A Philosophical Examination of the Sport Mind (Buncha Jerks Cost Us Rings)

[Cakeshoppe]

17 minutes ago, Green19 said:

I guess I’m asking how will football history remember him. Both packer history and league history wise.

With the consistent leadership/personality questions and like you stated with the drop in play... how kind will history be?

I think if he wins another title he’ll be fine. Players and coaches will have been able to rally around him, etc. If he doesn’t... I don’t know if he isn’t seen as just the 3rd best QB in GB history. And his personality being the main thing people point to for the lack of titles given his talent. I think people will forget McCarthy and Ted and Rodgers will be the main issue why they failed to win more. It’s slightly happening now ... as you said with his drop in play.

I think as it stands, Rodgers' legacy is:

From 2010-2014, he played the QB position at a level no has seen before. In the four years since, he's only put up one full season's worth of tape that lives up to the expectations he set in those years.

If he can return to form and put up another 3 yeas at MVP candidate level, I think NFL films will be able to put together enough footage of Hail Marys and wild scrambling to assuage most fans' concerns about those year, explaining away a little slump due to injury and a messy breakup with the coach. If he keeps on his 2018 trajectory, I think he'll always be seen as what could have been, a dynamic and exciting player who failed to deliver on the promise of those early years.

[Norm]

Lol wait an anonymous coach said **** those guys about fin and Greg lolol that's ******* hilarious

[Norm]

1 hour ago, Packerraymond said:

I see we're discussing Seattle game on a mild April Saturday morn. Excellent. Would you gents like to move on to a discussion of the passing of my childhood pets or my parents divorce next? 

The horse has been so beaten on this game that we've dug halfway to China beating the ground where that horse used to be. How do any of you have energy left to debate that game?

Wanna talk about AJ Hawk and how he's a bust with me?

[AlexGreen#20]

Look at the drives. 

That first drive was a bad interception. Bennett may have gone off-sides,  but if he did, it wasn't by much. I certainly can't confirm he broke the plane based on the replay angle, and I'm also not sure he didn't get back in time. You can't be relying on the refs to bail you out. That was three points that he pissed away with an interception in field goal territory.

The second drive he didn't get a chance to throw in the redzone.

The third drive he just overthrew to Nelson. Nelson got a fingertip on it, but it was an overthrow, plain and simple. Just a bad throw. Not even under pressure.

The fourth drive was the TD.

The fifth drive he didn't get a chance to throw in the sequence that lead to the punt. 

The sixth drive, for the sake of argument let's say that he was right and Jordy was wrong, why the **** is he throwing to Jordy on the boundary and not Cobb in the slot when Jordy is covered on the short curl and Cobb is wide ******* open??????

The seventh drive, nobody was open on the last sequence

The eigth drive, threw a low ball to Cobb on 3rd and 6 that killed the YAC.

the ninth drive, there wasn't much he could have done. Nobody was open.

The tenth drive, Quarless was hit almost immediately and the defender may have even gotten his hands on the ball as it was arriving.

The eleventh drive was a run out the clock drive.

The twelth drive he has the first down if he chooses to throw to Lacy immediately on his little scramble dance, or chooses to run it. Instead he does neither, waits for Lacy to start to block and throws it at his back. Could have been a game winning TD. Instead Crosby kicks the FG to go to OT.

He killed five drives. Great QBs don't kill 5 drives in playoff games.

 

 

[JaireAlex]

25 minutes ago, AlexGreen#20 said:

Look at the drives. 

That first drive was a bad interception. Bennett may have gone off-sides,  but if he did, it wasn't by much. I certainly can't confirm he broke the plane based on the replay angle, and I'm also not sure he didn't get back in time. You can't be relying on the refs to bail you out. That was three points that he pissed away with an interception in field goal territory. [After the game Rodgers said he thought it was offsides or he doesn't throw it]

The second drive he didn't get a chance to throw in the redzone.

The third drive he just overthrew to Nelson. Nelson got a fingertip on it, but it was an overthrow, plain and simple. Just a bad throw. Not even under pressure.

The fourth drive was the TD.

The fifth drive he didn't get a chance to throw in the sequence that lead to the punt. 

The sixth drive, for the sake of argument let's say that he was right and Jordy was wrong, why the **** is he throwing to Jordy on the boundary and not Cobb in the slot when Jordy is covered on the short curl and Cobb is wide ******* open??????

The seventh drive, nobody was open on the last sequence

The eigth drive, threw a low ball to Cobb on 3rd and 6 that killed the YAC.

the ninth drive, there wasn't much he could have done. Nobody was open.

The tenth drive, Quarless was hit almost immediately and the defender may have even gotten his hands on the ball as it was arriving.

The eleventh drive was a run out the clock drive.

The twelth drive he has the first down if he chooses to throw to Lacy immediately on his little scramble dance, or chooses to run it. Instead he does neither, waits for Lacy to start to block and throws it at his back. Could have been a game winning TD. Instead Crosby kicks the FG to go to OT.

He killed five drives. Great QBs don't kill 5 drives in playoff games.

 

 

He played injured against a great defense on the road 

Give it up

There's only one opinion you can ever allow for. Discussion killer. Forum killer. You cannot even concede anyone anything. You can have some great insight, but that game was not on Rodgers. I never said it was his best, but that game was not on him. Brady, Brees, Payton, Favre ALL had worse games in better circumstances.

Edit: Not to mention he came back and tied it. Never had a chance in overtime, like the Janis is GOAT  game in the desert playoffs

[squire12]

20 minutes ago, AlexGreen#20 said:

Look at the drives. 

That first drive was a bad interception. Bennett may have gone off-sides,  but if he did, it wasn't by much. I certainly can't confirm he broke the plane based on the replay angle, and I'm also not sure he didn't get back in time. You can't be relying on the refs to bail you out. That was three points that he pissed away with an interception in field goal territory.

The second drive he didn't get a chance to throw in the redzone.

The third drive he just overthrew to Nelson. Nelson got a fingertip on it, but it was an overthrow, plain and simple. Just a bad throw. Not even under pressure.

The fourth drive was the TD.

The fifth drive he didn't get a chance to throw in the sequence that lead to the punt. 

The sixth drive, for the sake of argument let's say that he was right and Jordy was wrong, why the **** is he throwing to Jordy on the boundary and not Cobb in the slot when Jordy is covered on the short curl and Cobb is wide ******* open??????

The seventh drive, nobody was open on the last sequence

The eigth drive, threw a low ball to Cobb on 3rd and 6 that killed the YAC.

the ninth drive, there wasn't much he could have done. Nobody was open.

The tenth drive, Quarless was hit almost immediately and the defender may have even gotten his hands on the ball as it was arriving.

The eleventh drive was a run out the clock drive.

The twelth drive he has the first down if he chooses to throw to Lacy immediately on his little scramble dance, or chooses to run it. Instead he does neither, waits for Lacy to start to block and throws it at his back. Could have been a game winning TD. Instead Crosby kicks the FG to go to OT.

He killed five drives. Great QBs don't kill 5 drives in playoff games.

 

 

But why are you putting all the blame on Aaron 'my idol' Rodgers?  It is not fair to him. He needs other players to play better so he can look like the GOAT.

[AlexGreen#20]

1 minute ago, JaireAlex said:

He played injured against a great defense on the road 

Give it up

There's only one opinion you can ever allow for. Discussion killer. Forum killer. You cannot even concede anyone anything. You can have some great insight, but that game was not on Rodgers. I never said it was his best, but that game was not on him. Brady, Brees, Payton, Favre ALL had worse games in better circumstances.

Cool, in week 20, everybody is injured to some extent.

Every time Rodgers stubs his toe, people are dying to give him a pass. People rip on anybody else for having a bad game when hurt.

But Rodgers gets a pass on making stupid decisions because his calf hurts? Unreal. Neither of those interceptions were because of a hurt leg, they were bad choices, his brain wasn't injured.

What the hell am I supposed to concede? You're the one with the brain-dead opinion that his game was AMAZING. 

The game wasn't entirely on Rodgers, but when you kill 5 drives, you get to shoulder some of the blame. Certainly more than the DC whose defense held the opposition to 14 points in regulation and took the ball away 5 times.

[Norm]

44 minutes ago, JaireAlex said:

but that game was not on Rodgers.

I'm not trying to speak for Alex but didn't this all start that 'he didn't play well then either, it's not just a Mike and Bostick blunder' type thing. Then you keep saying you can't put that on him, okay. He was hurt. But he didn't play well either. He was PART of why we lost. I don't think he's saying THE reason we lost. You're kinda complaining that he can't be wrong but I feel like you're skewing what he's saying anyways.

[JaireAlex]

4 minutes ago, Norm said:

I'm not trying to speak for Alex but didn't this all start that 'he didn't play well then either, it's not just a Mike and Bostick blunder' type thing. Then you keep saying you can't put that on him, okay. He was hurt. But he didn't play well either. He was PART of why we lost. I don't think he's saying THE reason we lost. You're kinda complaining that he can't be wrong but I feel like you're skewing what he's saying always.

Of all that went wrong that day, Rodgers' mistakes are pretty low. He barely finished the last game and couldn't move around. What kind of slack do you cut him???? Did you ever see any GOAT play through that in playoffs? Even Favre? Seriously, this is ridiculous.

Read the bolded parts above. Whenever we played Seattle, guys were rarely open. Rodgers absolutely was gimpy if you remember the previous game. I didn't think he would play or at least would be really bad. But NO, he MUST BE GOAT through all injuries. No cutting him slack.

But a larger point was that it was clear that our receivers had difficulty getting open in playoffs beginning in 2009 (see last play). They didn't start addressing that until last year really. In 2014 Cobb had already lost a step. Rodgers has the some of the smallest windows in the NFL. And they didn't address speed til the 2018 (Gute) draft outside 7th rounders.

No one disputes Rodgers has the best tools of anyone to play the game. I know he has serious, maybe unfixable problems. 

Also, I am not one who thinks any QB can win a Superbowl on his own. Gimpy Rodgers had the team up 16. And the defense was lights out playing a shut out, most the game.

Special teams coach alone opened the door for Seattle to win. Was he gimpy too? That bone headed playcall was all she wrote. Seattle couldn't get it going til the 57th minute. It was a series of unforced errors later beginning with Burnett's forgivable but mistaken slide, followed by run out the clock mode and Bostick, the game wrecker, etc....

Rodgers actually took it to overtime but you blame him for not putting Seattle away. It was not a GOAT game. It was a great game by any gimpy QB on the road against great D with the most dreadful special teams coach in the league. Boneheaded stubborn MM lost that game before the coin was flipped. No accountability for special teams coaches or players at all led to losing a ring. He had a stacked roster....never again. Attrition and no accountability since.

Anyways, even GOATS can be off but come out victorious. And they can't carry you. Favre got  us to the playoffs many years we had no business being there and he couldn't  carry the team on his back once  in. ARs deficiencies in playoffs are much preferable to Favre's imo. Lucky to have them. They are not gods and shouldn't be treated as such. I neither blame not praise them too high except for what THEY CAN CONTROL. 

Likewise, MM who failed in Seattle BIG TIME. 

AR has the highest post season rating all time. It's an absurd discussion. Not every game is on the QB, a recipe for disaster, which we've endured since 2015.

[skibrett15]

5 hours ago, AlexGreen#20 said:

Good to see that your inability to recognize nuance extends beyond the player coach discussion. There's obviously a significant difference between posting something on a message board and publishing it.

While it's easy to cry fake news, it's just as easy to fabricate material in a world of "unnamed sources familiar with the team". They're two sides of the same coin 

 Many stories are opinions of Jennings, Finley, and other disgruntled former packers.

Packers who didn't jive well with Rodgers and didn't get along with the team overall.  Everyone needs an explanation to rationalize their decisions and actions after the fact.

[Norm]

4 minutes ago, skibrett15 said:

 Many stories are opinions of Jennings, Finley, and other disgruntled former packers.

Packers who didn't jive well with Rodgers and didn't get along with the team overall.  Everyone needs an explanation to rationalize their decisions and actions after the fact.

Finley is disgruntled? Or is everyone who says bad things automatically disgruntled? Like is Marcades Lewis disgruntled?

[skibrett15]

4 hours ago, AlexGreen#20 said:

Wait, was the offense too conservative or too aggressive? I'm hearing both?

Can anyone actually point me to the bad decisions in the Seahawks game from an offensive playcalling perspective in the second half. The first few drives were rough in not going for it on fourth down from the 1. 

Alternatively though, the offensive line was getting no push against a stout Seattle DL and was stuffed repeatedly in the earlier downs. I suppose we have our own dumb fault for stacking the line though. 

The game was coached well enough to win, special teams screwed the pooch.

Also, the game was not coached all that well from a decision making process, specifically in the first half on those calls and the decision not to go for it.  Both things are true.

To lay the sole blame there on MM is disingenuous at best by the author.  But it is possible that this was the fracturing/dividing point between MM/AR.

[skibrett15]

1 minute ago, Norm said:

Finley is disgruntled? Or is everyone who says bad things automatically disgruntled? Like is Marcades Lewis disgruntled?

of course he's disgruntled.  He's frustrated he got hurt and couldn't continue his career.  He's frustrated he never got the fame and attention that he craved under Rodgers.

At best, Finley is an unreliable source since that's what he was his entire career - a dumb guy who fumbles to express his opinions.  He also often is wildly uninformed on topics which he speaks on.

Marcedes lewis is not disgruntled.  You're referring to that interview?  Doesn't seem disgruntled to me.  That seemed aware and valid.

[PossibleCabbage]

I think Marcedes Lewis is gruntled

[skibrett15]

6 minutes ago, Norm said:

Finley is disgruntled? Or is everyone who says bad things automatically disgruntled? Like is Marcades Lewis disgruntled?

I do think there was a "rodgers" crew and a "non-rodgers" crew for some time over the past 3-5 years.  That part is definitely true.

I also think these kinds of things are fairly commonplace in most locker rooms.  There's a "Cousins" crew and a "non-cousins" crew.  There's an Andrew Luck crew and a non-luck crew.  The only issue is the frustration bubbles this to the surface when you aren't winning.