2018 Free Agency Discussion Thread

[Broncofan]

Just now, thebestever6 said:

It really is harder to find guys back half of the second though imo.

It is but 0-fer is still inexcusable.  

[thebestever6]

3 minutes ago, Broncofan said:

It is but 0-fer is still inexcusable.  

The Ball pick I give a pass on Lacy wasn't much better who everyone wanted. I'll go over the rest I know everyone loved the guard from the Bucs but he hasn't been great. People forget the 2011 second round both players were serviceable. 

[Broncofan]

5 minutes ago, thebestever6 said:

The Ball pick I give a pass on Lacy wasn't much better who everyone wanted. I'll go over the rest I know everyone loved the guard from the Bucs but he hasn't been great. People forget the 2011 second round both players were serviceable. 

His 2011 draft was great.  Legendary.  

Since 2011 he’s whiffed on every 2nd-3rd rd pick with the exception of Wolfe and hopefully Simmons.   That is awful no matter how you slice it.   It all goes back to his draft approach changing post-2013 to win-now.   It needs to change back.   This is old territory.  

[germ-x]

1 minute ago, Broncofan said:

It is but 0-fer is still inexcusable.  

Yeah.  Can’t miss year upon year with 2nd and 3rd round picks.

Must say, the Latimer pick still boggles me.  The guy had ridiculous hands in college, was 6’2” 215, ran 4.39 at his pro day (his speed shows up on special teams too) with a 39” vertical.  I thought he had future #1 WR written all over him.  He looks absolutely lost within the offense though.  Even then I wouldn’t change that pick, that dude should’ve been a steal in round 2.

I was not a fan of the DeMarcus Walker pick.  Just don’t see how he fits in the 3/4 unless he adds a lot of weight and strength this offseason.  Though, many highly thought of draftniks thought he was Denver’s best pick.  Considering the mess Gotsis is in, let’s hope that proves to be true.

[thebestever6]

25 minutes ago, paul-mac said:

 

Wolfe

Osweiler

Ball 

Latimer

Sambrailo

Gotsis

Walker

 

Jury still out on the last two, but blimey that’s an awful track record. Maybe we should trade 2 second rounders for a late 1st just to avoid having to pick in the 2nd round. 

 

Jury is still out on the last two really don't think Gotis has been bad for the 32nd pick in the second. Walker like the pick hate  the coaching him up part he's out of position. At the very least he helps.

Sambrillo - I get the pick we needed a lt. He had left tackle feet. Just wasn't strong or mean enough. Seahawks traded a 2nd and 3rd for a 33 yr old lt. It's a valued position. Plus we got back a 5th. I think it was a worthy gamble.

Latimer - bust straight up we over looked his work ethic and dedication to the playbook. See Lynch, Henderson, I'm  sure there's more .

Ball- he's  a bust but again I get the pick we needed an rb and Knowshon was a bust to that point.  He had alcoholism might of been different otherwise. Reminded me of Jonathan Stewart tbh. Lacy was also a bust. 

Osweiler- I hated the pick others say he was instrumental in us winning the Superbowl though. So again not a total bust. I preffered Wilson and Cousins. My thoughts were confirmed pre season of that year. From the Brock V Wilson h2h match.

Wolfe like you said was a borderline first rounder. Some thought he was a 4th rounder though. 

[Broncofan]

51 minutes ago, thebestever6 said:

 

Wolfe like you said was a borderline first rounder. Some thought he was a 4th rounder though. 

Honestly where do you come up with statements like that - at the time, all the drafts had Wolfe ranked in Rd 2 - WF had him last at 59, but NFL.com had him at 42, and CBS/ESPN's mocks and the draftniks all had him as top 50 material.    Round 4 was what, some bleacher report (or whatever the 2012 equivalent) or November 2011?  Matt Miller was the outlier I remember...but that's Matt Miller for you.  If you want to take outliers, you have to recognize where he's seen in general.

NFL's - http://www.nfl.com/draft/story/09000d5d8288dc3b/article/sevenround-mock-projecting-every-pick-in-2012-nfl-draft

CBS & ESPN sadly are out of publication beyond Rd1 (but you can read up on McShay calling Wolfe an impact pick at 2.36), WF's 3-round mock is still in their archive, and he's in there, last at #59.  

Enough with hyperbole.  

And keep in mind - if you are using 2011-12, that's when Elway was still an overall BPA, rebuild-the-team GM.  That's why he was so successful back then.  He went to need, 1-player-away, insane-tool-but-low-football skill mode after 2013's SB, and unfortunately, his draft results reflect it (although doing that in Day 3 is fine, the whiff rate is so high anyways, why not go for ceiling).    Sadly, he hasn't flipped the switch back yet.   

If we are using 5-year old picks as the hope that Elway can get Day 2 right, that's a problem by itself.    The problem is not just the picks, it's the thinking in his approach.   As we get closer to Draft Day, I'll dig up the thread from the old Forums and update it - needless to say, another year hasn't done much except drive home the points that were there to see a year ago.

 

[thebestever6]

4 minutes ago, Broncofan said:

Honestly where do you come up with statements like that - at the time, all the drafts had Wolfe ranked in Rd 2 - WF had him last at 59, but NFL.com had him at 42, and CBS/ESPN's mocks and the draftniks all had him as top 50 material.    Round 4 was what, some bleacher report (or whatever the 2012 equivalent) or November 2011?  Matt Miller was the outlier I remember...but that's Matt Miller for you.

NFL's - http://www.nfl.com/draft/story/09000d5d8288dc3b/article/sevenround-mock-projecting-every-pick-in-2012-nfl-draft

CBS & ESPN sadly are out of date, WF's is still in their archive, but he's in there, last at #59.  

Enough with hyperbole.  

And keep in mind - if you are using 2011-12, that's when Elway was still an overall BPA, rebuild-the-team GM.  That's why he was so successful back then.  He went to need, 1-player-away, insane-tool-but-low-football skill mode after 2013's SB, and unfortunately, his draft results reflect it (although doing that in Day 3 is fine, the whiff rate is so high anyways, why not go for ceiling).    Sadly, he hasn't flipped the switch back yet.   

If we are using 5-year old picks as the hope that Elway can get Day 2 right, that's a problem by itself.    The problem is not just the picks, it's the thinking in his approach.   As we get closer to Draft Day, I'll dig up the thread from the old Forums and update it - needless to say, another year hasn't done much except drive home the points that were there to see a year ago.

 

On nfl.com in his prospect profile he was projected 4th round tried to look it up but it said flag on the play. 

 Walter football said 2nd- threw the fourth round. I'm not pulling that out of my arse alot of people hated that pick for that reason. 

 

[thebestever6]

I think it's good Keenum is taking his time in free agent. I hope our interest dries up.

[AKRNA]

Just curious, does anyone know what QB's will be FA's in the next two seasons?

[thebestever6]

15 minutes ago, AKRNA said:

Just curious, does anyone know what QB's will be FA's in the next two seasons?

I know foles is can't pick league on spotrac

[AKRNA]

1 minute ago, thebestever6 said:

I know foles is can't pick league on spotrac

I know his names in there. I'm just curious about the rest of the 2019/20 crop.

[thebestever6]

22 minutes ago, AKRNA said:

I know his names in there. I'm just curious about the rest of the 2019/20 crop.

We can do this by processing it. Ryan Tannehill, Big ben he'll probably retire , don't know about rivers, eli is, Those are the big ones who do you have in mind?

[AKRNA]

2 minutes ago, thebestever6 said:

We can do this by processing it. Ryan Tannehill, Big ben he'll probably retire , don't know about rivers, eli is, Those are the big ones who do you have in mind?

No one really. I'm just trying to see a bigger picture.

What I'm thinking is Elways not ready to throw in the towel on Lynch and Kelly. If he drafts QB at #5 he just did that. I'm no Lynch fan, that's been established. I could though make a good argument for bringing in any veteran QB as a stop gap., strengthening the OL and offense as a whole through the draft and FA and giving he and Kelly a shot.

So, what would be my defense of Lynch? Well, he's dealt with 3 OC's, two different systems and numerous injuries. Pretty good excuses.

Personally, I've never thought he could make it. As a devils advocate though, lots of knowledgeable, professional football folks said when he was drafted he was a 2-3 year project. They know far better than you or I.

Well, he's coming up on year three. Might as well see what we've got. At this point I'd hand him the keys. Put up or shut up. Stack the roster around him.

If he fails, we've got a list of 2019/20 FA's to chose from.

[thebestever6]

27 minutes ago, AKRNA said:

No one really. I'm just trying to see a bigger picture.

What I'm thinking is Elways not ready to throw in the towel on Lynch and Kelly. If he drafts QB at #5 he just did that. I'm no Lynch fan, that's been established. I could though make a good argument for bringing in any veteran QB as a stop gap., strengthening the OL and offense as a whole through the draft and FA and giving he and Kelly a shot.

So, what would be my defense of Lynch? Well, he's dealt with 3 OC's, two different systems and numerous injuries. Pretty good excuses.

Personally, I've never thought he could make it. As a devils advocate though, lots of knowledgeable, professional football folks said when he was drafted he was a 2-3 year project. They know far better than you or I.

Well, he's coming up on year three. Might as well see what we've got. At this point I'd hand him the keys. Put up or shut up. Stack the roster around him.

If he fails, we've got a list of 2019/20 FA's to chose from.

Or a high draft pick not a terrible opinion.

[AKRNA]

3 minutes ago, thebestever6 said:

Or a high draft pick not a terrible opinion.

That too. We've got the ability, high draft status and FA, to build an offense any QB could be successful with. Put Lynch, Kelly in that kind of spot and see how they do. If they fail but were given a great chance I don't think anyone here would have an issue with it. I sure wouldn't.

Give Musgrave some talent in the trenches. Upgrade TE. Let our new staff coach up our WR's and pick another one.

Having watched Lynch a bit now, I do think he could be successful in a WC, run heavy offense. Better ball security, emphasis on moving the chains, and let his natural ability make the 2-3 splash plays a game a really good offense needs.

This has to sound weird coming from a guy that's been beating up on Lynch since he was drafted but I'd like to see him get a realistic shot. I still don't think he can do it, but I'd really like to know definitively.