Off-Topic: The WORLD CHAMPION Washington Nationals Thread

[turtle28]

Ohhh Davey boy

[Slateman]

http://www.twitter.com/nationals/status/1025120621762695173?s=21

 

[Woz]

On 7/31/2018 at 2:55 PM, Skinsin2013 said:

Fire sale = dumping just because??? Quite the leap.

To be clear, I would have dealt Harp, Wieters, Gio/Hellickson, and/ORRRRRR Herrera.

And to be fair, we're not in the negotiating rooms... so we have no idea what the return offers are. I would have been fine with not getting an organization's BEST prospect for Bryce... but a few mid-tier guys would have worked. I was looking at Pavin Smith and Evan White for instance.

The definition of a fire sale is "everything must go regardless of the price." It is by definition when you are trying to recover any value because everything is essentially destroyed. Because, you know, a fire happened.

If that's not what you meant, then I am sorry. That said, there's a difference between being a seller and a fire sale.

As for your targets, Herrera made a ton of sense but apparently the reliever market was flooded with options; Wieters' value was in the toilet due to his horrible hitting; and, Hellickson cannot last four innings and has no value. Only Harper and Gio would have been viable chits. But both would have been rentals as both had expiring deals. How much would Gio, as a 32 year old starting pitcher, been worth? While I am dubious they have a chance at the division, throwing away your only other reliable starter beyond Scherzer (and I am surprised by typing that) would have been throwing in the towel. Harper had the most value, but I guess they think they can keep him?

[Woz]

On 7/31/2018 at 2:56 PM, Slateman said:

Yes because Suero "deserved " a chance.

Not buying it. Suero is a JAG

Kintzler is also, what, 33? Suero might be JAG, but at least he's young. Maybe he turns into something (even of that something is a later chit in a separate deal).

[turtle28]

7 hours ago, Woz said:

Kintzler is also, what, 33? Suero might be JAG, but at least he's young. Maybe he turns into something (even of that something is a later chit in a separate deal).

Yeah, I’d much rather have a young JAG who has the potential to improve into something than an extra reliever that honestly they didn’t even use much this year since he hurt his forearm in May or whenever bc Miller and others pitched better.

[Skinsin2013]

15 hours ago, Woz said:

The definition of a fire sale is "everything must go regardless of the price." It is by definition when you are trying to recover any value because everything is essentially destroyed. Because, you know, a fire happened.

If that's not what you meant, then I am sorry. That said, there's a difference between being a seller and a fire sale.

As for your targets, Herrera made a ton of sense but apparently the reliever market was flooded with options; Wieters' value was in the toilet due to his horrible hitting; and, Hellickson cannot last four innings and has no value. Only Harper and Gio would have been viable chits. But both would have been rentals as both had expiring deals. How much would Gio, as a 32 year old starting pitcher, been worth? While I am dubious they have a chance at the division, throwing away your only other reliable starter beyond Scherzer (and I am surprised by typing that) would have been throwing in the towel. Harper had the most value, but I guess they think they can keep him?

Then fire sales are non-existent in sports. No one sells off everything regardless of price.

I agree with you (said something similar) in that we probably weren't getting the value we wanted in return. Plus it sounds like the Lerners nixed any big trades the night before.

[Skinsin2013]

On 8/1/2018 at 6:15 PM, Skinsin2013 said:

I don't like the Kelly move. Davey should have stepped in when there was barking between Kelly and the umps... the home plate ump twice. Instead he does nothing.

Kelly gets irritated... for being in there, the umps, the bomb... and he tosses his glove and promptly picks it up.

Following the game, you have Rizzo playing bad cop because Davey is all good cop.

Nailed this one...

https://thefandc.radio.com/shawn-kelley-opens-up-dfa-nationals

"I felt like the umps, for whatever reason, were just annoyed with the game and frustrated and took it out on me," he explained. "I was getting mixed signals from the umpires and I was frustrated about that. I let my frustration get to me a little bit, and the fact that nobody came out to even argue with the umpires or question them on my behalf, because I can't get tossed out right there in that situation and make somebody else come into the game."

Before Kelley gave up the homer and threw his glove, cameras caught him arguing with the umps, and him looking over to the dugout for help. Asked if it's fair to say he was upset with Martinez for not coming out, Kelley said, "Well, just anybody. I mean, pitching coach, whatever."

"I was being yelled at by the umpire to slow down behind the plate," he said. "And then the guy behind me started chirping at me, telling me he was going to call a balk on me. He actually said, 'You want me to call a balk on you in a 25-1 game?' I said, 'Not really. I'm just trying to hurry up and get this over with.' And then the ump behind the plate told me 'hurry up,' and I said, 'Well you just told me to slow down.'

"And then I got squeezed on a few pitches, I felt like. I just kind of felt like I was out there kind of own my own, and everybody was just having a good time not really paying attention to what was going on. And like I said, I can't go off on the umpire and get ejected right there, because then we use another pitcher and a third reliever in a 25-1 game."

...

watching the game, I was thinking 'I don't give a damn what the score is, this crew is messing with Kelly and Davey should do something about it.' Instead Davey sat on his hands and tossed his player under the bus.

[lavar703]

Davey is a crappy manager. Most of us understand this but we don’t know baseball so there’s that. 

[Woz]

On 8/3/2018 at 7:45 AM, Skinsin2013 said:

Then fire sales are non-existent in sports. No one sells off everything regardless of price.

The Miami Marlins say "hi."

[Woz]

On 8/3/2018 at 7:45 AM, Skinsin2013 said:

I agree with you (said something similar) in that we probably weren't getting the value we wanted in return. Plus it sounds like the Lerners nixed any big trades the night before.

I will admit, however, that I am surprised that they stayed put. They didn't go into sell mode (the team doesn't seem to be able to get over the hump with Davey at the helm) but they didn't go into buy mode either (getting a guy like Lynn as starter help would have made sense). Not sure what the play there was.

Maybe Rizzo wanted to sell but the Lerners wanted to buy?

[Woz]

22 hours ago, lavar703 said:

Davey is a crappy manager. Most of us understand this but we don’t know baseball so there’s that. 

I may not have ever played organized baseball, but I think even I could do a better job of managing the talent/egos than Martinez is. That's the primary job of a manager ... and he's not doing it. I don't think he's lost the locker room yet but the fact I could even type that is a major indictment of him.

[Slateman]

Glad we didnt trade Gio to the Brewers.

[Woz]

17 minutes ago, Slateman said:

Glad we didnt trade Gio to the Brewers.

Keep in mind that if we had traded him, we would be starting Hellickson/Fedde more often. We got a "bad Gio" game; there will be "good Gio" games too. There is no "good Hellickson/Fedde" game unless Martinez gets smart and plays the two of them as part of a deal where they only get two times through the lineup or 85 pitches before getting pulled regardless. The two of them could combine to a solid 7-8 inning starter and give the bullpen a day off.

But that's not happening. Just like players bunting against the switch.

[turtle28]

1 hour ago, Woz said:

I may not have ever played organized baseball, but I think even I could do a better job of managing the talent/egos than Martinez is. That's the primary job of a manager ... and he's not doing it. I don't think he's lost the locker room yet but the fact I could even type that is a major indictment of him.

I don’t think Davey ever had the lockeroom which, is something Dusty always had. The Lerner’s screwed the pooch big time on this. Rizzo wanted Dusty back, the Lerner’s didn’t want to give him the raise needed to retain him, just like they didn’t want to offer Bud Black a bigger contract or Joe Girardi to have them in the dugout.

Its a issue which, we’re sadly going to just have to learn to live with because I don’t see it/them changing.

[lavar703]

11 minutes ago, turtle28 said:

I don’t think Davey ever had the lockeroom which, is something Dusty always had. The Lerner’s screwed the pooch big time on this. Rizzo wanted Dusty back, the Lerner’s didn’t want to give him the raise needed to retain him, just like they didn’t want to offer Bud Black a bigger contract or Joe Girardi to have them in the dugout.

Its a issue which, we’re sadly going to just have to learn to live with because I don’t see it/them changing.

Joe Girardi never had an interest in coming here. It wasn't just about money.