Cwood is a nerd and so are all the Packer Favorite Prospects: 2023 Draft Discussion Thread

[Malfatron]

42 minutes ago, skibrett15 said:

oh, the james jones special!

Ding ding ding!

[vegas492]

1 hour ago, Old Guy said:

You have no idea the things he does in the running game. There aren't too many 6'5 235 lb WR's who are willing do to the things Lazard does. I'd give him MVS money for sure. Especially if we purge some salary and people this off season starting with Rodgers. 

You are right, at WR, there may not be many guys who give you what Lazard does in the run game.

Not so sure that you can't find a movement TE that could do those same things, though,

I really like Lazard, but I too am hesitant to pay him all that much money.  Not sure what number makes me feel good.  Maybe 6M.  Which means he will sign for 7.8M.

[MacReady]

I’d extend Lazard for 8. That’s it.

Anymore and you’re happy he got the money somewhere else, thank him for his effort.

He is absolutely the type of player you want on a team and you pay a little extra just to have that kind of player for a longer period of time.

Dude’s never once that I have seen shown any kind of hostility or selfishness or anything at all.

I’d rather have three Lazards at 8 million each than one Diggs or similar level WR at 24.

 

[Old Guy]

41 minutes ago, Outpost31 said:

I’d extend Lazard for 8. That’s it.

Anymore and you’re happy he got the money somewhere else, thank him for his effort.

He is absolutely the type of player you want on a team and you pay a little extra just to have that kind of player for a longer period of time.

Dude’s never once that I have seen shown any kind of hostility or selfishness or anything at all.

I’d rather have three Lazards at 8 million each than one Diggs or similar level WR at 24.

 

How about a Lazard, Doubs and Watson at much less than that next year? 

[Old Guy]

2 hours ago, vegas492 said:

You are right, at WR, there may not be many guys who give you what Lazard does in the run game.

Not so sure that you can't find a movement TE that could do those same things, though,

I really like Lazard, but I too am hesitant to pay him all that much money.  Not sure what number makes me feel good.  Maybe 6M.  Which means he will sign for 7.8M.

Name one ''movement" TE that can run routes like Lazard who you can get at the money I was suggesting? 

Kyle Pitts? Not sure he can block and he's been a major disappointment so far in his career. 

 

[MacReady]

11 minutes ago, Old Guy said:

Name one ''movement" TE that can run routes like Lazard who you can get at the money I was suggesting? 

Kyle Pitts? Not sure he can block and he's been a major disappointment so far in his career. 

 

Impossible. Pitts was that can’t miss TE prospect everyone here told me about. He’s elite.

[Brat&Beer]

4 minutes ago, Outpost31 said:

Impossible. Pitts was that can’t miss TE prospect everyone here told me about. He’s elite.

Don't know if Pitts could ever block. But as a rookie he had over 1000 yards receiving. Then nothing this year. He recently went on IR with a knee injury, so I suspect he was never really healthy this year. Kind of like Davante in his 2nd year. 

As for Lazard, he is on pace for about 800 yards and 7 TD's. Any reason he shouldn't at least get MVS-type money? 

 

[MacReady]

1 hour ago, Brat&Beer said:

Don't know if Pitts could ever block. But as a rookie he had over 1000 yards receiving. Then nothing this year. He recently went on IR with a knee injury, so I suspect he was never really healthy this year. Kind of like Davante in his 2nd year. 

As for Lazard, he is on pace for about 800 yards and 7 TD's. Any reason he shouldn't at least get MVS-type money? 

 

Look at Pitt’s targets. 110 targets in his rookie year. 68 catches.

He was good his rookie year because the Falcons made sure of it.

 

[Old Guy]

25 minutes ago, Outpost31 said:

Look at Pitt’s targets. 110 targets in his rookie year. 68 catches.

He was good his rookie year because the Falcons made sure of it didn't have any other options! 

 

Fixed it for you. 

[vegas492]

15 hours ago, Old Guy said:

Name one ''movement" TE that can run routes like Lazard who you can get at the money I was suggesting? 

Kyle Pitts? Not sure he can block and he's been a major disappointment so far in his career. 

 

I think you are overestimating how Lazard run routes.  He's fine.  But he's not a plus there.  IMHO.

He's physical and he will block at a high (plus) level.

Again, I'm not sure that you can't get a lot of that from a TE.  And just by rolling a TE out there instead of a WR, we would be changing the looks we get from the defense.  For better or for worse.

I guess I'm in the camp of wanting Lazard back, while also not wanting to pay him all that much money because he doesn't move the needle much in the passing game.  I view him as WR3 for next year behind Watson and Doubs.  There's value in him, I just don't know exactly how much value.

[mikemike778]

On 12/1/2022 at 10:36 PM, Old Guy said:

How about a Lazard, Doubs and Watson at much less than that next year? 

It depends on Watson's health and Doubs progress.

Lazard is a fantastic WR3. The guy you want in your team. Doesn't let you down and is a great blocker. But he isn't a weapon in the receiving game, he is a complimentary player. If you have two weapons and him as your WR3 then you are in a very good place.

He is probably going to want too much money for that role however.  But if Watson and Doubs can be your main receiving weapons then you save money to justify over-paying Lazard as that complimentary guy.

So yeah in theory Watson WR1, Doubs WR2 and Lazard Wr3 sounds great and you can give him more than the role justifies. But that's assuming Watson stays healthy and Doubs keeps developing. If they can't be genuine WR1/WR2 then doesn't work for me.

 

Edited December 3, 2022 by mikemike778

[beekay414]

On 11/25/2022 at 1:33 PM, beekay414 said:

Not sure if he'll come out this year but I'm a big fan of Tulane RB Tyjae Spears.

Bump

[Mazrimiv]

On 12/1/2022 at 1:22 PM, Old Guy said:

You have no idea the things he does in the running game. There aren't too many 6'5 235 lb WR's who are willing do to the things Lazard does. I'd give him MVS money for sure. Especially if we purge some salary and people this off season starting with Rodgers. 

I think there's a real possibility that Lazard will not have much of a market, and GB will essentially be bidding against themselves.  MVS was always going to have a market because of the way he stretches the field.  I don't think the same can be said for Lazard and his blocking.

[mtsportsfan1]

26 minutes ago, Mazrimiv said:

I think there's a real possibility that Lazard will not have much of a market, and GB will essentially be bidding against themselves.  MVS was always going to have a market because of the way he stretches the field.  I don't think the same can be said for Lazard and his blocking.

I've said it and seen it said before , why can't we move him to TE . his speed would play , question is can block well enough to play TE ? This team needs more speed and would like to see it at the wr room.

[Zycho32]

1 hour ago, mtsportsfan1 said:

I've said it and seen it said before , why can't we move him to TE . his speed would play , question is can block well enough to play TE ? This team needs more speed and would like to see it at the wr room.

You should probably clarify the question further; "why can't we move him to a traditional Y-Tight End?"

The reason for that clarification is these days, Tight Ends are typically just part of the receiver packages, except for when they are in their traditional Y Role alongside the tackles on the line. That role expects a genuine hybrid of blocking and receiving, but the modern offenses of today- really since the days of Kellen Winslow Sr- tend to eschew that particular responsibility, or at the very least, place their biggest and slowest TEs in that specific slot, much like what we do with Marcedes Lewis.

Playing the 'Y' as opposed to split out carries a key difficulty, and that's in the diet of defenders you will be asked to block. Lazard in general has feasted on secondary players and the occasional linebacker, but as a 'Y', it will be D-Linemen and Linebackers. Remember, Lazard's height and weight are on the lower end of what TEs are supposed to weigh, and mass matters a good deal when it comes to blocking. Otherwise, Lazard's role on offense may not be any different whatsoever.

There's actually a historical precedent when it comes to the Packers. Know of Gary Knafelc? He was one of the Packers who was part of Lombardi's early half of the 60's Dynasty, and was in fact on the team since the mid-50's, but Lombardi put him through some culture shock. See, the Packer offenses of the 50's were strictly T-Formation, but strictly with both ends split out and three backs in the backfield. At least, I've found no true evidence that they employed a true Pro Formation. That came when Lombardi arrived, and with it, the Tight End role. Knafelc(who was an inch and twenty pounds lighter than Lazard) jokingly said his weight was 230-ish, and was suddenly moved to Tight End. That said, he didn't really rise like a phoenix with the position change; he was a sometimes-starter, frequent-backup for the remaining four years he spent with the Packers.