Combine Time

[Leader]

Is coming up......

Who you looking at and why?

[OneTwoSixFive]

Interesting question.

It may be that what you are looking for are names, but I'm looking in a more general fashion.

I want to see if any small school prospects jump out, ones that have been somewhat overlooked on internet big boards.
I'll be looking at the movement skills and 225lb reps of mid-draft offensive tackles (rounds 4/5), bearing in mind longer armed tackles are at a disadvantage with weights. 
I'll look at 40 times of TEs to see if they have the speed to challenge the deep midfield. 4.6's and low 4.7's are of interest
I'll check the cone/shuttle times for cornerbacks, pass rushers and lesser known safeties (safety is a possible later draft pick, imo).

I will look at as much as I can on WRs, pass rushers, CBs, TEs, which I am projecting as the first four draft picks.

When the combine is done I'll look up the RAS scores of players I am interested in, since the Packers have been selecting high scorers there, recently.

Finally, I want to hear the random thoughts of Mayock, Davis, Jeremiah, etc. (Excepting for the too-frequent comment by Mayock, that guy X is "Faster than you think").....
I'm not that interested in what Eisen has to say, though he is a genial enough guy, his annual 40yd dash doesn't do much for me either.
 

[MacReady]

Just going to keep an eye out for pass rushers who miss or exceed expectations to see how it will relate to them falling in the draft.  Otherwise, corners and receiver 40 times are interesting. 

[Packerraymond]

This Combine is where our 1st rounder will be decided. Any one of the usual Davenport, Smith, Edmunds, James, Ward, Jackson could be really hurt by a poor showing.

You've got guys like Key, Landry, Taven Bryan, Mike Hughes, Isaiah Oliver, Rashaan Evans, etc who routinely go in the 20-40 range in mocks. One of them blows this thing up, better believe 10-20 will be their new landing point.

[Leader]

5 hours ago, OneTwoSixFive said:

Interesting question.

It may be that what you are looking for are names, but I'm looking in a more general fashion.........

 

No, no......no preconditions. Names. Positions. Color of jersey - its all good 

Me - I want a pass rusher - simply because I've been conditioned to think we need one (or two or three.....) of those above and beyond other D needs. Does one exist thats gonna be the playmaker I want? I most certainly cant say - but my general take (for whatever reason) about this draft is that its not a WOW draft like some years past. I reply on the folks at 1265 to be using sharp pencils.

[ricky]

10 hours ago, Leader said:

No, no......no preconditions. Names. Positions. Color of jersey - its all good 

Me - I want a pass rusher - simply because I've been conditioned to think we need one (or two or three.....) of those above and beyond other D needs. Does one exist thats gonna be the playmaker I want? I most certainly cant say - but my general take (for whatever reason) about this draft is that its not a WOW draft like some years past. I reply on the folks at 1265 to be using sharp pencils.

That's the problem with the Combine. Only certain players are invited. And most of the measurements are pretty useless. So the guy can run in a straight line very quickly. So they can move in shorts and t-shirts against guys with  large pads. They get to show they can move laterally, or forward or backward at a gesture from a coach. They jump high and long. What is more relevant is how they played in pads against stiff competition. Do they have a strong motor? Do they take plays off? Do they get frustrated? How is their first step? Do they have more than one move? The tale of the tape is crucial. The "underwear Olympics"? It can be a tool, but to me, a minor one. But then again, that just my opinion. 

[Dubz41]

I want to see if there is significant separation from the top tier pass rushers and the 2nd tier.  Looking specifically at Mata-afa, K Street, Jeff Holland, Tyquan Lewis and Turay.

Also keeping an eye out for Tim Settle and Vita Vea.  Eagles showed how effective a solid DL rotation can lead to success and after Daniels and Clark we have nothing.

Watching TEs also,  they don't contribute rookie year so looking at Smythe, Ian Thomas, Tyler Conklin, Dalton Schultz and Chris Herndon. 

[Golfman]

6 hours ago, Dubz41 said:

I want to see if there is significant separation from the top tier pass rushers and the 2nd tier.  Looking specifically at Mata-afa, K Street, Jeff Holland, Tyquan Lewis and Turay.

Also keeping an eye out for Tim Settle and Vita Vea.  Eagles showed how effective a solid DL rotation can lead to success and after Daniels and Clark we have nothing.

Watching TEs also,  they don't contribute rookie year so looking at Smythe, Ian Thomas, Tyler Conklin, Dalton Schultz and Chris Herndon. 

Writing off a 3rd round pick who was injured during the majority of camp and missed several games is not a smart move. Guys make big jumps in year 2, I expect Adams to do the same on the d-line. I also thought Lowry was not chopped liver. He played pretty well in year two and will improve some more. 

[Leader]

10 hours ago, ricky said:

That's the problem with the Combine. Only certain players are invited. And most of the measurements are pretty useless. So the guy can run in a straight line very quickly. So they can move in shorts and t-shirts against guys with  large pads. They get to show they can move laterally, or forward or backward at a gesture from a coach. They jump high and long. What is more relevant is how they played in pads against stiff competition. Do they have a strong motor? Do they take plays off? Do they get frustrated? How is their first step? Do they have more than one move? The tale of the tape is crucial. The "underwear Olympics"? It can be a tool, but to me, a minor one. But then again, that just my opinion. 

It's a valuable skills test. It's not a football game.
The guys invited to the Combine have played lots of football games against a spectrum of competition. They've generated tons of video - all except these skills test.

One reason the NFL is the cream of the crop is this weeding out process - the Combine and Pro Days to follow. It's extensive and extreme. A guys hand size may give him a leg up over another in the eyes of some. Teams will get the opportunity to sit down with prospective draft picks....gauge them as individuals....outside the tape.

 

[Dubz41]

1 hour ago, Golfman said:

Writing off a 3rd round pick who was injured during the majority of camp and missed several games is not a smart move. Guys make big jumps in year 2, I expect Adams to do the same on the d-line. I also thought Lowry was not chopped liver. He played pretty well in year two and will improve some more. 

I didn't write anyone off, but there is no tape.  I hope Adams shows up this year, but since he hasn't shown up yet it would be prudent to be looking around.  We heard a lot of buzz about Lowry early last year and yet it turned out kind of meh.  As an example: the Vikes took Shariff Floyd in the first round, they kept waiting for him and they are STILL waiting for him.  Until Adams shows something we can't assume he is fine. Just saying.....

[Golfman]

4 hours ago, Dubz41 said:

I didn't write anyone off, but there is no tape.  I hope Adams shows up this year, but since he hasn't shown up yet it would be prudent to be looking around.  We heard a lot of buzz about Lowry early last year and yet it turned out kind of meh.  As an example: the Vikes took Shariff Floyd in the first round, they kept waiting for him and they are STILL waiting for him.  Until Adams shows something we can't assume he is fine. Just saying.....

Fair enough but Floyd has nerve damage that doesn't appear as though it is going to heal. I thought Lowry showed flashes of brilliance. The buzz out of camp on Adams was he was our best interior pass rusher. Guys make a big second year leap. I think we have a sold 4 guys and Dial or somebody else can adequately fill in as the 5th. I'm not as gun ho as others about getting another interior guy, but if the value is too good to pass up you get the guy. 

[Leader]

As good a synopsis of the value of the Combine as I've seen.

From PackerNews:

When you start hearing the great testing numbers and maybe even a broken record or two coming out of the combine in Indianapolis this week, take a deep breath. Yes, the testing matters, that’s why they do it. But it’s just a part of a player’s story and not the biggest part.

“The combine and those tests are a point of reference,” said a position coach for an NFC team Monday. “It’s not who they are. The tape does not lie. And don’t look at a highlight tape. You can look at a highlight tape to start just to see, ‘This guy’s interesting.’ But you have to look at a game and see what that (shows).”

The NFL has been holding the combine in essentially its current form with every team in the league attending since 1985. Its value is three-fold: the chance for teams to get a complete medical workup on 300-plus prospects, to observe players’ behavior in an interview and other settings and to test athleticism and position skills in individual drills.

The physical tests get the most publicity because they’re quantifiable, allow for apples-to-apples comparisons to previous years and now are shown on the NFL Network. And they have value. For starters, they allow for what some scouts and coaches call the Disneyland test, as in, you must be a certain height to go on this ride.

[SSG]

On ‎2‎/‎26‎/‎2018 at 7:15 AM, Golfman said:

Writing off a 3rd round pick who was injured during the majority of camp and missed several games is not a smart move. Guys make big jumps in year 2, I expect Adams to do the same on the d-line. I also thought Lowry was not chopped liver. He played pretty well in year two and will improve some more. 

Adams is an known as he showed little to nothing last year.  While he could take a second year leap, it's far from a guarantee.  Pretty sure similar things were said about Khyri Thorton in his second year as people just assumed he was going to make a second year jump based on nothing but his draft position.  You never know with rookies. 

I wish we wouldn't have assumed that Fackrell was going to make a second year jump, maybe our pass rush wouldn't be the dumpster fire that it is at this moment. 

[cannondale]

TT has said on many occasions that the bulk of the draft prep has already been done before the combine. The combine is used as another check for the work that's already been done. If someone blows up or just blows, they will go back to the tape to be sure. TT has also said on numerous occasions that he watches how the players interact as much as anything

[Norm]

3 hours ago, SSG said:

Pretty sure similar things were said about Khyri Thorton in his second year as people just assumed he was going to make a second year jump based on nothing but his draft position.  You never know with rookies. 

Nobody can disagree with this, but it's a bit unfair to throw the easy bust names around too. How many good players on this team didn't do anything as rookies? You can't just expect guys to get second year jumps, but you also need to trust your scouting dept as well (yes, I know we drafted a lot of ****ty guys we  counted on who weren't good). Adams is a bit different as he missed (most, all?) of camp and a bunch of games and then just didn't get up to speed, presumably, to play many snaps. It's not like he outright stunk.