against teams that have ******* garbage QBs.

Joe Barry couldn't pour water out of a boot even if it had instructions written on how to on the heel.

[MacReady]

3 minutes ago, ReadyToThump said:

The Packers base defense is the nickel, even in obvious run downs, and against teams that have ******* garbage QBs.

Joe Barry couldn't pour water out of a boot even if it had instructions written on how to on the heel.

I’m actually a huge fan of the nickel being the base defense in today’s NFL.

But a 5-1-5 nickel.

Five down linemen, ideally with one of them being a prototypical 3-4 EDGE who can drop into a zone coverage (NEVER MAN COVERAGE) rarely and send a DB on a delayed blitz.

Get those gaps covered completely and allow a single off ball linebacker to clean up whatever gets through.

But doing what we do? With three linemen? Embarrassing.

[Bumski]

Different d coordinators, same ****. It's an organizational problem. 

[Striker]

No more retreads with no/limited history of success.

[MacReady]

8 minutes ago, Bumski said:

Different d coordinators, same ****. It's an organizational problem. 

This is correct. The mentality needs to change. Complacency and relaxation need to end. We need urgency and attitude.

[GHARMON9]

There's gotta be somebody out there who can just be a decent DC.

[FAH1223]

 

[MantyWrestler]

I long for the days of Tom Braatz bend but don't break scheme vs Joe Barry's bend but also break!