Mox Posted November 12, 2019 Share Posted November 12, 2019 Just now, MookieMonstah said: It’s clear you don’t watch many Celtics games when you call Tatum a poor ball handler. What statement turns out correct? If you’re still stuck on this top 10 player thing my head might explode. I’m. Not. Saying. Tatum. Will. Be. A. Top. 10. Player. I never said he was a poor ball handler. Then why do you keep quoting me? My statement is he will not be a top 10 player. His ceiling isn't that high. What is your issue with that if you don't disagree with it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DoleINGout Posted November 12, 2019 Share Posted November 12, 2019 1 minute ago, Bullet Club said: Dude, the only objective statements provided in this conversation have been by me. Just saying "he's not a poor passer" doesn't mean anything. I can statistically prove he's a poor passer and terrible isolation player. What can you do? Give me your opinion? Well, if you say so it isn't unbiased, right? Your opinion is the most objective measurement of objective measurements. Especially when measuring the objectiveness of your own opinion based statements. Thanks for making me laugh today. 38 minutes ago, Bullet Club said: Tatum isn't impactful enough offensively to be a top 10 guy imo. He's a weak playmaker and he can't create for himself nearly well enough to be rated that highly. His ceiling is Paul George with less athleticism, creation and playmaking. Luka's ceiling is Larry Bird. Because "imo" and then making a comparison of Luka Doncic to Larry Bird and then Tatum to a less-than Paul George is completely objective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWood21 Posted November 12, 2019 Share Posted November 12, 2019 And we've come back full circle with the Tatum discussion... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mox Posted November 12, 2019 Share Posted November 12, 2019 Just now, DoleINGout said: Well, if you say so it isn't unbiased, right? Your opinion is the most objective measurement of objective measurements. Especially when measuring the objectiveness of your own opinion based statements. Thanks for making me laugh today. Because "imo" and then making a comparison of Luka Doncic to Larry Bird and then Tatum to a less-than Paul George is completely objective. I didn't say every statement I made was objective. Jayson Tatum is objectively a poor passer. He averages less than 2.5 apg despite averaging 34 mpg and a usage of 26%. He is objectively a poor isolation player. He ranks in the bottom 24.2% in the NBA. Those are facts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MookieMonstah Posted November 12, 2019 Share Posted November 12, 2019 9 minutes ago, Bullet Club said: I never said he was a poor ball handler. Then why do you keep quoting me? My statement is he will not be a top 10 player. His ceiling isn't that high. What is your issue with that if you don't disagree with it? You’ve essentially said he’s capped out because of his ability to do two things that almost every young player struggles to develop. That’s all I’m saying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MookieMonstah Posted November 12, 2019 Share Posted November 12, 2019 6 minutes ago, CWood21 said: And we've come back full circle with the Tatum discussion... To be fair at this point it’s Celtics fans just defending him. Celtics fans were too high on him last off-season but now it’s the opposite and people are far to low on him. Next year we’ll find some nice middle ground. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWood21 Posted November 12, 2019 Share Posted November 12, 2019 1 hour ago, MookieMonstah said: Its hilarious how silent you are when Tatum is playing well and how loud you get when he has a bad game. It must be a sad life rooting for someone else to fail. I mean, let's not pretend like this wasn't brought upon yourself. We heard ALL offseason how great Tatum was and how he's going to make a massive jump in his 3rd season. Here we are 9 games into his season, and he's shooting 39% from the field. Ironically, Lonzo Ball is shooting 41.5% from the field. Either way, we have a ridiculously small sample size to look at, and hopefully those shooting percentages are going to come up because you're not even close to being a top 20 player if you're shooting at such a poor percentage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DoleINGout Posted November 12, 2019 Share Posted November 12, 2019 5 minutes ago, Bullet Club said: Jayson Tatum is objectively a poor passer. He averages less than 2.5 apg despite averaging 34 mpg and a usage of 26%. I guess Khalil Mack is an objectively average pass rusher because he only has 5.5 sacks this season despite playing almost every snap. Jalen Ramsey is an objectively poor play maker in coverage because he only has one pass deflection and no interceptions despite always being on the field. I guess statistics are also absolute truths now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mox Posted November 12, 2019 Share Posted November 12, 2019 Just now, MookieMonstah said: You’ve essentially said he’s capped out because of his ability to do two things that almost every young player struggles to develop. That’s all I’m saying. Our opinion on it differs because I don't think those traits develop as easily as you do. In my opinion you have it or you don't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWood21 Posted November 12, 2019 Share Posted November 12, 2019 1 minute ago, MookieMonstah said: To be fair at this point it’s Celtics fans just defending him. Celtics fans were too high on him last off-season but now it’s the opposite and people are far to low on him. Next year we’ll find some nice middle ground. We are in the same middle ground we've been at. The only difference is that that jump that Celtics' fans promised was coming hasn't came yet. Given the relatively small sample size we have to deal with, there's plenty of time for him to turn it around but when people like DolelNGout are moving goalposts to fit an argument it isn't a good look. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mox Posted November 12, 2019 Share Posted November 12, 2019 Just now, DoleINGout said: I guess Khalil Mack is an objectively average pass rusher because he only has 5.5 sacks this season despite playing almost every snap. Jalen Ramsey is an objectively poor play maker in coverage because he only has one pass deflection and no interceptions despite always being on the field. I guess statistics are also absolute truths now. How many hurries does Mack have? Have many QB hits? What's the completion % against Ramsey? What's the opponents passer rating? Those are stats too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DoleINGout Posted November 12, 2019 Share Posted November 12, 2019 What are you talking about? Moving goal posts? I brought up this whole thing to begin with to point out how laughably bad the take was of Tatum>Luka. Also, kudos to you for subtly CWood21. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DoleINGout Posted November 12, 2019 Share Posted November 12, 2019 4 minutes ago, Bullet Club said: How many hurries does Mack have? Have many QB hits? What's the completion % against Ramsey? What's the opponents passer rating? Those are stats too. Thanks, that's the point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWood21 Posted November 12, 2019 Share Posted November 12, 2019 51 minutes ago, DoleINGout said: Tatum is maturing into a highly impactful offensive player. I think he has always been a good offensive player. Tatum is heralded because of how polished he is as a young player. Consistent offensive production is where improvement is happening. I don't know why you think Tatum is a weak playmaker or struggles to create his own shots. For Tatum, it's a matter of finishing the plays he does create and choosing how to score for optimal efficiency. Tatum has displayed an aptitude to learn from his mistakes, particularly on offense, and move closer to his high potential. Case in point @DoleINGout. There's nothing in here that can be argued, ergo it's moving the goalposts. He's shooting 39% from the field so far, and you're dying on this hill. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MookieMonstah Posted November 12, 2019 Share Posted November 12, 2019 11 minutes ago, CWood21 said: I mean, let's not pretend like this wasn't brought upon yourself. We heard ALL offseason how great Tatum was and how he's going to make a massive jump in his 3rd season. Here we are 9 games into his season, and he's shooting 39% from the field. Ironically, Lonzo Ball is shooting 41.5% from the field. Either way, we have a ridiculously small sample size to look at, and hopefully those shooting percentages are going to come up because you're not even close to being a top 20 player if you're shooting at such a poor percentage. He’s shooting like 25% lower than his career average at the rim. His FG% will improve. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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