Commanders not picking up Young's 5th year option.

[naptownskinsfan]

20 minutes ago, lavar703 said:

Chase Young PFF 78.4

Casey Toohill PFF 64.9

Efe Obada PFF 55.5

JSW PFF 59.8

According to PFF they weren't roughly the same. Chase was graded as starter level the rest were graded as back up or replaceable.

Not trying to troll or piss anyone off, but have PFF’s grades gotten any more reliable, or at the very least, are they doing a knowledge test on their graders to sense if they really know their stuff or not. 

[lavar703]

9 minutes ago, naptownskinsfan said:

Not trying to troll or piss anyone off, but have PFF’s grades gotten any more reliable, or at the very least, are they doing a knowledge test on their graders to sense if they really know their stuff or not. 

This was just one example. I'm sure I could find more. 

[MikeT14]

23 minutes ago, naptownskinsfan said:

Not trying to troll or piss anyone off, but have PFF’s grades gotten any more reliable, or at the very least, are they doing a knowledge test on their graders to sense if they really know their stuff or not. 

Antonio Gibson is a 76.3 sooo....

[turtle28]

1 minute ago, MikeT14 said:

Antonio Gibson is a 76.3 sooo....

He’s a good player

[Slappy Mc]

2 hours ago, lavar703 said:

Chase Young PFF 78.4

Casey Toohill PFF 64.9

Efe Obada PFF 55.5

JSW PFF 59.8

According to PFF they weren't roughly the same. Chase was graded as starter level the rest were graded as back up or replaceable.

Yet we are still here at a situation where their stats are better than Chase's. By the way, I am not advocating for Toohill, Obada or JSW to be the longterm answer. I am however advocating that Chase doesn't appear to be the long term answer either; especially if he hasn't fully recovered from his injury. 

[Slappy Mc]

3 hours ago, turtle28 said:

For context, that was 1/2 a season in 2021 & none of them had 2 sacks taken away for bogus roughing the passer calls. Beyond that, when you watch the tape there’s an obvious difference in the impact Chase has on every play vs those other guys, even if he’s not getting the stats which is all you care about. Chase got a lot of pressures in his 1/2 of a season in 2021 which caused early throws, incompletions & interceptions. Film don’t lie

The allure of Chase Young being on the field doesn't matter much when he isn't getting the job done. Again, are we really going to argue that Chase's performance on the field warranted his 5th year option being picked up? Anyone who thinks his option should have been picked up has to be thinking of potential over production and that isn't the way the NFL works. 

[Slappy Mc]

3 hours ago, turtle28 said:

I don’t think people are in denial that that could happen, but I’m not going to openly suggest it could happen bc I’d like to think it won’t. We will see what happens, right now I’m not trying to think bad thoughts of another top 5 pick for this team never reaching his potential; Howard, Shuler, Westbrook, Lavar & RG3 come to mind and then Sean Taylor got killed.

I'm trying to think good thoughts until I now otherwise.

The underlined is a ridiculous statement. You know as well as I that isn't true.

You can continue to live in La-La-Land if you want, but at some point reality comes a knocking. 

[Slappy Mc]

2 hours ago, naptownskinsfan said:

Not trying to troll or piss anyone off, but have PFF’s grades gotten any more reliable, or at the very least, are they doing a knowledge test on their graders to sense if they really know their stuff or not. 

I don't mind pissing people off, especially when there is no objectivity to what is being said. The league is based off production, not potential. I'm sure the people upset about not picking up the option will blame Ron and Co for ruining Chase when he eventually fades out of the league. It's the natural cycle around here. 

*also I do apologize to those that are offended by what I say. Not here to make enemies, but some people have unrealistic perceptions of reality. 

[naptownskinsfan]

19 minutes ago, Slappy Mc said:

I don't mind pissing people off, especially when there is no objectivity to what is being said. The league is based off production, not potential. I'm sure the people upset about not picking up the option will blame Ron and Co for ruining Chase when he eventually fades out of the league. It's the natural cycle around here. 

*also I do apologize to those that are offended by what I say. Not here to make enemies, but some people have unrealistic perceptions of reality. 

Some guys have a ton of talent, but just can’t put it together.  Others make up for the talent with effort.  Others have the talent, but can’t stay healthy.  Ben McDonald with the Orioles comes to mind as the last one.  

[lavar703]

29 minutes ago, Slappy Mc said:

I don't mind pissing people off, especially when there is no objectivity to what is being said. The league is based off production, not potential. I'm sure the people upset about not picking up the option will blame Ron and Co for ruining Chase when he eventually fades out of the league. It's the natural cycle around here. 

*also I do apologize to those that are offended by what I say. Not here to make enemies, but some people have unrealistic perceptions of reality. 

You never piss me off dude. We have our difference of opinion on things and that’s what this forum is all about. I still enjoy talking football with you. The place would be boring if we all just agreed on everything. Everyone in our sub thread is great and I respect all of you guys. 

[turtle28]

35 minutes ago, Slappy Mc said:

I don't mind pissing people off, especially when there is no objectivity to what is being said. The league is based off production, not potential. I'm sure the people upset about not picking up the option will blame Ron and Co for ruining Chase when he eventually fades out of the league. It's the natural cycle around here. 

*also I do apologize to those that are offended by what I say. Not here to make enemies, but some people have unrealistic perceptions of reality. 

I’m not offended at all. I just don’t know how a player is supposed to produce stats when they tear an ACL & patella tendon. 
 

Giving up on players with potential seems to be the Washington way over the last 25 years, so I won’t be shocked if they kick him to the curb next year either.

[turtle28]

51 minutes ago, Slappy Mc said:

The allure of Chase Young being on the field doesn't matter much when he isn't getting the job done. Again, are we really going to argue that Chase's performance on the field warranted his 5th year option being picked up? Anyone who thinks his option should have been picked up has to be thinking of potential over production and that isn't the way the NFL works. 

I have said why I’d do it over and over. The 5th year option is cheaper than the franchise tag & it gives us more time to evaluate him. 
 

Of course I’m thinking of potential & the flashes he had as a rookie & some games in 2021 before he got hurt. He couldn’t produce the last year and a half bc he tore his ACL & patella tendon.

Do you except him to play through that injury? 😂 

Asking for production the last year & a half from Chase just doesn't make sense at all.

Edited April 27, 2023 by turtle28

[turtle28]

48 minutes ago, Slappy Mc said:

The underlined is a ridiculous statement. You know as well as I that isn't true.

You can continue to live in La-La-Land if you want, but at some point reality comes a knocking. 

No, I'm saying that I'm not in denial that Sweat & Chase might not be on this team after this year. At the same time, I'm open to the possibility that they'll both have a good season.

[Slappy Mc]

1 hour ago, lavar703 said:

You never piss me off dude. We have our difference of opinion on things and that’s what this forum is all about. I still enjoy talking football with you. The place would be boring if we all just agreed on everything. Everyone in our sub thread is great and I respect all of you guys. 

I echo everything you said. I have a ton of respect and even admiration for the mindset and opinions of all of our sub forum. I know I am usually the contrarian on things and am not just trying to be difficult. Its hard sometimes to see through the rose colored glasses with all the s*** we have been through. Finally getting rid of Snyder is a big start to healing.

1 hour ago, turtle28 said:

I have said why I’d do it over and over. The 5th year option is cheaper than the franchise tag & it gives us more time to evaluate him. 
 

Of course I’m thinking of potential & the flashes he had as a rookie & some games in 2021 before he got hurt. He couldn’t produce the last year and a half bc he tore his ACL & patella tendon.

Do you except him to play through that injury? 😂 

Asking for production the last year & a half from Chase just doesn't make sense at all.

The 5th year option is only cheaper if the player stays. Guaranteeing a 17.5M contract on potential alone is pretty dumb. The concept of him "having" to stay to evaluate is absolutely foolish. If he cannot produce this year you let him go. If he does produce, try for the extension or tag/tag'n'trade. Expecting someone to do what they have not done for their entire careers.

Injuries happen. It's also a really lame excuse. He did nothing in 9 games his sophomore season. Then refused to come back "on time" from his injury. His rookie season was good but nothing special. Chase Young the player may never get back to his rookie season form and that form wasn't dominant by any stretch of the imagination. Again, 12 games in the last two years: 31 tackles, 1.5 sacks and 2 FF. That just isn't getting it done.

1 hour ago, turtle28 said:

No, I'm saying that I'm not in denial that Sweat & Chase might not be on this team after this year. At the same time, I'm open to the possibility that they'll both have a good season.

I hope that they both have great seasons. I expect Montez to perform better than Chase. I hope it hasn't come off that I want them not on the team. Quite frankly, when Chase Young came to town I thought we were going to have the best D-Line the league had ever seen. They haven't come together yet. Allen and Payne seem to have figured it out on the inside and Montez was showing up more last season than he had in the past.

[Thaiphoon]

11 hours ago, turtle28 said:

For context, that was 1/2 a season in 2021 & none of them had 2 sacks taken away for bogus roughing the passer calls. Beyond that, when you watch the tape there’s an obvious difference in the impact Chase has on every play vs those other guys, even if he’s not getting the stats which is all you care about. Chase got a lot of pressures in his 1/2 of a season in 2021 which caused early throws, incompletions & interceptions. Film don’t lie

He really didn't, though. He only got 13 pressures in 9 games. As a comparison, the guy he was compared to coming out of college (Bosa) also had a shortened 2nd season. In his 2 games in 2020 (4x fewer games than Chase in 2021) he had 5 pressures. Oh and in 2021, the top players with pressures (playing all 17 games) were Myles Garrett (52) and TJ Watt (52) and Nick Bosa (49). Even if we double Chase's totals in 9 games, they still are roughly half of what the actual generational talent is producing.

So I'd look at the games in 2021 again. I complained a ton about him playing too upright and his choice of either a too anemic pass rush where he didn't really do much except play pattycake with the OT...or his rush up the field without any discipline style of play which resulted in huge first downs and TDs for the opposing team.