JBURGE Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 4 minutes ago, Packerraymond said: 5 minutes ago, Rodjahs12 said: I think Arden Key is going to be available when our 2nd round pick comes up and I also think this forum will lose its mind when we pass on him. This is all irrelevant until the Combine, but I hope the era where passing on the Key's of the draft are over. This one I will argue. If the red flag is serious questions about the desire to play football, then ima pass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWood21 Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 3 minutes ago, Rodjahs12 said: Effective? Yeah. Maximizing what Aaron can do? Not even close. I don’t care to go down this road though as it’s clear this conversation as a whole isn’t going anywhere productive. I'm just arguing that there is no correlation between "creativity" and effectiveness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Packerraymond Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 3 minutes ago, JBURGE25 said: This one I will argue. If the red flag is serious questions about the desire to play football, then ima pass. I don't touch these cause they're usually a rumor some internet guy starts up and then millions of people who have never met the guy start questioning the love of the game. Yes I agree though if from their face to face meeting there is that question, pass. However the Mathieu's of the world who had some issues in college but clearly love the game I have no issues adding to the team. Not sure what Key is yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rodjahs12 Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 Also I enjoy being the only Jefferson believer here as if I’m wrong everyone already knew I’d be and if I’m not I look sUper SMRT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Packerraymond Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 8 minutes ago, CWood21 said: To play devil's advocate, at what point does the risk not be worth the potential reward? I mean, there were people who were ready to riot over the Packers passing on Randy Gregory. Fast forward a few years, he's suspended for the entire year and probably not far away from an indefinite suspension. IF the rumors of the hard drugs are true, I'm not sure you can take him in the 1st round. I never questioned our FO on these guys, they have my trust. However, judging by the fact that I can't recall us ever drafting a single guy with known red flags in draft circles I can assume Ted's solution was the remove them altogether. I hope Gutey takes a more case by case basis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MantyWrestler Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 4 minutes ago, Rodjahs12 said: Also I enjoy being the only Jefferson believer here as if I’m wrong everyone already knew I’d be and if I’m not I look sUper SMRT I don’t think your the only guy who likes Jefferson. I’d take him in the 3rd-4th but only as an ILB. I also think there will be other guys I like more than him though. The guy is not an EDGE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rodjahs12 Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 Just now, MantyWrestler said: I don’t think your the only guy who likes Jefferson. I’d take him in the 3rd-4th but only as an ILB. I also think there will be other guys I like more than him though. The guy is not an EDGE This is the popular opinion and I certainly understand why. I however think he has the age and athletic ability on his side to turn into a great edge because he’s such a natural being asked to blitz. Guess we’ll just have to wait and see and we may never see if a 4-3 team takes him anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWood21 Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 8 minutes ago, Packerraymond said: I don't touch these cause they're usually a rumor some internet guy starts up and then millions of people who have never met the guy start questioning the love of the game. Yes I agree though if from their face to face meeting there is that question, pass. However the Mathieu's of the world who had some issues in college but clearly love the game I have no issues adding to the team. Not sure what Key is yet. For draftniks, absolutely. But actual talent evaluators have enough eyes and ears around that they know the good eggs from the bad ones. I'd make the argument that the Mathieu situation is the exception not the norm. What's the difference between Mathieu and Randy Gregory? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JBURGE Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 10 minutes ago, Packerraymond said: 15 minutes ago, JBURGE25 said: This one I will argue. If the red flag is serious questions about the desire to play football, then ima pass. I don't touch these cause they're usually a rumor some internet guy starts up and then millions of people who have never met the guy start questioning the love of the game. Yes I agree though if from their face to face meeting there is that question, pass. However the Mathieu's of the world who had some issues in college but clearly love the game I have no issues adding to the team. Not sure what Key is yet. Definitely. Justin Houston, Mathieu, Marcus Peters. But for every one of them, there's Randy Gregory, Justin Blackmon. Then the wild cards, Demarcus Lawrence and Josh Gordon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWood21 Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 7 minutes ago, Packerraymond said: I never questioned our FO on these guys, they have my trust. However, judging by the fact that I can't recall us ever drafting a single guy with known red flags in draft circles I can assume Ted's solution was the remove them altogether. I hope Gutey takes a more case by case basis. Or has the value never met where the Packers would be investing in them? Most Packers' fans wanted the Packers to take Randy Gregory with the 30th pick, and were upset when they didn't take him. Randy Gregory went off the board with the 60th pick, and the Packers picked 62nd. Does that mean he was off the board, or were the Packers not willing to take that kind of player as high you would. There's a risk vs. reward argument to be had. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWood21 Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 11 minutes ago, Rodjahs12 said: Also I enjoy being the only Jefferson believer here as if I’m wrong everyone already knew I’d be and if I’m not I look sUper SMRT There's a difference between being a believer, and being an unreasonable believer. I like him, I just find other players who are better value. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Packerraymond Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 2 minutes ago, CWood21 said: For draftniks, absolutely. But actual talent evaluators have enough eyes and ears around that they know the good eggs from the bad ones. I'd make the argument that the Mathieu situation is the exception not the norm. What's the difference between Mathieu and Randy Gregory? I'm going to guess a sense of maturity and a passion for football. You need reasons to grow up, I'm sure these are obvious for GMs in the interview process. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MantyWrestler Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 2 minutes ago, Rodjahs12 said: This is the popular opinion and I certainly understand why. I however think he has the age and athletic ability on his side to turn into a great edge because he’s such a natural being asked to blitz. Guess we’ll just have to wait and see and we may never see if a 4-3 team takes him anyway. I guess I don’t see anything natural from him as an edge. I do like him inside. Id love to see him make more plays across the LOS but I will agree, age and athletic ability are on his side. That all said, being athletic and young do not make you a potential edge rusher. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWood21 Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 1 minute ago, Packerraymond said: I'm going to guess a sense of maturity and a passion for football. You need reasons to grow up, I'm sure these are obvious for GMs in the interview process. Based on what they did in college, what made you think that Mathieu would turn it around and Randy Gregory wouldn't? These players are coached through those interviews, and I'd venture a guess that their answers to those tough questions weren't all that different. Mathieu ended up in an ideal situation with a "big brother" situation with Patrick Peterson. That's where you have to trust the guys that are around the player. And that doesn't happen with that strong foundation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rodjahs12 Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 6 minutes ago, CWood21 said: There's a difference between being a believer, and being an unreasonable believer. I like him, I just find other players who are better value. I don’t think I’m being unreasonable. I realize the risk involved in this, I just seem a lot more keen on the potential payoff than the rest of the forum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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