Is Deshaun Watson.. load managing?

[ThatJerkDave]

1 hour ago, ronjon1990 said:

Probably stiffness from not having routine therapeutic massages these days....

And I was led to believe that the massages were what was making him stiff...

[big_palooka]

11 minutes ago, J-ALL-DAY said:

So are you saying he does not want to play football any longer and he wants to just collect paychecks?

He's telling you he's a soft, entitled punk who is either taking his ball and going home. Or trying to get people fired. 

When someone shows you who they are, as this Watson has, take their word for it. 

[ET80]

14 minutes ago, J-ALL-DAY said:

Oh, so that is what it tells you? And it doesn't tell you that he realized all the times he risked his health may not have been worth it in hindsight?

You understand that he got paid for *doing* those things, right? You don't make him the 2nd highest paid QB behind Mahomes if he's NOT doing those things.

14 minutes ago, J-ALL-DAY said:

Watson was going to get paid regardless of him playing or not playing with a collapsed lung.

100% incorrect.

At the time he put himself through this, the narrative was completely different than what you remember towards the end of his Texans tenure.  That 2nd deal wasn't agreed upon until after the 2019 season, his 3rd year in the league - everything I talked about was during the course of the 2018 season, year 1 post-ACL tear. 

He flashed as a rookie in 2017, tore his ACL and had to prove he was back - so he had to play through every issue, because the knock on him coming out of Clemson was his durability (torn ACL as a Soph, concussions as a Jr - including one he played through when he beat Alabama) and he had to prove that narrative wrong. Had he not, the injury narrative is THE narrative on him - and players with injury histories don't ink the 2nd largest contract in NFL history.

14 minutes ago, J-ALL-DAY said:

So are you saying he does not want to play football any longer and he wants to just collect paychecks? 

That's part of it - he's got no incentive to do anything, really. He gets that $275mm regardless.

13 minutes ago, J-ALL-DAY said:

Okay, so say you believe he is trying to demand a trade or get people fired. Don't come with silly arguments saying that his best performance is still mediocre and he feels embarrassed to be on the field. 

 

I think you're conflating my original argument with someone elses (which actually does have merit as well).

My original argument was that he quit on a 2nd team - hence the effort to either get traded or get people fired. Tell me what is different between this and the Houston situation. 

[ThatJerkDave]

3 hours ago, MWil23 said:

Watson didn’t practice Monday through Wednesday with an ouchie on his shoulder. Who ever could have predicted that a guy who quit on his former Houston team, has been enabled with zero accountability, only came here for the paycheck, and then quit moments before the game last weekend despite being medically cleared would probably bail again going against a legitimate opponent?

What leverage do the Browns have?

What incentive to play does Watson have with almost 4 years left to get that next contract?

I feel bad for Kevin Stefanski and the fans. Jimmy Haslem and Andrew Barry are the worst things to happen to this organization since 1995.

Wake me up in 2027

I don't doubt anything besides the first sentence.  How do you know it is just an "ouchie" and not something more serious? We had some similar opinions about David Bakhtiari floating around, turns out, he is back on IR and needs another surgery.  

[MWil23]

Just now, ThatJerkDave said:

I don't doubt anything besides the first sentence.  How do you know it is just an "ouchie" and not something more serious? We had some similar opinions about David Bakhtiari floating around, turns out, he is back on IR and needs another surgery.  

He was diagnosed with a bruise

[MWil23]

Regardless who cares. He’s the boy who cried wolf. Maybe he’s actually hurt but he’s lost the benefit of the doubt. And yeah I flat out don’t like him.

[ThatJerkDave]

1 minute ago, MWil23 said:

He was diagnosed with a bruise

Fair enough.  And I realize that I came across as confrontational in my post, I apologize.  I literally didn't know.  And I am not about to carry water for Deshaun Watson.

[J-ALL-DAY]

3 minutes ago, ET80 said:

You understand that he got paid for *doing* those things, right? You don't make him the 2nd highest paid QB behind Mahomes if he's NOT doing those things.

100% incorrect.

At the time he put himself through this, the narrative was completely different than what you remember towards the end of his Texans tenure.  That 2nd deal wasn't agreed upon until after the 2019 season, his 3rd year in the league - everything I talked about was during the course of the 2018 season, year 1 post-ACL tear. 

He flashed as a rookie in 2017, tore his ACL and had to prove he was back - so he had to play through every issue, because the knock on him coming out of Clemson was his durability (torn ACL as a Soph, concussions as a Jr - including one he played through when he beat Alabama) and he had to prove that narrative wrong. Had he not, the injury narrative is THE narrative on him - and players with injury histories don't ink the 2nd largest contract in NFL history.

That's part of it - he's got no incentive to do anything, really. He gets that $275mm regardless.

I think you're conflating my original argument with someone elses (which actually does have merit as well).

My original argument was that he quit on a 2nd team - hence the effort to either get traded or get people fired. Tell me what is different between this and the Houston situation. 

LOL at you putting "100% incorrect" there. Um no, talented players like Watson get paid regardless. If the Texans would not have, some team would have traded for him and have given him a massive deal. Him not playing with a collapsed lung was not going to change that.

I'm telling you that your argument makes no got damn sense. WHY THE HELL DO YOU QUIT AFTER HAVING YOUR BEST PERFORMANCE WITH THE TEAM BEING 2-1? This isn't a case of the team being trash and him wanting to get out. The only reason they even have one loss is because of Watson. The Browns should have been 3-0 after the Titans game if Watson played even somewhat competent against the Steelers. You clearly have a different type of hate towards Watson but none of your arguments are making any sense. But if you think he's trying to get people fired, then I'm not going to comment on that since that is something I don't know to be true....or false. 

This is just more likely a case of a player thinking he can't go and something is wrong with him that the team doctors are not seeing or agreeing with. Again, not the first time this has happened and nor will it be the last time. Some Browns reporter said the type of injury Watson has can have a 2-6 week recovery time. I tend to believe that over any other conspiracy theory you guys throw around.

[MWil23]

1 minute ago, ThatJerkDave said:

Fair enough.  And I realize that I came across as confrontational in my post, I apologize.  I literally didn't know.  And I am not about to carry water for Deshaun Watson.

Nah man I didn’t take it that way at all 

[AZ_Eaglesfan]

Are we really pretending that a guy with a freaking shoulder bruise might harm himself long term so he needs to protect himself and not play? He isn’t playing with ligament damage…. It is a contusion. Derek Carr just started TWO games with an AC joint Sprain. Take a guess which one is more likely to end up with long term damage or serious injury while playing. 
 

The guy could easily take a shot for discomfort and play. He doesn’t want to. If you still think that is reasonable that is fine, but this is not a guy protecting himself from team doctors that are being ruthless. 
 

If that was my teams QB getting paid that money? I’d expect him out there ready to gut it out. But everything we have seen about Watson points to him only caring about one person… himself. Sorry Browns fans, but this is what you get for signing a loser like this. 

[NJerseypaint]

1 hour ago, lavar703 said:

This is the weirdest trade I have ever seen honestly. He's supremely talented and was on the cusp of top 5 QB play before he started sitting out. I just simply do not understand how he's gone from that to this? The talent didn't vanish. 

My guess is he's checked out entirely, like what else would explain it? His first few years in the league was electric, and he was basically carrying a very bad Texans offense (well him and Hopkins). Did he just stop putting the in work, like no longer watching film as diligently, studying the playbook, etc? Maybe he just Haynesworth-ed the Browns? This is just my speculation, but it's really the only explanation I have. That or BOB is a god.

[Soggust]

3 minutes ago, NJerseypaint said:

That or BOB is a god.

Underrated take.

Maybe BOB was the Tomlin-glue holding together Watson (AB).

Poor guy never got a fair chance. Just needed a bit more control.

[ET80]

21 minutes ago, J-ALL-DAY said:

LOL at you putting "100% incorrect" there.

No other way to say it to get my point across. But keep telling me the narrative wasn't that he was injury prone and that would impact his career. What do I know... I only sat here and argued against it daily. 
 

21 minutes ago, J-ALL-DAY said:

If the Texans would not have, some team would have traded for him and have given him a massive deal.

Not the 2nd richest contract in football history. Yeah, he'd get a lot of money but not what he ended up with.

Look at the hell and high water that Lamar Jackson had to go through to get his deal (which was actually LESS than what Watson got back when he originally signed with the Texans). Jackson had a BETTER resume than Watson, too - you're really going to sit here with a straight face and tell me that his injury history didn't factor into that stalemate? How many teams came calling for Jackson when the trade opportunity arose?

If you truly believe what you're saying (with the Jackson instance literally playing out just a few months ago) I simply cannot help you. You're choosing your own reality... one that is 100% incorrect.

21 minutes ago, J-ALL-DAY said:

I'm telling you that your argument makes no got damn sense.

Then you're simply not listening, and I don't suffer fools on this particular topic.

21 minutes ago, J-ALL-DAY said:

WHY THE HELL DO YOU QUIT AFTER HAVING YOUR BEST PERFORMANCE WITH THE TEAM BEING 2-1?

Because the team around him is collapsing, their best offensive player is out with a career altering knee injury, and that one performance wasn't exactly some ringing endorsement that Watson is prepared to carry that team beyond that one game.

You keep bringing up this 2-1 record - do you understand that we're not even 1/4 the way through? How many 2-1 teams went on to end up picking top 10? You're stating this 2-1 record as if they're playoff bound because of it, they got A win where he played his best. 2-1 is indicative of absolutely NOTHING at this point.
 

21 minutes ago, J-ALL-DAY said:

You clearly have a different type of hate towards Watson but none of your arguments are making any sense.

I'd argue that if you looked at Watson in his entirety of his career, the argument makes sense and follows a very distinct pattern of running away when things get tough. It also is very telling of clients represented by David Mulagheta (I mean, Jalen Ramsey got out of Jacksonville with a similar ploy). You're focusing too much on a single performance in a single season and ignoring other instances across the NFL because of a single game.

THIS makes no sense - throwing away the bigger picture because of one performance.

[Chrissooner49er]

12 minutes ago, AZ_Eaglesfan said:

Are we really pretending that a guy with a freaking shoulder bruise might harm himself long term so he needs to protect himself and not play? He isn’t playing with ligament damage…. It is a contusion. Derek Carr just started TWO games with an AC joint Sprain. Take a guess which one is more likely to end up with long term damage or serious injury while playing. 
 

The guy could easily take a shot for discomfort and play. He doesn’t want to. If you still think that is reasonable that is fine, but this is not a guy protecting himself from team doctors that are being ruthless. 
 

If that was my teams QB getting paid that money? I’d expect him out there ready to gut it out. But everything we have seen about Watson points to him only caring about one person… himself. Sorry Browns fans, but this is what you get for signing a loser like this. 

Like the Browns' previous QB? The one who put his health on the line to try and keep the Browns relevant? After playing through that injury all year long, he's kicked to the curb for this POS. 

I was a bit of a Browns fan for about as long as Baker was there. I cannot think of another player who loves the game and competition more than Mayfield. 

[AkronsWitness]

2 minutes ago, Chrissooner49er said:

Like the Browns' previous QB? The one who put his health on the line to try and keep the Browns relevant? After playing through that injury all year long, he's kicked to the curb for this POS. 

I was a bit of a Browns fan for about as long as Baker was there. I cannot think of another player who loves the game and competition more than Mayfield. 

Little bit of revisionist history here. Baker was the one who wanted to play when the coaches basically told him no because he was injured. He forced himself onto the field with a bum shoulder because he was in a contract year. He then proceeded to play horribly, take shots at the HC in the media and was released where he then went on to play for 3 other teams.

If Baker is any sort of lesson in this, its that Watson should NOT play unless he feels he can make all of the throws. Putting yourself out there with a bum shoulder trying to be Superman and throwing interceptions/missing WRs causing your team to lose is not valiant...its stupid.