Official Broncos Forum Draft Thread

[AKRNA]

5 minutes ago, AnAngryAmerican said:

Not that I put a lot of stock in what the national media has to say, but we're getting A+ grades from the Chubb pick across the board.

I've said it earlier tonight, I think a lot of us got excited about the QBs, whichever one(s) we liked, but in any other year to get a talent like Chubb is something about which we should all be nothing less than thrilled. 

I think uk brought it up regarding QB's, that being, tell me where he goes and I'll tell you how good he'll be. That holds true for most positions. IMO there's not a better place for Chubb. Great DL coach, won't be rushed into the lineup do to need, can play multiple spots on the front 7, steps into a defense with quality personnel, ............ Size doesn't bother me. He's about the same size as Malik was.

It just seems a perfect fit for both sides.

I can't wait to watch him play.

[AnAngryAmerican]

5 minutes ago, Broncofan said:

We're getting A+ partly because of the value, not necessarily because Chubb should have been 1.1 on the board.   As we all know, post-draft grades are meaningless - but the A+ reflects us not being pushed to reach for need, and going for the best guy on the board.   While I think in a vacuum Barkley was totally worth a 1.2 or 1.3 pick, really the only team it made complete sense was CLE - because they got QB at 1.1, and could use a luxury pick on an elite RB difference-maker like Barkley (and he is elite).

CLE taking Ward was so nuts - I know he's the best CB, but if they had gone Chubb 1.4, they could have Oliver or Jackson at 2.34 (and get Conor Williams T for their Joe Thomas replacement).  And still get a decent RB at 2.64.    I think if CLE knew both Jackson and Oliver would be there at 2.1, they'd have reconsidered - Chubb 1.4 / Williams 2.33 / Oliver or Jackson 2.35 / RB 2.64 would have been a better result than any combo they make with Ward / Williams / Guice / BPA 2.64. 

Oh well, our gain.

Okay. 

I think we made an excellent pick. I don't expect Chubb to rack up the gaudy numbers that Von has (and, thus, talk radio and fan blogs will kvetch about him) but I think he's going to do an awful lot of things extraordinarily well, do them for a long time, and his coaches and teammates will adore him. 

[thebestever6]

I think Chubb can learn to bend he does a little in his videos just didn't need to in college. I think he can lose 10 pounds and gain core strength.  Von will teach.

[Broncofan]

20 minutes ago, AnAngryAmerican said:

Okay. 

I think we made an excellent pick. I don't expect Chubb to rack up the gaudy numbers that Von has (and, thus, talk radio and fan blogs will kvetch about him) but I think he's going to do an awful lot of things extraordinarily well, do them for a long time, and his coaches and teammates will adore him. 

Agreed.    It's not a perfect comp, because Ingram is a pass-rush beast and just OK vs. the run, whereas Chubb is a run game beast and a Robin-type to Von's Batman in pass rush, but this is very much like an Ingram-Bosa, or Clowney-Watt (bad example now because Watt's back means he's probably done being elite) pairing.   

Chubb's a multiplier - we have great players with him, he'll make them so much better.   I don't think he can be the alpha on his own that teams say "we need to take him out first", but he will be indispensable to our D in that background support role, because he's able to excel in all facets, as you mentioned.   Especially on run D - which will become even more important with Peko's age, and Gotsis' legal troubles.

[AnAngryAmerican]

3 minutes ago, Broncofan said:

It's not a perfect comp, because Ingram is a pass-rush beast and just OK vs. the run, whereas Chubb is a run game beast and a Robin-type to Von's Batman in pass rush, but this is very much like an Ingram-Bosa, or Clowney-Watt (bad example now because Watt's back means he's probably done being elite) pairing.   

Chubb's a multiplier - we have great players with him, he'll make them so much better.   I don't think he can be the alpha, but he will be indispensable to our D in that background support role.   Especially on run D - which will become even more important with Peko's age, and Gotsis' legal troubles.

Yeah but right now we don't need an alpha because we have Von, who's going to the Hall of Fame, and that takes away enough attention. 

Chubb is a more complete player now than Von was when we drafted him. Von was a pass rusher, an elite one, yes, but also one-dimensional, when he was drafted. In other aspects he had the skills and athleticism but was raw and needed coaching. I remember Von being benched, not "benched" but taken off the field in certain situations, early in his career. Chubb, on the other hand, might not have the blow-away skills Von does in one specific area but he does everything so well and, on account of his size, can stay on the field for all three downs no matter how raw he in terms of technique. That will all only improve as time goes on and, under an elite coach like Bill Kollar and savvy veterans on the team, his development should accelerate. 

[Broncofan]

5 minutes ago, AnAngryAmerican said:

Yeah but right now we don't need an alpha because we have Von, who's going to the Hall of Fame, and that takes away enough attention. 

Chubb is a more complete player now than Von was when we drafted him. Von was a pass rusher, an elite one, yes, but also one-dimensional, when he was drafted. In other aspects he had the skills and athleticism but was raw and needed coaching. I remember Von being benched, not "benched" but taken off the field in certain situations, early in his career. Chubb, on the other hand, might not have the blow-away skills Von does in one specific area but he does everything so well and, on account of his size, can stay on the field for all three downs no matter how raw he in terms of technique. That will all only improve as time goes on and, under an elite coach like Bill Kollar and savvy veterans on the team, his development should accelerate. 

Oh don't get me wrong, I'm not complaining at all that Chubb's not an alpha.   Like you said though, I bet people's expectation will be that he will put up Von-like numbers - when his impact will be so much more subtle, yet crucial.   He's a glue guy - but who you can't live without when he's not there.   

Malik isn't quite the right example, because it took him 2-3 years to develop..and by then, he was a hulking, 290+ lb pure 3-4 DE.   Chubb will be versatile enough to play DE when we need him to, be a 2nd EDGE, and be a holy terror in run support, and then create enough of a problem with pass rush that Von & others eat (or he does if the weak matchup goes his way).  But it won't be flashy when the season's done numbers-wise.   But unlike a 0-tech, it's not all grunt work that's easily replaced, either.   

I'm excited to see what Elway has in store for 2.40 - part of me is scared Elway will now say "OK, time to get the skill positions".  When a look at the big board says skill positions can wait.   Trenches, CB, Goedert.   So much value there.    My hope is that TE and CB are very much need positions long-term, and he's patient enough to let Rd3 fill our skill position needs (and Rd4 we can then hit the ILB depth, lots there).   

As much as I don't want to get involved in the 2019 QB draft class, the unexpected huge-need reaches by other teams really has me OK if we wait until Rd4 to get QB, even though I think White & Lauletta might end up being better than the 4th-5th QB's on the board next year (Rudolph's coming in Rd2, won't be us...hopefully lol).  2.40 CB/OL/Goedert, Rd 3 BPA gets skill positions, Rd 4 ILB should be the sweet spot (but we can revisit by 3.99 time).  If a White or Lauletta are still around, great.  If not, so be it (Lauletta I have a sneaking suspicion is a LAC or JAX/NE target, assuming Rudolph goes to JAX/NE team, other team being interested in those guys).

[Scoundrel]

Watching Chubb go against Kolton Miller for years should be fun

[Broncofan]

4 minutes ago, Counselor said:

Watching Chubb go against Kolton Miller for years should be fun

To be fair, we've been giving to Bosa/Ingram,  Ford/Jones/Houston & Mack vs. our RT for 3 years running now.   It's our turn there.

[thebestever6]

I see q little simeon rice watching chubb

[thebestever6]

Raiders had two draft boards and did no mock lol.

Miller led gruden and cabled mock

Derwin james toped reggies big board and the scouts.

[DiehardBronxFan]

7 hours ago, Broncofan said:

Frankly, I'm worried we'd go Ronald Jones.  I wouldn't want that.  Unless the 7 guys above went, we should be going with OL (Williams, Hernandez, Daniels) / CB (Jackson, Oliver, Davis) / TE Goedert (EDIT: EDGE Landry).   Their impact is top-30 player.  
 
RB still has Guice, John Kelly, Nick Chubb, Royce Freeman left.  I'd take Kelly & Chubb ahead of Jones - and I know one of those guys should be there at 3.7, and maybe 3.99.   We can't say the same about CB or OL or Goedert.  

EDIT:  TOTALLY forgot about Harold Landry.  That seals it.  Landry was a top 20 guy.  He and Hernandez are the top 2 guys left.  3 OL, 3 CB's, Goedert and Landry.  BOOM - 8 guys.   Elway, do NOT reach for a WR (and I'd argue don't reach for RB, either).  Wait for Rd3 there. 

 

 

I really want Goedart.  Seriously doubt he lasts to us.  Otherwise, agree, top OL or CB.  With our luck, they’ll all be gone and Landry will be the one left.  Hopefully in that case somebody,s willing to overpay to come up and get him. 

[Broncofan]

1 hour ago, DiehardBronxFan said:

I really want Goedart.  Seriously doubt he lasts to us.  Otherwise, agree, top OL or CB.  With our luck, they’ll all be gone and Landry will be the one left.  Hopefully in that case somebody,s willing to overpay to come up and get him. 

Landry could have gone ahead of Davenport; the comp was that close.   I'd imagine NO is surprised Landry fell that far (although of course they won't say that); trading up to 1.14 and giving up their 2019 1st, value would have been fine taking Landry and keeping the picks.  Hindsight is 20-20.

I would be stunned if Landry fell more than 5 more spots.    If he does, with a night's sleep, there has to be a medical or legal issue we're not hearing about.  

The 3 guys I worry about us getting attached to the most for 2.40 are Chark, and Guice/Jones.   Hopefully Chark was just a Woody Paige shot in the dark, and the way teams have reached for need, he's off our radar completely - he should be.    Guice/Jones are more worrisome because of need and the 3 RB's going in Rd1 - that was insane.  I actually had Michel and Penny ranked as my 2 & 4 RB's, but I wouldn't ever spend a 1st on them - the 5th year isn't even that much of a bargain, if you're not an elite RB (I think Michel could be, but no need to spend a 1st on that calculated gamble).    It does show how the NFL's thinking is more to do-it-all, home-run threat pass catchers.  It's not good enough to be just an OK receiver if you want to make the top of the RB list - you have to be seen as a RB who can be a one-on-one threat in the pass game.  Times are a' changing there. 

Goedert is such a talent head and shoulders above the rest - I see Ertz, others see Kelce.   That's a ceiling you love to find in Rd2.   CB/OL has such difference-making talent in this 8 spots left.   I really hope Elway realizes the skill position depth with RB/WR and the separation is so minimal across 7-8 guys in each side that the smart call is to wait.  We'll see.   Take off the old Day 2 glasses, Elway.   We need help across the entire roster - so play the board.  

[Broncofan]

I still have hope for Day 2 - but I also hope Elway takes a long hard look at recent draft history and understands how his Day 2 reaches for immediate need-first, "his guys" and overvaluing tools over actual football ability has created the problem our roster faces.

Whiffing on Gotsis in 2016 made DeMarcus Walker a justifiable 2017 pick is Elway's eyes.   This year, our total lack of progress with Carlos Henderson and the whiff so far with a similar profile in Isiah Henderson necessitates us thinking WR on Day 2.   Same with Langley and CB.    We hit on DE instead of Gotsis - we can go in a different direction Rd2 last year - like the G depth that was great last year (Feeney, sigh) - maybe it's overvaluing one position over another, but that hurt to have to double up for DE, while WR was just ugly in its transparent "let's find Tyreke Hill speed guys at skill positions with 2-3 picks".     Instead, taking a Kenny Golladay or Chris Godwin (who went immediately after) - suddenly our pressing need isn't there, and we could wait now for BPA.  If we reach at 2.40 for WR, it's clear a reflection of our concern with Henderson's lack of progress.   Now, with CB, there are 2 guys with 1st round grades easily still there (Oliver & Jackson), so that's a blessing - but if we had gone Desmond King or even Howard Wilson (unfortunate with his ACL injury in TC last year, but fully healthy this year), you wonder how urgent the need would be.  Still, Oliver & Jackson would represent great value.   WR?  Not so much, and not with the way the Board is falling.

Still, we've had a gift of a great Big Board for 2.40 still there - let's all hope Elway's BPA over need approach is more than just talk.  1.5 Chubb is a great step that way.  Keep it going, and break the Day 2 curse.

[thebestever6]

38 minutes ago, Broncofan said:

Landry could have gone ahead of Davenport; the comp was that close.   I'd imagine NO is surprised Landry fell that far (although of course they won't say that); trading up to 1.14 and giving up their 2019 1st, value would have been fine taking Landry and keeping the picks.  Hindsight is 20-20.

I would be stunned if Landry fell more than 5 more spots.    If he does, with a night's sleep, there has to be a medical or legal issue we're not hearing about.  

The 3 guys I worry about us getting attached to the most for 2.40 are Chark, and Guice/Jones.   Hopefully Chark was just a Woody Paige shot in the dark, and the way teams have reached for need, he's off our radar completely - he should be.    Guice/Jones are more worrisome because of need and the 3 RB's going in Rd1 - that was insane.  I actually had Michel and Penny ranked as my 2 & 4 RB's, but I wouldn't ever spend a 1st on them - the 5th year isn't even that much of a bargain, if you're not an elite RB (I think Michel could be, but no need to spend a 1st on that calculated gamble).    It does show how the NFL's thinking is more to do-it-all, home-run threat pass catchers.  It's not good enough to be just an OK receiver if you want to make the top of the RB list - you have to be seen as a RB who can be a one-on-one threat in the pass game.  Times are a' changing there. 

Goedert is such a talent head and shoulders above the rest - I see Ertz, others see Kelce.   That's a ceiling you love to find in Rd2.   CB/OL has such difference-making talent in this 8 spots left.   I really hope Elway realizes the skill position depth with RB/WR and the separation is so minimal across 7-8 guys in each side that the smart call is to wait.  We'll see.   Take off the old Day 2 glasses, Elway.   We need help across the entire roster - so play the board.  

What's wrong with Guice?

[Broncofan]

3 minutes ago, thebestever6 said:

What's wrong with Guice?

It’s the value.  RB can wait.  The CB/OL/Goedert dropoff is massive compared to the RB/WR dropoff if we wait.