Dome Posted December 1, 2018 Share Posted December 1, 2018 I voted for Prescott because that would be hilarious. Obviously you need to pay Lawrence first though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xmad Posted December 1, 2018 Share Posted December 1, 2018 26 minutes ago, rocky_rams said: Goff and Wentz are first round talent. Small difference Goff looked like a bust his 1st year in the NFL, like the dude legitimately didn't look like be belonged in the league. Dak had a very good rookie year in comparison. The allusion of "talent" being what separates QBs is such nonsense, coaching, players around them, and luck are much more important factors than "talent" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BayRaider Posted December 1, 2018 Share Posted December 1, 2018 1 minute ago, SwoleXmad said: Goff looked like a bust his 1st year in the NFL, like the dude legitimately didn't look like be belonged in the league. Dak had a very good rookie year in comparison. The allusion of "talent" being what separates QBs is such nonsense, coaching, players around them, and luck are much more important factors than "talent" True to a degree but Dak went in the 4th Round because he has the talent of a 4th Rounder.. Wentz and Goff are 1st Round talents. Dak has trouble with progressions and accuracy at times. And it’s clear as day he doesn’t possess the football IQ Wentz or Goff have. Dak had one of the greatest lines in history his rookie year and Elliott. He had all day and players playing in the box. They probably win the SB with Romo that year. There are exceptions to the rule.. Brees and Wilson got overlooked PURELY on height and went in the 3rd Round. After Wilson, that doesn’t happen much anymore. Bradys would also mostly related to size. He looked extremely skinny , under 200lbs, and somehow really high body fat with not much muscle definition. Daks 4th Round grade was because of actual intangibles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xmad Posted December 1, 2018 Share Posted December 1, 2018 40 minutes ago, BayRaider said: True to a degree but Dak went in the 4th Round because he has the talent of a 4th Rounder.. Wentz and Goff are 1st Round talents. Dak has trouble with progressions and accuracy at times. And it’s clear as day he doesn’t possess the football IQ Wentz or Goff have. Dak had one of the greatest lines in history his rookie year and Elliott. He had all day and players playing in the box. They probably win the SB with Romo that year. There are exceptions to the rule.. Brees and Wilson got overlooked PURELY on height and went in the 3rd Round. After Wilson, that doesn’t happen much anymore. Bradys would also mostly related to size. He looked extremely skinny , under 200lbs, and somehow really high body fat with not much muscle definition. Daks 4th Round grade was because of actual intangibles. I love how fans toss around these terms yet we have no way to gauge these for any players, it's just a blanket term used to say why "X player is better than X".Goff is only as good as he is because the Rams got a coach that knew how to actually ya know coach, and Wentz enjoyed similar success under Pederson. Who is Dak's current OC/HC? Scott Linehan and Jason Garrett, the frosted flakes of coaching. Dak went in the 4th round because QBs get overlooked teams have their preferences and the Cowboys almost took whatever the ex-broncos QB name is from the 2016 class, he went on to have the best season of the 2016 class and has the most career wins to date. (Not that wins are an accurate measure to judge a QB given Wentz/Goff have missed games because rookie year and injuries) https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2672393-why-everyone-missed-on-dak-prescott - an interesting look at this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DigInBoys Posted December 1, 2018 Share Posted December 1, 2018 1 hour ago, SwoleXmad said: Goff looked like a bust his 1st year in the NFL, like the dude legitimately didn't look like be belonged in the league. Dak had a very good rookie year in comparison. The allusion of "talent" being what separates QBs is such nonsense, coaching, players around them, and luck are much more important factors than "talent" No, they are factors but talent is the greatest factor. Goff was a #1 pick with arguably the absolute worst offensive coach in the last 10 years. Unique situation. You aren't going to turn CJ Beathard into Aaron Rodgers no matter what the coaching and talent around him is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xmad Posted December 1, 2018 Share Posted December 1, 2018 11 minutes ago, DigInBoys said: No, they are factors but talent is the greatest factor. Goff was a #1 pick with arguably the absolute worst offensive coach in the last 10 years. Unique situation. You aren't going to turn CJ Beathard into Aaron Rodgers no matter what the coaching and talent around him is. Talent isn't a metric, it's something that exists as a subjective thing that exists because we need something to measure how good a QB is besides stats. Rodgers is more "talented" than Brady yet Brady has more rings than Rodgers as a starter, why? Because of his coaching and the team around him. You are correct, you can't turn a dead rat into a pet but you can turn a rat with flaws into a well trained hoop jumper. I mean in the end it doesn't matter, Goff looks like the best QB of the 2016 class by a decent margin so far but we all saw how that changed within 3 seasons(Dak, Wentz, Lynch and then goff) and now it's (Goff,Wentz, Dek) so who knows how this all turns out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DigInBoys Posted December 1, 2018 Share Posted December 1, 2018 Just now, SwoleXmad said: Talent isn't a metric, it's something that exists as a subjective thing that exists because we need something to measure how good a QB is besides stats. Rodgers is more "talented" than Brady yet Brady has more rings than Rodgers as a starter, why? Because of his coaching and the team around him. You are correct, you can't turn a dead rat into a pet but you can turn a rat with flaws into a well trained hoop jumper. I mean in the end it doesn't matter, Goff looks like the best QB of the 2016 class by a decent margin so far but we all saw how that changed within 3 seasons(Dak, Wentz, Lynch and then goff) and now it's (Goff,Wentz, Dek) so who knows how this all turns out. Talent isn't an abstract definition. It's physical ability combined with football IQ combined with the ability to have a work ethic that other's can't/won't match. Brady has more rings because football is a team game. That's an entirely different discussion. Both Rodgers and Brady are talented. Who's more talented can be debated. The ability to see the field and make a decision then execute on that decision and make a pinpoint pass in fractions of a second is something that's beyond coaching and the talent you play with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rocky_rams Posted December 1, 2018 Share Posted December 1, 2018 2 hours ago, SwoleXmad said: Goff looked like a bust his 1st year in the NFL, like the dude legitimately didn't look like be belonged in the league. Dak had a very good rookie year in comparison. The allusion of "talent" being what separates QBs is such nonsense, coaching, players around them, and luck are much more important factors than "talent" I don’t how you evaluate rankings for prospects but in the NFL draft, they mostly rank them based off talent, hard work, IQ, and how coachable they are. Dak is not anywhere near comparable to Goff or Wentz in arm talent or mental IQ. Being coachable and hard working just aren’t enough. Even if Dak had McVay or Pederson, he still can’t make the throws Goff/Wentz can Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xmad Posted December 1, 2018 Share Posted December 1, 2018 1 hour ago, DigInBoys said: Talent isn't an abstract definition. It's physical ability combined with football IQ combined with the ability to have a work ethic that other's can't/won't match. Brady has more rings because football is a team game. That's an entirely different discussion. Both Rodgers and Brady are talented. Who's more talented can be debated. The ability to see the field and make a decision then execute on that decision and make a pinpoint pass in fractions of a second is something that's beyond coaching and the talent you play with. Talent doesn't have a defined term for football (or really any specific sport tbh), that's your definition of it. 1 hour ago, rocky_rams said: I don’t how you evaluate rankings for prospects but in the NFL draft, they mostly rank them based off talent, hard work, IQ, and how coachable they are. Dak is not anywhere near comparable to Goff or Wentz in arm talent or mental IQ. Being coachable and hard working just aren’t enough. Even if Dak had McVay or Pederson, he still can’t make the throws Goff/Wentz can Uh huh. People keep saying this about QBs but again, this is your opinion and Football IQ/Arm Talent are subjective at best. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
riceman80 Posted December 1, 2018 Share Posted December 1, 2018 In order of importance and logic, its should go D-Law, Zeke, Coop, then Dak. Using Jerry logic...Dak, Coop, Zeke, then D-Law I feel like Jerry probably thinks he has a new Aikman, Emmitt, and Irvin in Dake, Zeke, and Coop. I'd be 0% surprised if D-Law eventually leaves in free agency. I know they got some money but a 25-30 mil QB, a 10-15 mil RB, a 15-20 mil WR, and a 20 mil DE is ALOT of money for any team. Someone's gonna get left out and my money is on D-Law Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rocky_rams Posted December 1, 2018 Share Posted December 1, 2018 1 hour ago, SwoleXmad said: Talent doesn't have a defined term for football (or really any specific sport tbh), that's your definition of it. Uh huh. People keep saying this about QBs but again, this is your opinion and Football IQ/Arm Talent are subjective at best. If Arm Talent and IQ were subjective then there would be no reason why Dak would last til the 4th round with his athleticism and size Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xmad Posted December 1, 2018 Share Posted December 1, 2018 5 hours ago, rocky_rams said: If Arm Talent and IQ were subjective then there would be no reason why Dak would last til the 4th round with his athleticism and size Can you tell me every QB's IQ and Arm Talent and rank them in order and guarentee me with like 80% accuracy that's how the NFL FO's view QBs? I'm gonna bet on no. It's all subjective, hence why some teams had Dak in the 3rd round and some had him in the 7th. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calvert28 Posted December 1, 2018 Share Posted December 1, 2018 11 hours ago, rocky_rams said: Goff and Wentz are first round talent. Small difference Neither was Brady. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calamity_Cometh Posted December 1, 2018 Share Posted December 1, 2018 I'll probably get killed for this but if the Bucs part ways with Winston, maybe take a shot on him? Defense is too good to tank. They've been slowly building up that front 7 for years now and Thursday is when it finally boiled over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rocky_rams Posted December 1, 2018 Share Posted December 1, 2018 4 hours ago, SwoleXmad said: Can you tell me every QB's IQ and Arm Talent and rank them in order and guarentee me with like 80% accuracy that's how the NFL FO's view QBs? I'm gonna bet on no. It's all subjective, hence why some teams had Dak in the 3rd round and some had him in the 7th. But it’s not really subjective. Most people agree unanimously which is why Dak was not graded a round one talent. He had the size and athleticism. If he had the arm talent, he would’ve been in the first round. He simply can’t make throws that Goff and Wentz can Look at Paxton Lynch. He had the raw talent but didn’t have the mental aspect of it and he was graded by almost everyone as a first rounder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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