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jetskid007

Why I believe Kirk Cousins will be a New York Jet

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20 minutes ago, JetsandI said:

It is not money they whine about. It is a faith for Cousins.  If Cousins turned out a FA bust, someone would absolutely complain about money.  Some of us don't think his talents for Jets are worth a gamble.  Some of us do. 

Well the people complaining about Cousins’ talent quite frankly are clueless. You’re not a risk when you’re pretty much never injured and will have thrown for 4,000yds in 3 straight seasons with a better than 2:1 TD:INT ratio in that time. 

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51 minutes ago, JetsandI said:

Depend on how many teams want him.  High 2nd round pick would be a good start. I can see Jaguars have no problem to give up 1st round pick since they may wind up in one of playoff selections (Draft).  Jets and Cardinals are too high to give up a 1st round pick.

Jags are going to need to pay a ton of their young defensive players soon. I think Eli on his 2 year $33M deal is a way better option for them. They'll likely get him for a late round pick. Then I'd draft a QB you think needs time to develop while still building your team through BPA.

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24 minutes ago, Bobby816 said:

Well the people complaining about Cousins’ talent quite frankly are clueless. You’re not a risk when you’re pretty much never injured and will have thrown for 4,000yds in 3 straight seasons with a better than 2:1 TD:INT ratio in that time. 

Its hard to argue with his numbers but hes not young and is essentially Tony Romo. McCown has blown us a few games this year but aside from that he has essentially been a net positive. Cousins is obviously better be 3 times the salary. We have to get better in quite a few areas. Do we trust Cousins could actually lead a team to a playoff victory? I really am not sure. 25 million is a heck of a lot for a 30 year old QB with really no history of being a winner. 

QB A: 2880 Yards 18TDs 8Int 96.7

QB B: 3289 Yards 21TDs 99.6

That is literally the difference between Josh McCown and Kirk Cousins. Kind of crazy. Not advocating McCown should be our starting QB next year but 25 Million on a QB hes got to be an absolute difference maker. I hope we look at the OL and add a pass rusher well before we attempt to make Kirk Cousins the ARod of the NFL. Kirk Cousins simply wont be anywhere near the difference hes going to cost without improving elsewhere.

Between Robby Anderson, Jermaine Kearse, and Quincy Enunwa, I feel confident whomever is behind center next year is going to have something legitimate to work with. I dont know if we really need to go the Cousins route. If he gets tagged we shouldnt even think twice and move forward to someone else. Jets have the ability to be very good next year and the AFC is not very good. Even the top two teams are not dominate by any means. Jets have a chance to be substantially better than most if they are smart with the investments. Let us pray...

Edited by ekill08x

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I'm all for it. I think the marketability is a huge draw and it puts the pressure on Kirk to produce, which he thrives on. Prior to the first year he was franchised I remember him screaming at his GM to get paid after a stellar game. He plays best when he has something to prove and I think the NY stage would be a perfect platform for that.

There were rumors a few years back that we attempted to trade for Kirk Cousins prior to his breakout year. And maybe more importantly... he did wear green and white at Michigan State...

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I’d take him in a heartbeat if he hits FA but I would definitely not trade for him as Washington would want a huge haul. 

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Can we win a Super Bowl with Cousins?

The Redskins struggle to produce winning seasons with him at the helm, so I’m inclined to think not.

all stats 

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A few thoughts on this situation.  Kirk is a very solid QB and one that is a fringe top 10 QB talent.  I think because of how bad the AFC has been we may have a shot with Cousins to sneak into the playoffs.  I've seen a few people mention contenders but lets all be real here that is just not realistic to think that Cousins makes us contenders.  It's one thing to sneak into the playoffs with him in a poor AFC, it's another to be contenders.  If we have to trade assets for him I can tell you right now I'm 100% out if that is the case.  I still prefer to draft a QB over paying a guy like Cousins but I've softened a bit on my stance of 100% no way to him though.

I could live with Cousins just for the fact that I can see 5-7 really good seasons left in him and we are desperate for an above average QB.  I hate having to make him the highest paid QB though knowing he hasn't been able to elevate his team to the playoffs but having that stability would be refreshing.  He's had talent around him even though Reed is oft-injured so people trying to defend him in that regard don't have much of a case IMO.  The best reason for signing him is one it's the most important position in sports and two we are desperate.  Signing him give us stability and ability to focus high draft picks in other areas of major need.  The FA market isn't loaded with good young talent this year so overpaying mediocre talent at lesser important positions doesn't really excite me either.  Even by signing Cousins we will still have room to add other talent so it won't cripple us by signing him which is also good.  Spending money in FA is a priority but with no premier names out there I'd be OK using it on a guy like Cousins more so then an average LT like Solder, who while being an area of need won't move the needle as much as Cousins.

I still think Jackson is going a gigantic steal to whoever lands him (if they commit the offense to his strengths) and being such a unique player he may be on the board when we pick.  He is really going to be evaluated harder than most and that could cause him to fall into our laps as someone will take a bust like Allen over him.  Either way we go I hope we have reason of optimism next year at the QB position because if we don't Mac immediately goes on the hot seat.

 

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42 minutes ago, GangGreen420 said:

Can we win a Super Bowl with Cousins?

The Redskins struggle to produce winning seasons with him at the helm, so I’m inclined to think not.

all stats 

I think you can win with Cousins at QB.  Don't think there is a question about that honestly.  The question is how much does he elevate the talent around him and how much talent can you get around him at such an extreme salary.  If you get paid that much you better be Brady/Brees/Manning where you can carry your team or if you can't you better be on a lesser salary where you can spend big time in FA like Jacksonville to load up on talent around poor QB play.  I don't see Cousins as an elite QB so if his salary is so large that you can't keep talent around him and have to let it walk in FA then that's how you become DET, WAS, etc with good not great QB's and can't get into the playoffs.  I think that is everyone's biggest fear with Cousins is that we have solid QB play and below average talent around him resulting in 8-8 and 9-7 seasons and no real playoff runs to speak of for the next 4-5 years.  It wasn't until the Saints had a special draft that they were able to add some cheap young talent and make a playoff run.  You better hit on your drafts if you are paying a QB big time money because that is really the only other way to add talent.

I'm all in on Jackson though.  I think Morton is a guy who can bring the talent out of him.  

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24 minutes ago, Rockice_8 said:

I think you can win with Cousins at QB.  Don't think there is a question about that honestly.  The question is how much does he elevate the talent around him and how much talent can you get around him at such an extreme salary.  If you get paid that much you better be Brady/Brees/Manning where you can carry your team or if you can't you better be on a lesser salary where you can spend big time in FA like Jacksonville to load up on talent around poor QB play.  I don't see Cousins as an elite QB so if his salary is so large that you can't keep talent around him and have to let it walk in FA then that's how you become DET, WAS, etc with good not great QB's and can't get into the playoffs.  I think that is everyone's biggest fear with Cousins is that we have solid QB play and below average talent around him resulting in 8-8 and 9-7 seasons and no real playoff runs to speak of for the next 4-5 years.  It wasn't until the Saints had a special draft that they were able to add some cheap young talent and make a playoff run.  You better hit on your drafts if you are paying a QB big time money because that is really the only other way to add talent.

I'm all in on Jackson though.  I think Morton is a guy who can bring the talent out of him.  

Hitting on draft picks isn’t the Jets specialty so there’s the first problem.

In a nutshell this post sums up what I’m thibking. He’s not worth the cap hit.

Just draft our guy. If he’s not there this year then so be it, we might as well wait another. If it’s Jackson or Mayfield cool, I don’t agree with it but if they flop then we get a new regime. So I don’t really care either way.

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It's amazing how much Kirk Cousins hate there is. Questioning his leadership seems kind of weak; it felt that way on Thursday night and it feels that way reading some of these comments. Here's a good article addressing the topic: http://www.nbcsports.com/washington/washington-redskins/kirk-cousins-leadership-theres-side-me-people-dont-understand

In regards to his play and lack of success: it's an argument that's absolutely warranted. He's 22-21-1 since becoming the full-time starter. He hasn't had that "big" moment yet. But also consider the team he's playing for and more importantly, the organization he's playing for. It's fairly clear he doesn't want to be there, and it's not like the defense/offensive line/running game have helped him out much. 

I think Cousins would be a younger, more consistent version of what McCown is right now.  While I don't see Cousins being the type of player who will be able to put the team on his back and carry us to the playoffs year in and year out, he's good enough to have us in the hunt every year. Heck even Drew Brees had 3 consecutive 7-win seasons, and only 6 of his 12 seasons in NO have resulted in 9-or-more wins. The highest paid player in NFL history is Matthew Stafford (my favorite QB in the league). Only 3-of-9 seasons have resulted in a winning record. Derek Carr is the second highest paid player and his overall record is 28-30 (1 season with winning record). You can argue that Kirk has been superior to both those players in terms of individual and team performance over the past 3 years... I get you'd like to see a player with winning and playoff pedigree, but Mark Sanchez had that and look how that turned out. It's not that simple to cite "he hasn't won" as a primary reason for not signing him... that's the case for 80% of starting QBs in the league. Bottom line is the team around the player needs to be there. Yes, $25-28 million per year is an insane number, but keep in mind that in 2 years from now, the new "bar" will be set at $30-35 million... that's just how this thing goes

Final note: I'm not necessarily saying that I'm 100% sold on Cousins, it's what I think will happen. Ideally I'd trade up for Darnold, but the likelihood of that being an option is very low. The last think Maccagnan will want to do is mortgage more draft picks on an unproven QB, and it's extremely possible that the top two teams (Browns, Giants) are unwilling to trade their pick even if we inquired. I also don't see him making the same mistake twice (Fitzpatrick saga) and will prioritize Cousins. If he's not available, then yes - I'd expect us to re-sign McCown and try to find a QB via draft. 

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no to cousins.   If you look at his numbers, he struggles mightily when trent williams goes out.  If the Jets are gonna sign him, we'd need to upgrade the line ASAP

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27 minutes ago, GangGreen420 said:

Hitting on draft picks isn’t the Jets specialty so there’s the first problem.

In a nutshell this post sums up what I’m thibking. He’s not worth the cap hit.

Just draft our guy. If he’s not there this year then so be it, we might as well wait another. If it’s Jackson or Mayfield cool, I don’t agree with it but if they flop then we get a new regime. So I don’t really care either way.

 

What price do you think Cousins should be paid (per year) on a 6 year deal? What number would be acceptable for you to sign him?

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2 minutes ago, bcb1213 said:

no to cousins.   If you look at his numbers, he struggles mightily when trent williams goes out.  If the Jets are gonna sign him, we'd need to upgrade the line ASAP

11 different offensive lineman this year and he's completed the ball to 15 different players. Dude is still putting up great stats.

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9 minutes ago, rdelaney89 said:

 

What price do you think Cousins should be paid (per year) on a 6 year deal? What number would be acceptable for you to sign him?

I think he has every right to ask for what Stafford got: 5 years, $135 million extension. His arguments are that he's the same age (6 months younger), has been every bit as successful (if not more) over the past 3 seasons and has a better winning record. Since he became a full-time starter, only two QBs have a better cumulative QBR: Brady and Brees. Also, for those who are complaining about his age... he's was the 16th youngest starting QB in the league, literally right smack in the middle. 

It's a risk, but I would be OK with it. The Jets can make the bold move to sign him to a front-loaded deal while the young players are still under team control, allowing his cap hit to dip in future years and to make it easier to get out of the contract if things don't go well. You're not going to be major players in free agency otherwise... the Jets primary objective will be to retain their own and allow their young players to grow into bigger roles. If you signed Kirk to a deal that paid him, say, $30 million year 1, you'd be in very good financial state in future years despite his hefty salary. 


 

 

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I think fare market for Cousins is about 5 year $140 million with 56 million guaranteed. The salary cap is going up 15% next year, and will likely continue to go up. Players like Russell Wilson will break through the $30 million per year market in their next contract. 

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