2018 NFL Draft Discussion

[MacReady]

Still waiting for an example where a guard was worth a top 14 pick.  People were at least able to come up with an argument for top 14 receivers.  The last top 14 guard just won a Super Bowl... With the team that signed him for a 1 year 1.5 million dollar deal. 

What were people saying about Chance Warmack?  What were they saying about Jonathan Cooper?  I'm gonna bet they were saying things pretty damn similar to what the same people are saying about Nelson now. 

[cannondale]

17 minutes ago, HorizontoZenith said:

Still waiting for an example where a guard was worth a top 14 pick.  People were at least able to come up with an argument for top 14 receivers.  The last top 14 guard just won a Super Bowl... With the team that signed him for a 1 year 1.5 million dollar deal. 

What were people saying about Chance Warmack?  What were they saying about Jonathan Cooper?  I'm gonna bet they were saying things pretty damn similar to what the same people are saying about Nelson now. 

The biggest argument for me, and I believe it has already been stated, is that second contract. Living up to expectations means top dollar at a position you don't really wanna throw money at

[MantyWrestler]

38 minutes ago, HorizontoZenith said:

Still waiting for an example where a guard was worth a top 14 pick.  People were at least able to come up with an argument for top 14 receivers.  The last top 14 guard just won a Super Bowl... With the team that signed him for a 1 year 1.5 million dollar deal. 

What were people saying about Chance Warmack?  What were they saying about Jonathan Cooper?  I'm gonna bet they were saying things pretty damn similar to what the same people are saying about Nelson now. 

I love Nelson’s game but what I feel most people, who want a guard in the first, are missing is that OL is really a sum of the parts. 2 great OL man doesn’t equal a great OL. 5 good OL does equate to a great OL.

What that top 15 OL does do is cost a lot and handicapp a team long term. 

[Leader]

"The bold moves might already have occurred with the removal of Ted Thompson as general manager, plus new coordinators on both sides of the ball (Joe Philbin on offense and Mike Pettine on defense). The new GM will be more active in unrestricted free agency than Thompson, but that's not saying much considering how little Thompson did. Look for Gutekunst to make his biggest splashes in the draft, considering his history as a college scout. Last year, Thompson traded out of the first round. Expect the opposite this year. Look for Gutekunst to try to trade up from No. 14 overall and get the Packers into the top 10 for the first time since 2009" Rob Demovsky

http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/page/32for32x180209/2018-nfl-bold-offseason-predictions-all-32-teams#NFC N

[St Vince]

I  think they should stay at 14, teams will be trading up for QBs and that will send a lot of defensive talent to us. I would like them to move up with our second pick to grab someone who slides. If Chubb is not available moving into the top 10 is pointless.

[CWood21]

1 hour ago, Leader said:

"The bold moves might already have occurred with the removal of Ted Thompson as general manager, plus new coordinators on both sides of the ball (Joe Philbin on offense and Mike Pettine on defense). The new GM will be more active in unrestricted free agency than Thompson, but that's not saying much considering how little Thompson did. Look for Gutekunst to make his biggest splashes in the draft, considering his history as a college scout. Last year, Thompson traded out of the first round. Expect the opposite this year. Look for Gutekunst to try to trade up from No. 14 overall and get the Packers into the top 10 for the first time since 2009" Rob Demovsky

http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/page/32for32x180209/2018-nfl-bold-offseason-predictions-all-32-teams#NFC N

Trading up in the 1st round of the draft is one of the worst moves you can make more often than not.  You're giving up already limited number of assets, which hinders your flexibility later on in the draft.

[Leader]

20 minutes ago, CWood21 said:

Trading up in the 1st round of the draft is one of the worst moves you can make more often than not.  You're giving up already limited number of assets, which hinders your flexibility later on in the draft.

Could be but in my mind it would depend on the perceived depth of "top" talent the draft holds versus our roster - the swap itself - and the talent secured and the hole being filled. If there's a "player" that fits the bill for the team on the field now or being constructed - I say nab him.

We need difference makers IMO and out talent evaluators need to be able to recognize the contrast between difference makers and JAGs. Especially when we're devoting a higher and higher % of CAP to one position: QB.

We need people that - because of their play and production on the field - can change advance marketing from: "Aaron Rodgers and the GBPs are coming to town" - to - "Aaron Rodgers and (fill in the blank) are coming to town."

[cannondale]

Unless Lawrence Taylor is available, keep your assets. We are more than 1 player away

[CWood21]

On 2/8/2018 at 11:35 AM, ArthurPensky said:

What's everyone's thoughts about Isaiah Oliver CB Colorado? Haven't seen much on him around here. Seems to have some great ball skills, size, and returning ability. would be nice to somehow get him with the 2nd pick but might require a trade up.

I really like him a lot.  Depending on how the board goes, I'd be tempted to move back up late in the 1st round in order to select him.

[CWood21]

19 minutes ago, Leader said:

Could be but in my mind it would depend on the perceived depth of "top" talent the draft holds versus our roster - the swap itself - and the talent secured and the hole being filled. If there's a "player" that fits the bill for the team on the field now or being constructed - I say nab him.

We need difference makers IMO and out talent evaluators need to be able to recognize the contrast between difference makers and JAGs. Especially when we're devoting a higher and higher % of CAP to one position: QB.

We need people that - because of their play and production on the field - can change advance marketing from: "Aaron Rodgers and the GBPs are coming to town" - to - "Aaron Rodgers and (fill in the blank) are coming to town."

Like I mentioned, it's not an overly top-heavy class.  The difference between the 8th and 14th pick really isn't there.  You've got Bradley Chubb, Saquon Barkley, and a slew of QBs.  Then you move into the group of players where positional value tends to push you away from those players.  I'm not convinced that moving up gets you into another tier of players.

[OneTwoSixFive]

2 hours ago, CWood21 said:

Trading up in the 1st round of the draft is one of the worst moves you can make more often than not.  You're giving up already limited number of assets, which hinders your flexibility later on in the draft.

I certainly agree with that being a bad idea this year. You cannot expect the very top prospects like RB Saquon Barkley and DE Bradley Chubb to fall even to #10. There is no obvious premium corner or receiver, that might be there for the Packers and little consensus over who the top pass rusher is after Chubb. This is not a Julio Jones year (taken at #6) or a Patrick Peterson year (taken 5th). Nor is there a clear no.2 pass rusher (after Chubb), or even that usually reliable early pick, a consensus top OT.

The cost to move up is very, very steep. This does however, look like a year you could trade back and still get similar talent. Just as it is expensive to move up, so it reaps a good reward if you trade down four or five spots (equal in value to an extra 78th or 73rd pick in round 3, on the JJ chart). Unless there is someone the Packers really like at #14, that might be a good move (assuming any team WANTS to trade up).

[Leader]

1 hour ago, CWood21 said:

Like I mentioned, it's not an overly top-heavy class.  The difference between the 8th and 14th pick really isn't there.  You've got Bradley Chubb, Saquon Barkley, and a slew of QBs.  Then you move into the group of players where positional value tends to push you away from those players.  I'm not convinced that moving up gets you into another tier of players.

Well there ya go. The answer is in. My thought was we as an organization need to be flexible and willing to snag that difference maker - should he exist - which I'll leave up to those pulling the triggers. If its a shallow draft - oh well, that would take too much losing to cash in - or too high a jump in draft order to capitalize.

[MantyWrestler]

9 hours ago, Leader said:

Well there ya go. The answer is in. My thought was we as an organization need to be flexible and willing to snag that difference maker - should he exist - which I'll leave up to those pulling the triggers. If its a shallow draft - oh well, that would take too much losing to cash in - or too high a jump in draft order to capitalize.

I think you could still be right. Say for instance, there is a run on QB’s and Chubb falls to say 8-10. I say we go get him. Could happen. 

[OneTwoSixFive]

Let's broaden out that scenario MantyWrestler. Suppose you, as the Packers GM, get an offer to move up from #14 to #10. The cost is your first, plus your higher third rounder (ie not the comp 3rd), and your lowest 7th rounder. A fair deal on the JJ chart.

I didn't do the trade up to #8th as that would have cost an extra 4th and 5th (or maybe comp 3rd and 6th). there is no-one I'd be happy to give up that much for.

Would you make that deal for any one, or more than one, of the players below ? (if more than one list order of preference) 

RB Barkley, DE Chubb, OG Nelson, LB Edmunds, WR Ridley, DL Vea, DB Fitzpatrick.

 

For myself, I'd be very tempted by Chubb. I don't think I'd do that deal for anyone else. It's not that I don't like the other guys, i just don't like them enough to do the deal. Among those I refused to trade up for, I liked them (in descending order) something like Barkley, Ridley, Edmunds, Fitzpatrick, Vea, Nelson. Position played, factored into my decision. 

[tredpack]

3 hours ago, OneTwoSixFive said:

Let's broaden out that scenario MantyWrestler. Suppose you, as the Packers GM, get an offer to move up from #14 to #10. The cost is your first, plus your higher third rounder (ie not the comp 3rd), and your lowest 7th rounder. A fair deal on the JJ chart.

I didn't do the trade up to #8th as that would have cost an extra 4th and 5th (or maybe comp 3rd and 6th). there is no-one I'd be happy to give up that much for.

Would you make that deal for any one, or more than one, of the players below ? (if more than one list order of preference) 

RB Barkley, DE Chubb, OG Nelson, LB Edmunds, WR Ridley, DL Vea, DB Fitzpatrick.

 

For myself, I'd be very tempted by Chubb. I don't think I'd do that deal for anyone else. It's not that I don't like the other guys, i just don't like them enough to do the deal. Among those I refused to trade up for, I liked them (in descending order) something like Barkley, Ridley, Edmunds, Fitzpatrick, Vea, Nelson. Position played, factored into my decision. 

I would consider it for Barkley, Chubb, Fitzpatrick, Edmunds. Barkley doesn’t  make a ton of sense though with Williams and Jones on the roster.