Just Want A Title Posted March 5 Share Posted March 5 4 minutes ago, Karnage84 said: This makes sense. I'd still like to see us bring in another veteran like Kendall Fuller. We have proven CB in Cam Sutton who is much better as a zone-CB them than he is in man/press-man coverage. I think the Lions have to acquire a legit starting CB before the draft even if it means making a splash-signing. The cupboard is pretty much bare at CB partly thanks to Jeff Okudah being a bust. Personally, I think they need to sign a starter at CB and S. Kerby Joseph is way to inconsistent to be a starter. Chuck Clark might be an inexpensive option. Deep coverage isn't his strength but he has been pretty good VS TEs. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karnage84 Posted March 5 Share Posted March 5 2 minutes ago, Just Want A Title said: We have proven CB in Cam Sutton who is much better as a zone-CB them than he is in man/press-man coverage. I think the Lions have to acquire a legit starting CB before the draft even if it means making a splash-signing. The cupboard is pretty much bare at CB partly thanks to Jeff Okudah being a bust. Personally, I think they need to sign a starter at CB and S. Kerby Joseph is way to inconsistent to be a starter. Chuck Clark might be an inexpensive option. Deep coverage isn't his strength but he has been pretty good VS TEs. We play 33% man vs 66% zone (which is more man than a good chunk of the teams). We're still playing a decent amount of zone. Sutton is a veteran but he's not someone that I would consider to be "reliable". If we had a group of: Cam Sutton, Emanuel Moseley, Kendall Fuller going into the draft, then the Lions won't be forced to take someone and then put them in as a starter right away. Sutton arguably could be put on the bench with Moseley and Fuller starting week 1. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sllim Pickens Posted March 5 Share Posted March 5 20 minutes ago, Karnage84 said: We play 33% man vs 66% zone (which is more man than a good chunk of the teams). We're still playing a decent amount of zone. Sutton is a veteran but he's not someone that I would consider to be "reliable". If we had a group of: Cam Sutton, Emanuel Moseley, Kendall Fuller going into the draft, then the Lions won't be forced to take someone and then put them in as a starter right away. Sutton arguably could be put on the bench with Moseley and Fuller starting week 1. Not sure I would count on Moseley for anything at this point. He likely won't have much of an offseason for the second year in a row and will have played in a total of 6 games in the last two years and only 17 in the last three years. Injuries like that and time away make it difficult to come back and be nearly as productive. I think he is a solid depth piece and I assume the contract is cheap and very little guaranteed in case we need to cut him but I sure wouldn't feel good about him potentially being a starter. Fuller would definitely help it in that I think between the three of them along with some rookies and maybe another lower level free agent (Isaac Yiadom) would be a solid CB core for the year. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sllim Pickens Posted March 5 Share Posted March 5 36 minutes ago, Just Want A Title said: We have proven CB in Cam Sutton who is much better as a zone-CB them than he is in man/press-man coverage. I think the Lions have to acquire a legit starting CB before the draft even if it means making a splash-signing. The cupboard is pretty much bare at CB partly thanks to Jeff Okudah being a bust. Personally, I think they need to sign a starter at CB and S. Kerby Joseph is way to inconsistent to be a starter. Chuck Clark might be an inexpensive option. Deep coverage isn't his strength but he has been pretty good VS TEs. Kerby had struggles but I won't write him off yet. He was good his rookie year, just need to make sure he is working on the right things this offseason. Thats not to say we should ignore the position, but I don't think we need to sign a guaranteed starter to replace him, more so just some competition to push him in practice to be better. He has the talent and was a ball hawk at Illinois so I still feel like if we use him right and coach him up he will be a solid starter for us. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just Want A Title Posted March 5 Share Posted March 5 32 minutes ago, Karnage84 said: We play 33% man vs 66% zone (which is more man than a good chunk of the teams). We're still playing a decent amount of zone. Sutton is a veteran but he's not someone that I would consider to be "reliable". If we had a group of: Cam Sutton, Emanuel Moseley, Kendall Fuller going into the draft, then the Lions won't be forced to take someone and then put them in as a starter right away. Sutton arguably could be put on the bench with Moseley and Fuller starting week 1. For the first half of the year when we were playing a lot of zone coverage, Cam Sutton was pretty good. When they started asking him to cover WRs on on island, things started to go off-the rails. Especially if he was covering WR1. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just Want A Title Posted March 5 Share Posted March 5 1 minute ago, Sllim Pickens said: Kerby had struggles but I won't write him off yet. He was good his rookie year, just need to make sure he is working on the right things this offseason. Thats not to say we should ignore the position, but I don't think we need to sign a guaranteed starter to replace him, more so just some competition to push him in practice to be better. He has the talent and was a ball hawk at Illinois so I still feel like if we use him right and coach him up he will be a solid starter for us. Well, If what Deshea Townsend said is true about tackling (If you don't tackle, you won't play), Kerby Joseph is going to have a tough time seeing the field. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karnage84 Posted March 5 Share Posted March 5 1 minute ago, Just Want A Title said: For the first half of the year when we were playing a lot of zone coverage, Cam Sutton was pretty good. When they started asking him to cover WRs on on island, things started to go off-the rails. Especially if he was covering WR1. I tracked the snaps of man vs zone using PFF's sources week to week. I was under the impression that we had drastically altered our scheme later in the season. What I found was that wasn't really the case. Maybe there were specific circumstances but overall, we didn't drastically alter our coverage splits. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sllim Pickens Posted March 5 Share Posted March 5 11 minutes ago, Just Want A Title said: For the first half of the year when we were playing a lot of zone coverage, Cam Sutton was pretty good. When they started asking him to cover WRs on on island, things started to go off-the rails. Especially if he was covering WR1. Is what I remember later in the season is Kindle Vildor getting burned in man coverage against CeeDee Lamb, Jetta, TuTu Atwell and Brandon Ayuik. We were definitely worse in man coverage but the worst play was from Vildor. Sutton was not good, but he wasn't the reason we lost games. He was good enough. The fact we put Vildor on those guys in man coverage is the bigger issue, but it seems we keep guys on their side and don't follow #1 WRs. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just Want A Title Posted March 5 Share Posted March 5 4 minutes ago, Sllim Pickens said: Is what I remember later in the season is Kindle Vildor getting burned in man coverage against CeeDee Lamb, Jetta, TuTu Atwell and Brandon Ayuik. We were definitely worse in man coverage but the worst play was from Vildor. Sutton was not good, but he wasn't the reason we lost games. He was good enough. The fact we put Vildor on those guys in man coverage is the bigger issue, but it seems we keep guys on their side and don't follow #1 WRs. I think Cam Sutton might have had a lingering injury in the 2nd half of the season. There were times when he was really good, particularly in the first half of the year. He is a solid #2CB. You are probably correct about not moving our CBs around. You can do that when you have a decent group of CBs. Clearly, we don't have that. Cam Sutton isn't horrible. Like I said, he is very good in zone coverage and but isn't as good when he has to play man-coverage. However, he is solid CB2. If that is your best CB, stuff is going to happen and a lot of stuff did happen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just Want A Title Posted March 5 Share Posted March 5 (edited) The Giants didn't use the Franchise Tag on Xavier McKinney. He would go a long way towards settling down our secondary. Edited March 5 by Just Want A Title 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sllim Pickens Posted March 6 Share Posted March 6 So we have 5 days to work out deals with our own free agents before others can contact them and 7 days to get them signed before free agency officially opens. Will be interesting to see who we bring back. Glasgow and CJGJ have void years so if we can extend them, we won't take the dead money on this year if I understand it correctly (will be spread out over their new deal). We will not tender Jerry Jacobs so moving on from him which was expected. Also looks like we will not tender Dorsey so should have some new blood in the defensive backfield next year. I am guessing we will move quickly on signing at least one OG so if Glasgow or Jonah don't resign prior to March 11, then they likely won't be brought back similar to Jamaal Williams last year. We need to make sure we get our choice of OGs and not the left overs for at least one of our guard spots so expect this to be either handled prior to free agency or early on in free agency. I think we will move slower on WR since it isn't as huge of a need but likely will sign one and draft one or sign two to replace Reynolds and DPJ. It feels like that can be more of a value signing as free agency rolls along. ERFA's I am assuming we tender Houston, Awosika, Reynolds, and maybe Chase Lucas since they are cheap. I wouldn't be mad if we signed Houston to a 2 or 3 year deal. Its a risk because he has limited production but may be a way to save money long term by giving him a little more now. Will be interesting to see if we tender Benito Jones and Brock Wright. Assuming we won't tender Pittman but who knows since the staff seems to like him even though he hasn't done much. I would prefer to move on from Jones. Wright may not be worth the tender amount so maybe we can work out a deal before March 13 but if not a one year tender deal wouldn't be bad for a solid back up TE. Zylstra and Mitchell are still here so maybe we move on from Wright. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Louis Friend Posted March 6 Share Posted March 6 20 hours ago, Sllim Pickens said: Kerby had struggles but I won't write him off yet. He was good his rookie year, just need to make sure he is working on the right things this offseason. Thats not to say we should ignore the position, but I don't think we need to sign a guaranteed starter to replace him, more so just some competition to push him in practice to be better. He has the talent and was a ball hawk at Illinois so I still feel like if we use him right and coach him up he will be a solid starter for us. Kerby struggled when Walker was next to him and Jacob’s was playing. His play improved when both guys got benched. And still his production last year matched his play his rookie season despite all of that. This will be a big year for him to take that next step, but I have no idea why people believe he was the issue in that secondary. It was basically him, Sutton and Branch with a revolving door all around them. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just Want A Title Posted March 6 Share Posted March 6 (edited) 5 hours ago, Louis Friend said: Kerby struggled when Walker was next to him and Jacob’s was playing. His play improved when both guys got benched. And still his production last year matched his play his rookie season despite all of that. This will be a big year for him to take that next step, but I have no idea why people believe he was the issue in that secondary. It was basically him, Sutton and Branch with a revolving door all around them. I can only speak for myself on this. What I saw from Kerby Joseph was a regression in his tackling (both his willingness to tackle and his form), biting too hard on play-action fakes and too many late reactions. I was lucky enough to watch every game this year and it seemed like he was guessing and sometimes freelancing a little too much. At this point, he does one thing well--play as a single high safety. Also, going into a INT celebration dance in the middle of a live INT-return isn't really a sign of maturity and leadership. Edited March 6 by Just Want A Title Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sllim Pickens Posted March 6 Share Posted March 6 So Darious Williams is going to be cut by the Jags and would be a solid fit here. He was coached by Deshea Townsend last year and was found by Brad Holmes in LA back in 2018. Has ties to the team, familiarity with coaches and production. Being 31 should lead to a short deal but seems like he may be a better fit than Gilmore given he is a couple of years younger. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just Want A Title Posted March 6 Share Posted March 6 (edited) 44 minutes ago, Sllim Pickens said: So Darious Williams is going to be cut by the Jags and would be a solid fit here. He was coached by Deshea Townsend last year and was found by Brad Holmes in LA back in 2018. Has ties to the team, familiarity with coaches and production. Being 31 should lead to a short deal but seems like he may be a better fit than Gilmore given he is a couple of years younger. Given the number holes we have at CB I suspect the Lions are paying attention to everyone being released. He would be a solid fit and bring some much needed experience and be a big upgrade over Jerry Jacobs. Edited March 6 by Just Want A Title Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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