HighCalebR Posted April 20, 2023 Share Posted April 20, 2023 (edited) 4 hours ago, vegas492 said: Regarding Tonyan and being split out wide.... Without going backward in convo so far as im out on vacation.. Say Kincaid is big slot only, is it so easy for a slow moving big body to get open vs NFL LBs and Safeties when thats what theyre planning for, vs washington just sneaking out on routes, running underneath **** with the occasional seam? Year 1 i dont think Kincaid is going to top his college production, whereas i can see Washington top his if he's getting the lionshare of the reps as hes ready to get dirty in line. Is ~200 yards "not even close"? Year 2/ real late into year 1 i agree kincaid could become that dude that becomes a weapon. Just think Washington is more useful with Watson eating the deep yards for us. Incoherent rambling >>> Dont see much production from either year 1. Edited April 20, 2023 by HighCalebR 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chili Posted April 20, 2023 Share Posted April 20, 2023 Piggybacking on the Luke Schoonmaker conversation, he does indeed looks very interesting. First of all he's a bit like Davis Allen as a runner after the catch, so he's a quite mediocre in that aspect however Schoonmaker has an impressive knack for finding soft spots on defences, he keeps popping up in spaces with no-one around him. He was gaining surprising separation at times prior to the catch so he may be quicker than he looks and has good awareness of his surroundings. You can see he has a good feel for the game. He also plays with decent level of physicality and looks like he should be able to hold up in run blocking. He's all round a very solid prospect. Regarding Mayer....I too think he is a bit of a plodder, he seems stiff and one-paced, doesn't have that spring in his step when he runs. I have noticed in his highlights he rarely creates separation. He's maximising everything he has to be highly effective at college level by building up his body, applying good route running, technique, effort and understanding of the game but at NFL level where defenders are faster, stronger and smarter whatever advantage he gained might just disappear and he will just becomes an ordinary TE prospect. You would be getting a good, safe and highly professional player but nothing more. That's my fear with him. Watching videos of Mayer and Schoonmaker back to back it's very clear that Schoonmaker is quicker and has a bit more wiggle. Despite being far less productive in college Schoonmaker may have a higher ceiling of the two. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beekay414 Posted April 20, 2023 Share Posted April 20, 2023 (edited) I watched Mayer for about an hour last night. I don't see this lack of separation issue. Just because he's known for being a contested catch savant doesn't mean he's not creating separation on other routes. I didn't see someone that had guys glued to him routinely. I saw someone that gave his QB plenty of windows. Edited April 20, 2023 by beekay414 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThatJerkDave Posted April 20, 2023 Share Posted April 20, 2023 1 hour ago, HighCalebR said: Without going backward in convo so far as im out on vacation.. Say Kincaid is big slot only, is it so easy for a slow moving big body to get open vs NFL LBs and Safeties when thats what theyre planning for, vs washington just sneaking out on routes, running underneath **** with the occasional seam? Year 1 i dont think Kincaid is going to top his college production, whereas i can see Washington top his if he's getting the lionshare of the reps as hes ready to get dirty in line. Is ~200 yards "not even close"? Year 2/ real late into year 1 i agree kincaid could become that dude that becomes a weapon. Just think Washington is more useful with Watson eating the deep yards for us. Incoherent rambling >>> Dont see much production from either year 1. I think that Washington profiles a lot like Bubba Franks or Marcedes Lewis. He is very big, and probably always going to be a better blocker than receiver. As rookies, Franks had 363 yards and 1 TD; while Lewis had 126 yards and 1 TD. Career wise Franks' highest yardage was 442, while Lewis topped out at 700. Both were fine players, they just didn't chew up yardage, and I wouldn't expect Washington to do that either. We have other guys to do that anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThatJerkDave Posted April 20, 2023 Share Posted April 20, 2023 1 hour ago, Brit Pack said: Simms has Branch as #3 on his list, sees him more as a nickel rather than a safety in many ways. Had both the Illinois kids as his top two. I would be happy with either one of those boys!!! Having said that I know Gute will select Branch!!!! Branch is one that will probably make me turn off the tv in disgust. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
packfanfb Posted April 20, 2023 Share Posted April 20, 2023 54 minutes ago, beekay414 said: I watched Mayer for about an hour last night. I don't see this lack of separation issue. Just because he's known for being a contested catch savant doesn't mean he's not creating separation on other routes. I didn't see someone that had guys glued to him routinely. I saw someone that gave his QB plenty of windows. He's the JSN of TEs for me. People aren't "wowed" by him because he doesn't run 4.5 in shorts, but he's a better football player. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
packfanfb Posted April 20, 2023 Share Posted April 20, 2023 (edited) 5 minutes ago, ThatJerkDave said: Branch is one that will probably make me turn off the tv in disgust. I don't think he's in serious consideration for 15. I would put him in the category with a guy like Mayer in that I'd be fine getting either one in the 20s and picking up an extra 2 or 3 in the process. Branch is a good football player, he's just not a good track and field athlete. Edited April 20, 2023 by packfanfb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vegas492 Posted April 20, 2023 Share Posted April 20, 2023 1 hour ago, HighCalebR said: Without going backward in convo so far as im out on vacation.. Say Kincaid is big slot only, is it so easy for a slow moving big body to get open vs NFL LBs and Safeties when thats what theyre planning for, vs washington just sneaking out on routes, running underneath **** with the occasional seam? Year 1 i dont think Kincaid is going to top his college production, whereas i can see Washington top his if he's getting the lionshare of the reps as hes ready to get dirty in line. Is ~200 yards "not even close"? Year 2/ real late into year 1 i agree kincaid could become that dude that becomes a weapon. Just think Washington is more useful with Watson eating the deep yards for us. Incoherent rambling >>> Dont see much production from either year 1. I see Kincaid and Washington as two very, very different players in the offense. Washington is Lewis without the old man strength and with the young man's legs. Kincaid is Lazard. In line blocking TE vs. Big Slot Kincaid....could probably push 450 yards receiving as a rookie in that role of Big Slot. Washington...maybe pushes 200 receiving yards as a rookie in that Lewis role. Over time? I think Kincaid is a 700-800 yard TE in that Big Slot role. Washington is a 400 yard TE in the Lewis role. And that is just me spitballing. Nothing concrete to go off of besides how those positions have been used in the past. The only thing that I have a question mark on is this....blocking "want it" or attitude from the Big Slot. We know Lazard had the attitude to get the job done. I don't know if Kincaid has that attitude to do the dirty work. Also, I don't know that he doesn't have that attitude. Just an unknown for me, whereas it was a known for Lazard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leader Posted April 20, 2023 Share Posted April 20, 2023 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PackFan13 Posted April 20, 2023 Share Posted April 20, 2023 (edited) Calling Kincaid lazard is an insult. He's not the same level blocker but he's much more dangerous as a pass catcher. Lazard is JAG without great hands or route running. He's a way better red zone threat and better with YAC too. Edited April 20, 2023 by PackFan13 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThatJerkDave Posted April 20, 2023 Share Posted April 20, 2023 16 minutes ago, vegas492 said: I see Kincaid and Washington as two very, very different players in the offense. Washington is Lewis without the old man strength and with the young man's legs. Kincaid is Lazard. In line blocking TE vs. Big Slot Kincaid....could probably push 450 yards receiving as a rookie in that role of Big Slot. Washington...maybe pushes 200 receiving yards as a rookie in that Lewis role. Over time? I think Kincaid is a 700-800 yard TE in that Big Slot role. Washington is a 400 yard TE in the Lewis role. And that is just me spitballing. Nothing concrete to go off of besides how those positions have been used in the past. The only thing that I have a question mark on is this....blocking "want it" or attitude from the Big Slot. We know Lazard had the attitude to get the job done. I don't know if Kincaid has that attitude to do the dirty work. Also, I don't know that he doesn't have that attitude. Just an unknown for me, whereas it was a known for Lazard. All that you said is why I want Washington. Hopefully not at 15, but I don't think I would be disgusted by that. Like Lazard, I think we can find a big slot later in the process. Lazard ultimately should have been drafted. But he is still probably going in the 5th or 6th. I don't think we need to use a first or second to find that kind of player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PackFan13 Posted April 20, 2023 Share Posted April 20, 2023 1 minute ago, Leader said: That would be idiotic. When did we get the 11th pick as well... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThatJerkDave Posted April 20, 2023 Share Posted April 20, 2023 2 minutes ago, Leader said: LOL! I don't like Johnston or Boutte, but that is certainly one way to re-stock the shelves. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThatJerkDave Posted April 20, 2023 Share Posted April 20, 2023 1 minute ago, PackFan13 said: That would be idiotic. When did we get the 11th pick as well... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Guy Posted April 20, 2023 Share Posted April 20, 2023 8 minutes ago, PackFan13 said: Calling Kincaid lazard is an insult. He's not the same level blocker but he's much more dangerous as a pass catcher. Lazard is JAG without great hands or route running. One of them proved they belong in the NFL and earned a really nice contract. The other is going to be a 24-year-old rookie who played in a weak conference in college that is not known for covering anybody. Nothing particularly against Kincaid, but he's got pretty high bust potential given his lack of size for an NFL TE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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