Is Mayfield a first round QB???

[43M]

He definitely isnt the best QB prospect, nor do I think he is a definite first rounder, but the Manziel comparisons are silly.

If a team like the Steelers, Patriots or Saints took him in the late 20s, I think he would be in a good position to succeed going forward.

If a team like the Browns or Jets drafted him early in the draft, Id really have to question it....both the value and the decision based on where he is as a prospect.    

[VanS]

On 12/14/2017 at 1:31 AM, Iamcanadian said:

The difference between Manziel and Mayfield is like night and day. Manziel came from a wealthy family and had everything handed to him on a plater. Mayfield, because he was short, got passed over for a scholarship and had to work hard to prove he deserved one. Like a lot of short people and he is short by football standards, he carries a huge chip on his shoulder and won't back down from any competitive situation.

Have you ever watched him on the sidelines, he is a carbon copy of Brees, firing up his team just the way Brees does and his teammates would go to war for him. The pros love everything about him as a leader of men and how mentally tough he is when challenged. The only knock on him is his height, something that will be settled at his measurables at the Combine. He could possibly come in at under 6' and that always worries scouts and GM's when they draft QB's.

He is going in the 1st round, how high is the question??? My guess is somewhere in the teens, which for a short QB, is quite an accomplishment, that Brees and Wilson could not do???

Brees was an average QB before being paired with Sean Payton. 

Are you thinking that Mayfield is gonna get paired with an offensive genius like Sean Payton? And will he also get to play most of his games inside of a dome like the Saints where his weak arm and small hands won't get exposed by the cold weather during the month of December?

 

I find it humorous that Mayfield is being hyped as the next Drew Brees when Brees had a very lackluster career before ending up in New Orleans with Sean Payton.

 

 

[YogiBiz]

16 minutes ago, VanS said:

Brees was an average QB before being paired with Sean Payton. 

Are you thinking that Mayfield is gonna get paired with an offensive genius like Sean Payton? And will he also get to play most of his games inside of a dome like the Saints where his weak arm and small hands won't get exposed by the cold weather during the month of December?

 

I find it humorous that Mayfield is being hyped as the next Drew Brees when Brees had a very lackluster career before ending up in New Orleans with Sean Payton.

 

 

You mean the same QB who was playing with LT (when the Chargers literally gave him the ball 35+ times a game)? He was efficient, did not turn the ball over frequently, and he moved the ball downfield? He was topping 3000 yards passing in a season when that number was still considered great (before this offensive renaissance we are experiencing now where 4k+ is the standard for QBs). He only has one season in his entire career with more picks than touchdowns (his second season starting). I cannot stand idly by while one of the games greats is slandered.

[VanS]

1 hour ago, YogiBiz said:

You mean the same QB who was playing with LT (when the Chargers literally gave him the ball 35+ times a game)? He was efficient, did not turn the ball over frequently, and he moved the ball downfield? He was topping 3000 yards passing in a season when that number was still considered great (before this offensive renaissance we are experiencing now where 4k+ is the standard for QBs). He only has one season in his entire career with more picks than touchdowns (his second season starting). I cannot stand idly by while one of the games greats is slandered.

If Brees was so great at San Diego they why did they draft/trade for Philip Rivers in the 1st round of the 2004 draft and then let Brees leave via free agency 2 years later?

Not exactly how an all-time great gets treated.

Look, I'm not disrespecting Brees.  I'm simply stating facts.  He was not the same player in San Diego that he became in New Orleans.  Greatness is just as much a byproduct of the players around you and the system you play in than your own latent talent.  Very few players can accomplish the same level of greatness regardless of where they go and who they have around them.  Brees went from a not so ideal situation in San Diego where he was only an average QB into a great situation in New Orleans where he developed into a Hall of Famer.  He was paired with a coach that was perfect for his skill set.  And he played  most of his games in the controlled climate of the Superdome which helped cover his limitations as a player when it came to arm strength.  There is a reason the Saints have historically struggled with Brees outside of the Dome versus when they play at home.

Its not disrespect to say Drew Brees was not the same player in San Diego that he developed into in New Orleans.

 

[BleedTheClock]

Can we stop only comparing Mayfield to other short QB's? I'm interested....if Mayfield did everything the exact same way and were 6'4, what would his comparison be? We wouldn't be hearing Drew Brees or Johnny Manziel, that's for sure.

[Iamcanadian]

3 hours ago, VanS said:

Brees was an average QB before being paired with Sean Payton. 

Quote

No, he wasn't, he had shown real signs of developing into something special until he got hurt and San Diego just wasn't sure he would come back 100%!!!

Are you thinking that Mayfield is gonna get paired with an offensive genius like Sean Payton? And will he also get to play most of his games inside of a dome like the Saints where his weak arm and small hands won't get exposed by the cold weather during the month of December?

Quote

Why not, HC with great QB's usually end up being pretty solid!!! It is extremely unlikely that a team, not in a Dome or at least in a warm climate, would draft him. He has an excellent chance to get drafted by one of the ones I mentioned. AlsoI do not get where you got the idea he had a weak arm, every scouting report on NFL.com says his arm is solid and we will not know his hand size till the combine???

 

I find it humorous that Mayfield is being hyped as the next Drew Brees when Brees had a very lackluster career before ending up in New Orleans with Sean Payton.

Quote

See above in quote #1, please get your facts straight!!!

 

 

 

[thebestever6]

Mayfield will be a first round qb. Whether he's worthy of it remains to be seen. I could see him rising up draft boards as we move through the college playoff. This has a Vince Young type of feel to it. And although he might be flawed if he doesn't get exposed he'll be a sure fire first rounder. 

I'd love for him to be a franchise qb and he has a stinker against Georgia and drops. That would be awesome. Not comfortable spending anything other than a late first on him.

[Chiefer]

5 hours ago, VanS said:

If Brees was so great at San Diego they why did they draft/trade for Philip Rivers in the 1st round of the 2004 draft and then let Brees leave via free agency 2 years later?

Not exactly how an all-time great gets treated.

Look, I'm not disrespecting Brees.  I'm simply stating facts.  He was not the same player in San Diego that he became in New Orleans.  Greatness is just as much a byproduct of the players around you and the system you play in than your own latent talent.  Very few players can accomplish the same level of greatness regardless of where they go and who they have around them.  Brees went from a not so ideal situation in San Diego where he was only an average QB into a great situation in New Orleans where he developed into a Hall of Famer.  He was paired with a coach that was perfect for his skill set.  And he played  most of his games in the controlled climate of the Superdome which helped cover his limitations as a player when it came to arm strength.  There is a reason the Saints have historically struggled with Brees outside of the Dome versus when they play at home.

Its not disrespect to say Drew Brees was not the same player in San Diego that he developed into in New Orleans.

 

Wasn't Bree's starting over Rivers until he hurt his shoulder? They even franchised him to start over Rivers amd offered him a 50 mill contract despite dedicating a ton of money to Rivers already.

The reason he went to NO over Miami iirc was that Miami didn't think his shoulder would recover

[Rich7sena]

8 hours ago, BleedTheClock said:

Can we stop only comparing Mayfield to other short QB's? I'm interested....if Mayfield did everything the exact same way and were 6'4, what would his comparison be? We wouldn't be hearing Drew Brees or Johnny Manziel, that's for sure.

If Mayfield were 6'4" he'd be a completely different player. His size informs his athleticism, which informs his play style.

Quote

If Brees was so great at San Diego they why did they draft/trade for Philip Rivers in the 1st round of the 2004 draft and then let Brees leave via free agency 2 years later?

@VanS Brees wasn't developing according to plan when the Chargers drafted Rivers. Once they did, a light went on and he quickly ascended to become one of the best quarterbacks in the league. If he didn't hurt his shoulder, there would have been a legitimate debate about which player the Chargers would keep.

[thebestever6]

18 minutes ago, Rich7sena said:

If Mayfield were 6'4" he'd be a completely different player. His size informs his athleticism, which informs his play style.

@VanS Brees wasn't developing according to plan when the Chargers drafted Rivers. Once they did, a light went on and he quickly ascended to become one of the best quarterbacks in the league. If he didn't hurt his shoulder, there would have been a legitimate debate about which player the Chargers would keep.

If he didn't hurt his shoulder they would of gotten a kings ransom in a trade. Like think better than Cutler from the Broncos.

[Iamcanadian]

20 hours ago, thebestever6 said:

Mayfield will be a first round qb. Whether he's worthy of it remains to be seen. I could see him rising up draft boards as we move through the college playoff. This has a Vince Young type of feel to it. And although he might be flawed if he doesn't get exposed he'll be a sure fire first rounder. 

I'd love for him to be a franchise qb and he has a stinker against Georgia and drops. That would be awesome. Not comfortable spending anything other than a late first on him.

Realistically, every player drafted in round 1, carries a wait and see thing. Nobody is a sure thing and Mayfield will go round 1 and yes, like the other 1st rounders, we will have to wait and see, so what???

I see him getting drafted in the teens after Darnold, Rosen and Jackson go top 5.

[thebestever6]

40 minutes ago, Iamcanadian said:

Realistically, every player drafted in round 1, carries a wait and see thing. Nobody is a sure thing and Mayfield will go round 1 and yes, like the other 1st rounders, we will have to wait and see, so what???

I see him getting drafted in the teens after Darnold, Rosen and Jackson go top 5.

Yes I agree but rarely do those late risers ever work out it seems. Young is a big one, Rg3 was a big one.

[Chargers]

On 12/15/2017 at 4:53 PM, YogiBiz said:

You mean the same QB who was playing with LT (when the Chargers literally gave him the ball 35+ times a game)? He was efficient, did not turn the ball over frequently, and he moved the ball downfield? He was topping 3000 yards passing in a season when that number was still considered great (before this offensive renaissance we are experiencing now where 4k+ is the standard for QBs). He only has one season in his entire career with more picks than touchdowns (his second season starting). I cannot stand idly by while one of the games greats is slandered.

Chargers fan here. He was awful his first few seasons and got benched for Doug Flutie.

[Chargers]

21 hours ago, Rich7sena said:

If Mayfield were 6'4" he'd be a completely different player. His size informs his athleticism, which informs his play style.

@VanS Brees wasn't developing according to plan when the Chargers drafted Rivers. Once they did, a light went on and he quickly ascended to become one of the best quarterbacks in the league. If he didn't hurt his shoulder, there would have been a legitimate debate about which player the Chargers would keep.

The only reason he started over Rivers in '04 was because Rivers held out and got no playing time when he returned. Brees was fantastic but VanS is right he wasn't the All-time great QB he is now.

[Iamcanadian]

On 12/16/2017 at 7:35 AM, Rich7sena said:

If Mayfield were 6'4" he'd be a completely different player. His size informs his athleticism, which informs his play style.

@VanS Brees wasn't developing according to plan when the Chargers drafted Rivers. Once they did, a light went on and he quickly ascended to become one of the best quarterbacks in the league. If he didn't hurt his shoulder, there would have been a legitimate debate about which player the Chargers would keep.

This is exactly what happened. Not only did he hurt his shoulder, but at the time their were strong rumors, that he might never completely recover and not be the same player he once was.