Forge Posted October 1, 2020 Share Posted October 1, 2020 28 minutes ago, beekay414 said: Okay, well here's a "note" then... The New Jersey Devils have signed LW Gunnarwolfe Fontaine to an entry-level contract and have assigned him to the Adirondack Thunder of the ECHL lol Perfect lol 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forge Posted October 1, 2020 Share Posted October 1, 2020 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beekay414 Posted October 1, 2020 Author Share Posted October 1, 2020 (edited) Oh man, I hope Palms pulls a ton. He could have massive value for this year with his cap hit and being a 30 goal, 50 point player. If we retain 50%? Maaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaan Edited October 1, 2020 by beekay414 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forge Posted October 1, 2020 Share Posted October 1, 2020 1 minute ago, beekay414 said: Oh man, I hope Palms pulls a ton. He could have massive value for this year with his cap hit and being a 30 goal, 50 point player. If we retain 50%? Maaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaan I don't think he'd pull a ton. Honestly, don't think that he waives for Calgary. The Isles maybe, but I'm not sure how that even works given that they don't have a first round pick this year. But maybe a first next year with an okay prospect? Or maybe increase the prospect and get a second? Something like that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beekay414 Posted October 1, 2020 Author Share Posted October 1, 2020 Just now, Forge said: I don't think he'd pull a ton. Honestly, don't think that he waives for Calgary. The Isles maybe, but I'm not sure how that even works given that they don't have a first round pick this year. But maybe a first next year with an okay prospect? Or maybe increase the prospect and get a second? Something like that. A 30 goal, 50 point player on a ~$2.4 million contract in a flat cap season where everyone is looking to stay far under the salary cap? I disagree. I think he can pull a #1 plus a damn good prospect. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forge Posted October 1, 2020 Share Posted October 1, 2020 Just now, beekay414 said: A 30 goal, 50 point player on a ~$2.4 million contract in a flat cap season where everyone is looking to stay far under the salary cap? I disagree. I think he can pull a #1 plus a damn good prospect. He's still a rental, regardless. That's still kind of big. Toffoli was very much the same last year. 2.7 million hit last year when accounting for the money LA took back, 50 point guy. He's not as good as Palms, but it's the right range. Talk was last year that Kreider would get a first, but I don't know what type of prospect he would have brought in as well. But it's somewhere in that range. Besides, Calgary has no damn good prospects and the Isles don't have their first lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beekay414 Posted October 1, 2020 Author Share Posted October 1, 2020 (edited) 10 minutes ago, Forge said: He's still a rental, regardless. That's still kind of big. Toffoli was very much the same last year. 2.7 million hit last year when accounting for the money LA took back, 50 point guy. He's not as good as Palms, but it's the right range. Talk was last year that Kreider would get a first, but I don't know what type of prospect he would have brought in as well. But it's somewhere in that range. Besides, Calgary has no damn good prospects and the Isles don't have their first lol Last year was much different though. This year isn't really comparable. Toffoli's also not even in Palmieri's league and he was acquired at the deadline. Getting a full season of Palms at a discounted is worth far more than 2 months of Tyler Toffoli. It's not even really comparable. Edited October 1, 2020 by beekay414 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forge Posted October 1, 2020 Share Posted October 1, 2020 I will say that given our interest in Hanafin last year, given our need, his contract and age...if we could find something with a base of Palms / Hanafin, I'm really good with that. We'd probably have to add given those things, but I'd listen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forge Posted October 1, 2020 Share Posted October 1, 2020 13 minutes ago, beekay414 said: Last year was much different though. This year isn't really comparable. Toffoli's also not even in Palmieri's league and he was acquired at the deadline. Getting a full season of Palms at a discounted rate for a full season is worth far more than 2 months of Tyler Toffoli. It's not even really comparable. Being acquired at the deadline is typically seen as better for value - that's why ZBC keeps saying if he gets moved it will be at the deadline. Devils Insiders keeps saying the same as well. And they are pretty comparable as players. Palms is better as a goal scorer, , does average a few more points per 82, but the difference isn't enormous or anything. They are both basically second line RW. Toffoli is a better line driver and puck possession guy, not quite as good offensively, but the difference isn't stark. Palms is a 30 goal / 55 point guy per season with the devils, Toffoli is closer to like 23 / 50 over roughly that same time period. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forge Posted October 1, 2020 Share Posted October 1, 2020 If there were an offer out there of a first + really good prospect for Palms, I think he'd be gone already, to be honest. I feel like if he gets moved, it's just going to be a different sort of trade. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beekay414 Posted October 1, 2020 Author Share Posted October 1, 2020 2 minutes ago, Forge said: Being acquired at the deadline is typically seen as better for value - that's why ZBC keeps saying if he gets moved it will be at the deadline. Devils Insiders keeps saying the same as well. And they are pretty comparable as players. Palms is better as a goal scorer, , does average a few more points per 82, but the difference isn't enormous or anything. They are both basically second line RW. Toffoli is a better line driver and puck possession guy, not quite as good offensively, but the difference isn't stark. Palms is a 30 goal / 55 point guy per season with the devils, Toffoli is closer to like 23 / 50 over roughly that same time period. I don't see them as comparable tbh. Toffoli is too inconsistent. In 3 of his 7 full-time seasons he played at a sub 40 point pace. Kyle's done that one time over the same span and that was when he was getting like 3rd line minutes with Anaheim. Plus, LIS, this year isn't comparable to anything we know. A full season of Palmieri at a shade under $2.4 Million in a flat cap era where half the teams are working on an internal budget? Yeah, we simply don't know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beekay414 Posted October 1, 2020 Author Share Posted October 1, 2020 3 minutes ago, Forge said: If there were an offer out there of a first + really good prospect for Palms, I think he'd be gone already, to be honest. I feel like if he gets moved, it's just going to be a different sort of trade. Things are just starting to heat up. Nobody is going to jump into offering **** like that right away. I'm just saying, using 2 months of Tyler Toffoli in a normal season to compare Palmieri isn't really wise. If you want to do it for contract extension purposes, it makes sense because Palms will be worth more than Toffoli. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forge Posted October 1, 2020 Share Posted October 1, 2020 1 minute ago, beekay414 said: I don't see them as comparable tbh. Toffoli is too inconsistent. In 3 of his 7 full-time seasons he played at a sub 40 point pace. Kyle's done that one time over the same span and that was when he was getting like 3rd line minutes with Anaheim. Plus, LIS, this year isn't comparable to anything we know. A full season of Palmieri at a shade under $2.4 Million in a flat cap era where half the teams are working on an internal budget? Yeah, we simply don't know. If there is a year where it's different, its certainly this one. LIS, I Just think the structure of a Palms trade is different for some reason. I don't think it's going to be a typical Pick + prospect trade. I think it could be more "nhl trade" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forge Posted October 1, 2020 Share Posted October 1, 2020 1 minute ago, beekay414 said: Things are just starting to heat up. Nobody is going to jump into offering **** like that right away. I'm just saying, using 2 months of Tyler Toffoli in a normal season to compare Palmieri isn't really wise. If you want to do it for contract extension purposes, it makes sense because Palms will be worth more than Toffoli. Look at what we got for Hall though. That was nearly an entire season. I'd argue we didn't even get a really good prospect in that trade. Bahl is okay, but he's not exactly a top 50ish prospect outside of the NHL in most people's eyes . We got the first...a good prospect, and then some spare change. It was a good haul, but Foote and Madden in the Coleman and Toffoli deals were both better prospects. One wasn't a rental, the other was and didn't generate a first. For Palms, I could see us generate a prospect at or around Bahl's level + first, or a better prospect + 2nd. I just don't think teams give up both that often any more. Teams are really getting stingy on rentals. Could the money make a difference? Sure...will it? Maybe. I think it has a bigger impact if we retain and trade him now than at the deadline. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beekay414 Posted October 1, 2020 Author Share Posted October 1, 2020 3 minutes ago, Forge said: Look at what we got for Hall though. That was nearly an entire season. I'd argue we didn't even get a really good prospect in that trade. Bahl is okay, but he's not exactly a top 50ish prospect outside of the NHL in most people's eyes . We got the first...a good prospect, and then some spare change. It was a good haul, but Foote and Madden in the Coleman and Toffoli deals were both better prospects. One wasn't a rental, the other was and didn't generate a first. For Palms, I could see us generate a prospect at or around Bahl's level + first, or a better prospect + 2nd. I just don't think teams give up both that often any more. Teams are really getting stingy on rentals. Could the money make a difference? Sure...will it? Maybe. I think it has a bigger impact if we retain and trade him now than at the deadline. Well then you think far less of Bahl than I do. That's all I'll say there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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