2nd Round Pick - S/CB Jartavius Martin

[RSkinGM]

13 hours ago, turtle28 said:

When they go 3 wide receivers its St. Juste in the slot.

Man, he doesn't fit the prototype. Tall guy . Seems it's usually a smaller quick guy. Throws to the slot are bam /bam quick. 

[turtle28]

6 hours ago, RSkinGM said:

Man, he doesn't fit the prototype. Tall guy . Seems it's usually a smaller quick guy. Throws to the slot are bam /bam quick. 

If you remember Rivera told the press in the spring they they liked Juice’s quickness & length in the slot. He’s also a good run defender so if a team runs at them when they’re in the nickel w/ 3 cbs, he does a good job playing the run bc he’s the size of a S.

[lavar703]

Rivera explaining why Quan Martin hasn't been playing. Also, Rivera explaining why he will never ever run another teams front office. 

[MKnight82]

16 hours ago, lavar703 said:

Rivera explaining why Quan Martin hasn't been playing. Also, Rivera explaining why he will never ever run another teams front office. 

Not a lot of what this guy said made sense. He talks about how Rivera hasn't drafted any of Washington's best players and then in the next sentence says Curl is one of our best players, who Rivera drafted. Then he's emphatic about how Martin won't have playing time as a Safety, but Martin played CB all throughout training camp and is even listed as a CB on the team's depth chart. He's crapping all over Rivera for supposedly taking a player that will never get playing time because of the players ahead of him, but you're talking about a position where you need lots of guys on the field all of the time. Every team needs at least two solid starting safeties and probably 4 good CBs. Just because you don't have an immediate need right now for a guy at that spot, if he's the BPA on the board when you're drafting you're supposed to take the BPA and not reach for need. It is very possible that Fuller is gone after this year, which opens up the slot CB position because Forbes and St Juste will be outside full time. 

I do not think strengthening important positions with quality depth is a bad draft strategy, which is what the Mathis and Martin picks were. 

He also repeated says Rivera has failed at multiple high priced free agent signings. What high priced free agent signings have we had in his entire tenure? I can think of only 2 bigger signings, Kendall Fuller (who has played well for us) and Curtis Samuel (up and down but not terrible). All of our other signing are for relatively cheap amounts. If anything we've been extremely frugal in free agency. 

Again he rants more about how the top of the roster was entirely inherited by Rivera which is just nonsense. The most important position on the team, our QB, Rivera drafted. He drafted all of our RBs. He drafted our #2 WR. He added our entire TE room to the roster. He signed our starting LT. He drafted our starting LG. He signed our starting Center. He drafted our starting RG. He signed our starting RT. Our entire depth chart at Oline was added by this front office. He drafted Chase Young. Cody Barton was signed by Rivera. Jamin Davis, drafted by Rivera. Fuller (signed by Rivera), St. Justed (drafted by Rivera), Forbes (drafted by Rivera). Both of our talented starting safeties, Forrest and Curl, oh hey they were drafted by Rivera. This guy is completely full of nonsense. 

[lavar703]

28 minutes ago, MKnight82 said:

Not a lot of what this guy said made sense. He talks about how Rivera hasn't drafted any of Washington's best players and then in the next sentence says Curl is one of our best players, who Rivera drafted. Then he's emphatic about how Martin won't have playing time as a Safety, but Martin played CB all throughout training camp and is even listed as a CB on the team's depth chart. He's crapping all over Rivera for supposedly taking a player that will never get playing time because of the players ahead of him, but you're talking about a position where you need lots of guys on the field all of the time. Every team needs at least two solid starting safeties and probably 4 good CBs. Just because you don't have an immediate need right now for a guy at that spot, if he's the BPA on the board when you're drafting you're supposed to take the BPA and not reach for need. It is very possible that Fuller is gone after this year, which opens up the slot CB position because Forbes and St Juste will be outside full time. 

I do not think strengthening important positions with quality depth is a bad draft strategy, which is what the Mathis and Martin picks were. 

He also repeated says Rivera has failed at multiple high priced free agent signings. What high priced free agent signings have we had in his entire tenure? I can think of only 2 bigger signings, Kendall Fuller (who has played well for us) and Curtis Samuel (up and down but not terrible). All of our other signing are for relatively cheap amounts. If anything we've been extremely frugal in free agency. 

Again he rants more about how the top of the roster was entirely inherited by Rivera which is just nonsense. The most important position on the team, our QB, Rivera drafted. He drafted all of our RBs. He drafted our #2 WR. He added our entire TE room to the roster. He signed our starting LT. He drafted our starting LG. He signed our starting Center. He drafted our starting RG. He signed our starting RT. Our entire depth chart at Oline was added by this front office. He drafted Chase Young. Cody Barton was signed by Rivera. Jamin Davis, drafted by Rivera. Fuller (signed by Rivera), St. Justed (drafted by Rivera), Forbes (drafted by Rivera). Both of our talented starting safeties, Forrest and Curl, oh hey they were drafted by Rivera. This guy is completely full of nonsense. 

You pick starters in the second round, not quality depth. And they aren’t quality depth because one can’t get on the field due to injuries and the other can’t get on the field because apparently he’s not good enough. 
 

Forbes has looked overmatched at this level so far. Obviously it’s not the end of the world because we’re only 4 games in but the rest of the draft has made zero contribution. That is not a good thing. 

As far as free agents go, my guess would be he’s referring to WJ3 and Wylie. Both of whom were/are major disappointments. 
 

 

[RSkinGM]

R R even owns the FG Kicker and the Long Snapper ! It's damn sure his team ! 

[MKnight82]

3 minutes ago, lavar703 said:

You pick starters in the second round, not quality depth.

You're supposed to pick the best player period. The good teams generally do this. 

4 minutes ago, lavar703 said:

And they aren’t quality depth because one can’t get on the field due to injuries

Not really fair this early into his career. 

4 minutes ago, lavar703 said:

the other can’t get on the field because apparently he’s not good enough. 

The other is 4 games into his professional career and has also been injured.

5 minutes ago, lavar703 said:

Forbes has looked overmatched at this level so far.

He's looked like a rookie at times and other times he has looked good. That is generally what rookies look like. 

6 minutes ago, lavar703 said:

Obviously it’s not the end of the world because we’re only 4 games in but the rest of the draft has made zero contribution. That is not a good thing. 

Not really sure what you were expecting 4 games into these guys careers? 

6 minutes ago, lavar703 said:

As far as free agents go, my guess would be he’s referring to WJ3 and Wylie. Both of whom were/are major disappointments. 

Neither were signed to large contracts. 

[RSkinGM]

7 minutes ago, MKnight82 said:

You're supposed to pick the best player period. The good teams generally do this. 

Not really fair this early into his career. 

The other is 4 games into his professional career and has also been injured.

He's looked like a rookie at times and other times he has looked good. That is generally what rookies look like. 

Not really sure what you were expecting 4 games into these guys careers? 

Neither were signed to large contracts. 

WJ3 $26 mill guaranteed. not chump change on that one .

[MikeT14]

5 minutes ago, RSkinGM said:

WJ3 $26 mill guaranteed. not chump change on that one .

Yeah his contract was bigger than Fuller's. 

[offbyone]

We shouldn't be starting Martin if he isn't ready, but we can't get him ready if we don't play him at all on defense.  He is active for games, so find a package or two he can handle and start getting him some snaps.  He doesn't have to learn the whole defense at once.  We don't need to throw him into the frying pan, but don't leave him on the shelf either.

What will really be a problem is when we need Martin because one of our outside guys gets nicked up and Martin isn't even ready.  

[lavar703]

34 minutes ago, MKnight82 said:

You're supposed to pick the best player period. The good teams generally do this. 

Not really fair this early into his career. 

The other is 4 games into his professional career and has also been injured.

He's looked like a rookie at times and other times he has looked good. That is generally what rookies look like. 

Not really sure what you were expecting 4 games into these guys careers? 

Neither were signed to large contracts. 

So we’re just hand waving away the fact that we wasted 2nd round picks two years in a row on players that were far down the list of needs? I mean, I guess there’s things you and I simply will never agree on concerning Rivera. You tend to think he’s done a good job and I don’t. It just is what it is. 

[Slappy Mc]

Honestly after last night, they better try him out at CB. We got torched by an 0-4 team with a run first QB. 

[Slappy Mc]

16 hours ago, lavar703 said:

So we’re just hand waving away the fact that we wasted 2nd round picks two years in a row on players that were far down the list of needs? I mean, I guess there’s things you and I simply will never agree on concerning Rivera. You tend to think he’s done a good job and I don’t. It just is what it is. 

I am 100% in agreement with you. I remember on draft day wanting to break my TV watching him draft DBs with our 1st two picks when those were not strong positions of need. O-Line/TE/LB any combination of those 3 with the first two picks made way more sense. 

[naptownskinsfan]

17 hours ago, lavar703 said:

You pick starters in the second round, not quality depth. And they aren’t quality depth because one can’t get on the field due to injuries and the other can’t get on the field because apparently he’s not good enough. 
 

Forbes has looked overmatched at this level so far. Obviously it’s not the end of the world because we’re only 4 games in but the rest of the draft has made zero contribution. That is not a good thing. 

As far as free agents go, my guess would be he’s referring to WJ3 and Wylie. Both of whom were/are major disappointments. 
 

 

WJ3 and Wylie come to mind.  But Rivera traditionally doesn’t spend in free agency.  His only two signings over $20 million in Carolina were Matt Paradis and one of the Kalil’s, who was a massive bust for them.  So he has a 50/50 split on that.  

WJ3 is indefensible, because they gave him the highest guaranteed contract for a DB that off-season, and they basically expected a guy who has played one way his entire career to play another way.  As the Eagles proved with Nnamdi Asomugha, it doesn’t work that way. 

[lavar703]

1 minute ago, Slappy Mc said:

I am 100% in agreement with you. I remember on draft day wanting to break my TV watching him draft DBs with our 1st two picks when those were not strong positions of need. O-Line/TE/LB any combination of those 3 with the first two picks made way more sense. 

The bad thing with the Forbes pick is I don't recall a young corner getting beat this badly and ending up being a good player? Like, I'm sure it's happened but I can't recall. And he's also out there making business decisions when it comes to tackling. Just an all around bad pick. Both of them. If you have to bench your first round pick to put the guy back in that you already had on the roster then you have no idea what you're doing picking players