Raiders Defense

[jimkelly02]

1 hour ago, Geezy said:

You and me both bro, I just want Ws...

If I had to give my stance on Carr:

He’s a starting QB that’s not going to win us games but with the good pass protection will take us as far as his surrounding playmakers and defense will take us.  He’s also at a point in his front loaded contact where he’s a value for a franchise QB no longer on a rookie contract.

carr is scheduled for cap hits of 21.5, 22.125, and >19.9m which will make him the lowest paid franchise qb (this excludes situations like Tannehill signing 1yr with Tennessee) (All the lower paid or similarly paid QBs are on expiring contracts this season, besides Cam Newtown who has 1 year left).  This is at a time when bottom level, stop gap starting QBs are getting 22m(Foles) to 27m(Briskett) and over the next 3 years this number will likely rise to 25-32mil.

With our QB at a manageable price, albeit not on a rookie contract, I think our best shot is to leverage having so many contributing players on super cheap, rookie deals over the next 2-3 additional years and wisely spend money in FA and use our above normal draft equity to surround him with some WR talent and a backup RB to preserve Jacobs long term and build up a defense that will keep us in games, not lose them.  We’re on an upward trend and could be a playoff team with some a legit WR1, WR3, RB2 on offense and 2 new starting LBs, CB1, and an DE/DT. Given our cap situation and draft capital we can be a playoff team next year.  I think we’re best served spending a 2nd (I know we don’t have one but we could always acquire one in a trade down in the first round or trade up from round 3) or 3rd on a developmental QB to push and ultimately succeed Carr.  The problem with this theory is if we don’t hit on our additions and Carr fails then we’ve wasted a year before rebuilding.  However, after being in rebuilding mode since 2003? Non stop minus one fluke season I think we gotta take the chance.  I’m 35 years old and we’ve been rebuilding since I graduated high school.  That’s a long 6 years in college, 2 prison terms, and a few years getting my life in order.... it’s felt like a lifetime and a half.  Now that I saw light at The end of the tunnel (earlier this year) I don’t wanna go back to the darkness.  I’d honestly rather spend the next 1-2 years tHinking we might just be back to an honorable team only to fail and rip it all down for another “4 year rebuild process”.  

[BackinBlack]

4 hours ago, NCOUGHMAN said:

Really we’re ragging on a defense that only gave up 2 fgs in 3 qtrs

last i checked football is a 4 quarter game lol?

literally the last 2 drives of the game we needed one stop against JAX of all teams and our D let them drive the entire field.

I never posted much before, but the DC haters are getting ridiculous.. man WTF cares if we gave up 6 points in 3 qurters. 
with 7 mins left in the game we were up 13 and they gave up 14 points get real.


thats like saying .. Our O scored 21 points against Tenn in the first half! they dominated. 

[BackinBlack]

3 hours ago, NCOUGHMAN said:

Lol you’re right we should’ve shut them out all game just to get a w. How dare our defense let Leo get over 40 yards rushing. How dare we expect our offense to score more than 2 tds a game. You’re right and meetings are the same as in game 

lol ill just say.. ever since the Jamarcus days.. i havent said much...but i sure am glad you have no control over the raiders lol

you are potentially more clueless than HB. your arguments make no sense. At least HB just loves Carr because of the fresno connection.
 

[G]

46 minutes ago, jimkelly02 said:

If I had to give my stance on Carr:

He’s a starting QB that’s not going to win us games but with the good pass protection will take us as far as his surrounding playmakers and defense will take us.  He’s also at a point in his front loaded contact where he’s a value for a franchise QB no longer on a rookie contract.

carr is scheduled for cap hits of 21.5, 22.125, and >19.9m which will make him the lowest paid franchise qb (this excludes situations like Tannehill signing 1yr with Tennessee) (All the lower paid or similarly paid QBs are on expiring contracts this season, besides Cam Newtown who has 1 year left).  This is at a time when bottom level, stop gap starting QBs are getting 22m(Foles) to 27m(Briskett) and over the next 3 years this number will likely rise to 25-32mil.

With our QB at a manageable price, albeit not on a rookie contract, I think our best shot is to leverage having so many contributing players on super cheap, rookie deals over the next 2-3 additional years and wisely spend money in FA and use our above normal draft equity to surround him with some WR talent and a backup RB to preserve Jacobs long term and build up a defense that will keep us in games, not lose them.  We’re on an upward trend and could be a playoff team with some a legit WR1, WR3, RB2 on offense and 2 new starting LBs, CB1, and an DE/DT. Given our cap situation and draft capital we can be a playoff team next year.  I think we’re best served spending a 2nd (I know we don’t have one but we could always acquire one in a trade down in the first round or trade up from round 3) or 3rd on a developmental QB to push and ultimately succeed Carr.  The problem with this theory is if we don’t hit on our additions and Carr fails then we’ve wasted a year before rebuilding.  However, after being in rebuilding mode since 2003? 

We differ on the life experiences but all the above we are 100% on the same page. I do think they could move up for 'hype' with the Vegas move but Gruden has security so he'll probably follow his plan for a few more seasons.I'd go even further on the 'rebuild' into the 90's Gruden was building something but that was 1998 draft. I wonder if we traded McGlockton to the Skins instead of them getting Gilbert. Maybe Al adds Moss and the past adds some championships. However 'hindsight' isn't here and I'd say we were rebuilding before that. Hoss was the best QB we had for a while as I remember Moron-O-Vich, Jay 'overthrow' Cheese Schredder, Vince Evans...etc...

It's been BAD!!! WAY WORSE than happy feet and could get even worse throwing him out for peanuts...His contract alone makes him a keeper, even if his play is inconsistent. Few weeks back the same posters were on his jock and would be again if he'd CONSISTENTLY produce in the clutch. DC is too nice and needs that throat stomping mentality to get the love around here.

[roi34]

6 hours ago, NJ Raider said:

Not sure how Waller ended up there. Totally meant to say Brown. One of our talented players on offense. They line up next to each other sometimes. Lol

It's fantasy finals not cool bro haha

[NJ Raider]

My bad man. It was a typo. I get it. Missed my finals by a third of a point last week. 

[Chali21]

15 hours ago, NCOUGHMAN said:

Really 2 guys get their first start and are confused on a play wow I’ve never seen that happen before. 

Pg is ok but I’d rather have Rivera 

I think Burfict’s suspension has really hurt this team. He was the defensive captain and was able to line them up correctly. He was like having a coach on the field. 

[holyghost]

45 minutes ago, Chali21 said:

I think Burfict’s suspension has really hurt this team. He was the defensive captain and was able to line them up correctly. He was like having a coach on the field. 

Blame coaches and staff for banking so much of their team's success on a guy who was one strike away from this outcome and showed no indications he wouldn't hit that strike. Same goes for the offense and Antonio Brown. So much banked on an utter headcase. It's a theme on both sides of the ball. Big stupid risks, both failed with bad consequences. 

Maybe it's long past the time to use some serious draft capital on the linebacking corps, which is abominably bad. I wouldn't even trust any of the current players there to be solid backups, that is how bad it is. Name a guy we have right now that you would want to play in case of injury, and trust that guy to keep a good defense playing well. None, not Morrow, Whitehead, Lee, Compton, none. On a good or great defense they don't make the roster. I don't think any of them are even capable of being high end specialists, 5-10 snap guys in tightly defined roles. That's how bad our unit is. Week in and week out their unit is nowhere to be found. Did we have one linebacker have one notably good game all year? Not one.

 

[Geezy]

47 minutes ago, holyghost said:

Blame coaches and staff for banking so much of their team's success on a guy who was one strike away from this outcome and showed no indications he wouldn't hit that strike. Same goes for the offense and Antonio Brown. So much banked on an utter headcase. It's a theme on both sides of the ball. Big stupid risks, both failed with bad consequences. 

Maybe it's long past the time to use some serious draft capital on the linebacking corps, which is abominably bad. I wouldn't even trust any of the current players there to be solid backups, that is how bad it is. Name a guy we have right now that you would want to play in case of injury, and trust that guy to keep a good defense playing well. None, not Morrow, Whitehead, Lee, Compton, none. On a good or great defense they don't make the roster. I don't think any of them are even capable of being high end specialists, 5-10 snap guys in tightly defined roles. That's how bad our unit is. Week in and week out their unit is nowhere to be found. Did we have one linebacker have one notably good game all year? Not one.

 

Straight up, probably the worst unit in the NFL. I hate to pile on, but man, it’s disgusting to watch week in week out. Can’t line up, can’t tackle, can’t cover....

[drfrey13]

17 minutes ago, Geezy said:

Straight up, probably the worst unit in the NFL. I hate to pile on, but man, it’s disgusting to watch week in week out. Can’t line up, can’t tackle, can’t cover....

Not going to defend the unit because many of us, myself included, have been pounding the table for years and some decades.  This tem is much better when they have had that vet leader in the middle.  Some high picks or FAs would be well worth it.

1 hour ago, holyghost said:

Blame coaches and staff for banking so much of their team's success on a guy who was one strike away from this outcome and showed no indications he wouldn't hit that strike. Same goes for the offense and Antonio Brown. So much banked on an utter headcase. It's a theme on both sides of the ball. Big stupid risks, both failed with bad consequences. 

Maybe it's long past the time to use some serious draft capital on the linebacking corps, which is abominably bad. I wouldn't even trust any of the current players there to be solid backups, that is how bad it is. Name a guy we have right now that you would want to play in case of injury, and trust that guy to keep a good defense playing well. None, not Morrow, Whitehead, Lee, Compton, none. On a good or great defense they don't make the roster. I don't think any of them are even capable of being high end specialists, 5-10 snap guys in tightly defined roles. That's how bad our unit is. Week in and week out their unit is nowhere to be found. Did we have one linebacker have one notably good game all year? Not one.

 

Yes they should add more talent, Burfict has a history, and we did neither.  We were not going to add solid depth or be able to account for injury/suspensions in that time frame either.  That takes time.  Burfict suspension was absolute garbage.  Should he have received a couple games? yes because of his history but an entire season was beyond ridiculous. Rememeber that was the third worst hit of that WEEK!  The other 2 were not suspended or even kicked out of the game.

[Geezy]

I agree the Burfict suspension was complete garbage. I would bring him back next year, to compete and to teach PGs defense, but we need to be smart and have other depth. 

[NCOUGHMAN]

9 hours ago, BackinBlack said:

lol ill just say.. ever since the Jamarcus days.. i havent said much...but i sure am glad you have no control over the raiders lol

you are potentially more clueless than HB. your arguments make no sense. At least HB just loves Carr because of the fresno connection.
 

Meh it’s a free country and everyone is entitled to their own opinion.

btw weren’t you one of the posters who used to mail me their mocks asking for my opinion before we switched to this new forum?

[holyghost]

56 minutes ago, Geezy said:

I agree the Burfict suspension was complete garbage. I would bring him back next year, to compete and to teach PGs defense, but we need to be smart and have other depth. 

I don't think you can bring him back as anything more than a backup and/or someone to groom as a linebacker coach. If he is the starter it is just an utterly idiotic move. To do the same thing that burned this team horribly, again.

Sure, starters and depth take time (to drfrey). But this team has utterly and arrogantly ignored the position for years now. It's enough already, from Del Rio and McKenzie to Gruden, going back to Al and so on. I watch this team weekly and I swear it's as if we don't even have linebackers on the field. If the line doesn't stop a run, it's a guaranteed 5-10 yarder. They are never making a play in coverage, burned constantly. The only one of them that makes some plays is Morrow, but his angles and tackling are so bad that he never actually finishes the play he is in position for. And that can't make up for his terrible lapses which cost us points and games numerous times. Every week he makes a game changing bad play or more than one. And he is our best linebacker - think about that. Every one of them, if you are intent on having a good defense, are not fit for more than 5 snaps a game. If they're getting more than that, you no longer have a good defense.

[BackinBlack]

7 minutes ago, NCOUGHMAN said:

Meh it’s a free country and everyone is entitled to their own opinion.

btw weren’t you one of the posters who used to mail me their mocks asking for my opinion before we switched to this new forum?

lol nah ive never done a mock / sent a private message aha. 

honestly though, i do like reading everyones opinion, i like to see things from different perspectives.
I definitely was wrong on Carr, I thought he was going to be an absolute stud this year.. he hasnt. I really thought consistency in the O would help him and he is still struggling.

Im just tired of the constant DC is trash talk. He is an average player. He is a big part of the reason why we are sub 500. 
I would prefer to fix the D, with our 2 first round picks, but if a QB falls that both mayock and gruden love, than i understand. 

QB is the most important position in the game. If we found an elite QB, this team could compete. 

[NCOUGHMAN]

33 minutes ago, BackinBlack said:

lol nah ive never done a mock / sent a private message aha. 

honestly though, i do like reading everyones opinion, i like to see things from different perspectives.
I definitely was wrong on Carr, I thought he was going to be an absolute stud this year.. he hasnt. I really thought consistency in the O would help him and he is still struggling.

Im just tired of the constant DC is trash talk. He is an average player. He is a big part of the reason why we are sub 500. 
I would prefer to fix the D, with our 2 first round picks, but if a QB falls that both mayock and gruden love, than i understand. 

QB is the most important position in the game. If we found an elite QB, this team could compete. 

I actually agree with everything you said in this post.

-I agree about carr I’m also very disappointed like I said in another thread he has all the tools you want in a franchise qb except guts I thought he’d overcome his fears of failure, injury or whatever but seems too big for him to overcome 

-I also want to fix the def we need lbs badly 

-qb is a touchy subject cause the draft is top heavy in regards to qbs and if you’re not top 7 you don’t get a good option but if one falls then gotta consider it.

-I want at least 2 lbs out of this draft, gonna need another db

-as I said earlier I’m I big Ron Rivera fan so if he’s available may have to consider him to replace pg similar concepts meaning won’t have to purge the roster