Shedeur Sanders is going to be...

[Daniel]

1 hour ago, Sugashane said:

 

Idk if that was aimed at me, but Sanders is far from a finished prospect, I think top picks are based more on potential and how well further development can improve them than being highly developed already. NFL coaches will want traits to fit their systems and so on but I think any NFL coach worth a damn needs to have the belief they can better develop the kid more than the college coaches. And I think KOC could fix some of his biggest issues. He's why I think McCarthy can become a decent annoyance in the NFCN.

I don't even think he is talked about as a remarkable talent or anything after the hype fell off as CO came back down to earth last year, but he is looked at as a top prospect in 2025 next year in large part because the QB class kind of sucks (barring someone making the Burrow jump out of nowhere). You even alluded to how the class isn't that promising, its a lot of raw unproven guys. If Sanders' OL isn't trash next season and he still has the fumbling issues or takes way too many sacks then he should keep getting knocked down for it.

I just think (before it was clear Sanders was returning) it was Williams and Maye, a big *** gap then Daniels, then a decent gap and Sanders as prospects. Next year Sanders might not have the excuses and drop. Or he cleans up some of his issues and jumps. Idk.

Nah.

[nagahide13]

I'm trying pretty hard to mentally separate him from his dad but Deion sure ain't makin' it easy. I'm not sold on Shedeur either positively or negatively yet. I like him for the most part, but really don't know what he actually is yet largely because Deion is such a terrible coach. Great recruiter though.

[Ozzy]

6 hours ago, Sugashane said:

As far as being under center basically all reports were that MIN was gunning for Maye, and he was in shotgun constantly. So clearly KOC isn't concerned that he couldn't coach a QB how to play under center. McCarthy was the back up plan, not the top choice. I think KOC would also be able to greatly improve Sanders' footwork and better teach him to take care of the ball.

As for throwing from the pocket, would JJ have been able to do that behind that borderline D2 OL? If he and Sanders were switched I have no doubt the sacks would have dropped dramatically and the concerns of pocket passing and system fit would be squashed, but likely flipped on JJ.

Regardless I'm not high on Sanders or McCarthy to be honest. I just think Sanders has the higher ceiling and have a lot of respect for KOC as a playcaller/offensive mind.

 

I honestly do not believe they were that sold on Maye, sure the connection to McCown made everyone think it was instantly Maye and yes if Maye would have fell in the draft and McCarthy went to the Patriots instead and Maye dropped to the Vikings they would have taken him and loved it.

But with how they talk about McCarthy already and his "emotional intelligence" leadership and way he communicates, I think they really liked him from a preparation and mindset standpoint and based on Dobbs last year not sure O'Connell wants anything to do with QB run game or RPO offenses and Maye is clearly a better runner and athlete than McCarthy and that was a big part of Maye's game at times was the QB run.

 

Not sure Sanders has a higher ceiling than McCarthy but Sanders is more proven and passer ready right now just based on volume.  But a lot of the throws Sanders makes are not pro style throws in a pro style offense.  McCarthy the limited passing he did do or even had to do which was not often, they were pro style throws in a pro style system.  

 

If anything Shedeur Sanders right now is like a very poor mans version of Caleb Williams.  Both similar size but Shedeur does not have near the natural arm talent Caleb has and cannot throw as creatively off platform and I would say Shedeur is not as good of an athlete as Caleb either.  Not as dynamic and again the arm talent is not even close to the same level.  Granted that could improve considering how much Shedeur has improved since he was a freshman already, but not sure he even becomes that elite of a QB.  Example is he going to go 10-2 and Colorado wins the Big 12 and he plays great next year?  Not so sure about that, is a lot more likely Colorado what loses 5-7 games potentially even in the Big 12.  He will have to greatly improve on a roster that is only slightly better than last year.  Crazy thing is Phil Loadholt is the OL coach on Colorado?  And Warren Sapp is a graduate assistant?  Will Loadholt be that good of coach when he has never coached OL in his life?  Who knows, but I still say a lot of those sacks is that offense and Shedeur holding onto the football too long trying to create.   Funny when they basically benched OC Sean Lewis as if he was the problem with that OL, San Diego State now has a fine head coach and his offense I am sure will do just fine out there.  

[Armbar]

1 minute ago, Ozzy said:

If anything Shedeur Sanders right now is like a very poor mans version of Caleb Williams.  Both similar size but Shedeur does not have near the natural arm talent Caleb has and cannot throw as creatively off platform and I would say Shedeur is not as good of an athlete as Caleb either.  Not as dynamic and again the arm talent is not even close to the same level

I don’t see how he’s like Caleb Williams at all. Caleb is a great prospect because of the things you mentioned. Mobility, off platform throws, arm strength.

Sanders is definitely overhyped. I think he plays a smart game and can have success in the league, but he’s not dynamic at all. And if you aren’t playing for the 49ers, you had better be a great playmaker with great traits in order to make it work at a high level. Can he start in the league? Probably. But there are 32 starting QB’s and only about 8 have a chance to really win each year. I don’t ever see Sanders being in that elite 8. 

[Ozzy]

3 minutes ago, Armbar said:

I don’t see how he’s like Caleb Williams at all. Caleb is a great prospect because of the things you mentioned. Mobility, off platform throws, arm strength.

Sanders is definitely overhyped. I think he plays a smart game and can have success in the league, but he’s not dynamic at all. And if you aren’t playing for the 49ers, you had better be a great playmaker with great traits in order to make it work at a high level. Can he start in the league? Probably. But there are 32 starting QB’s and only about 8 have a chance to really win each year. I don’t ever see Sanders being in that elite 8. 

They are alike in terms of their size, build and both play in a spread offense where they scramble around with multiple WR formations usually four wide, extend the play with their legs and try to make throws downfield.  Also both spread the ball around to variety of receivers and generally see the field well in that regard not locking onto one guy or another.   I am not saying Sanders is even close to Caleb Williams but both play similar, just Caleb has way more arm talent in almost every way and is a better stronger athlete as well.

 

 

Colorado with Deion is an odd program to say the least.  Last year sure he was getting his guys in or whatever which explains the numbers leaving and coming in.

52 came in last year, 57 went out

 

This current cycle though is pretty massive as well, and guys they literally brought in last year left and more than a few did.  Sure some are upgrades but they also lost a lot in terms of big time CB recruits just leaving.  

40 coming in, 41 went out

 

 

It is such a transient football program in terms of the players in and out and the coaching staff is as well.  Not sure how that will equal a successful team.  Shedeur Sanders and what he would look like without his dad as the coach and vice versa.

[lavar703]

He’s going to be drafted in the same area Spencer Rattler went. He’s not impressive athletically, doesn’t have the biggest arm and I’m not even sure he’s going to measure in at 6’2? I just think he’s a middling prospect who’s being pushed higher because of his last name. 

[PossibleCabbage]

1 hour ago, Ozzy said:

Not sure how that will equal a successful team. 

Regarding Colorado, it probably won't.  Since the one position group that seems most immune to Deion's razzle-dazzle recruiting approach is "offensive line" and that was really their undoing last year.  Like nothing Sanders is about says "this man's knowledge and experience will help me be a better blocker" and those guys tend to be some of the most thoughtful people on a football team anyway.

This is also related to how Shedeur takes an absurd number of sacks- nobody blocking for him has an NFL future, and this is a failure of Coach Prime, since like Hobart had a guy that got drafted once and they're D3.

[SodeeWater_Cheezburger]

I don't know what to predict for Shedeur.  One thing I am pretty suree about, however, is that Deion will probably end up being the NFL's version of Lavar Ball.

[Sugashane]

22 hours ago, SodeeWater_Cheezburger said:

I don't know what to predict for Shedeur.  One thing I am pretty suree about, however, is that Deion will probably end up being the NFL's version of Lavar Ball.

I'm not sure Caleb Williams' father hasn't already taken that role. lol

[mse326]

I think he'll end up as one of the QBs in the league

[LinderFournette]

On 5/15/2024 at 2:49 PM, Daniel said:

I think it's way too early to speculate on where any of the top QBs in the 2025 class will be drafted, much less how they'll fare in the NFL.  Sanders is my pick for the top QB in the class, so far, but there's a lot of room for growth in his game.  There are a few others that are in that same conversation as well, and you expect college QBs to get better as they go.

But sorry jebrick, I don't see Cam Ward as No. 1 material by any stretch.

Did anyone think penix was 8 overall material or nix 12 overall material?

[RedandPewterReturns]

19 hours ago, LinderFournette said:

Did anyone think penix was 8 overall material or nix 12 overall material?

Penix was top 10 material absolutely. He just landed on a team that shocked me. Still unsure what folks dislike with Penix. Medical checked out. He operated an offense and team that was probably inferior from a talent perspective than some of their opponents they beat. Their right side of the OL didn't hold up in the natty and he couldn't get a pass off on time. 

Nix - no I don't align with a top 12 pick. 

Sanders - I don't know why people think he would've been the #2 QB off the board this year. I didn't think he was even better than Nix to tell ya the truth. 

[Daniel]

22 hours ago, LinderFournette said:

Did anyone think penix was 8 overall material or nix 12 overall material?

I think most still think they aren’t.

[Danger]

The Lonzo Ball of the NFL.

[LinderFournette]

6 hours ago, RedandPewterReturns said:

Penix was top 10 material absolutely. He just landed on a team that shocked me. Still unsure what folks dislike with Penix. Medical checked out. He operated an offense and team that was probably inferior from a talent perspective than some of their opponents they beat. Their right side of the OL didn't hold up in the natty and he couldn't get a pass off on time. 

Nix - no I don't align with a top 12 pick. 

Sanders - I don't know why people think he would've been the #2 QB off the board this year. I didn't think he was even better than Nix to tell ya the truth. 

Inferior talent on their roster? They made the college playoff. Got to have good talent to do that.

Penix had no business going top 10 cuz he's 24 with some medical issues(issues were cleared by some I guess). The fact he's also a lefty probably dings him a hair as well.