Well does Fatty Patricia get fired?

[cp0k2]

Quinn got the job because the Ford's don't have a clue and asked the NFL to pick someone for them. He got tired of waiting for Caldwell to lose so he canned him after a 9-7 season and hired his best friend instead of doing an actual coaching search for a top flight candidate. And Patricia, the newly empowered head coach hired who to run his defense? His mentor that is best known for coaching the Donovan McNabb 'Cuse teams 1,000 years ago.

Ask yourself this question honestly. If Bob Quinn, Matt Patricia, and Paul Pasqualoni were all available today, would anyone in the NFL hire them at the position they currently hold? The answer is no. Quinn would get work as a scout or an assistant in someone's front office. Patricia would most likely be out of football for a year or two until he realized the only job offers he's getting for awhile are as a position coach. Pasqualoni might latch on as a position coach at a school he has friends at, but he'd probably retire.

Stop making excuses for people that are bad at their jobs. I complained about Caldwell and was not sad to see him fired at the time because I thought he had maxed his potential as the team's coach and the roster and trajectory was meant for more. That's basically what Quinn said when he canned him. But I didn't realize this was just going to be more nepotism and cronyism. 

These guys should absolutely be gone on Black Monday, but I don't believe they will be because the ownership is just as inept as the people they hire. This franchise had an almost unparalleled level of sustained failure. Sure, the Browns have given the Lions a run for the money, but that franchise had some major instability with the team moving (and winning a Super Bowl shortly thereafter) and then becoming an expansion team, and a revolving door of ownership for a time. I can give them a pass for some patches of failure. The Lions have never had any instability like that, just consistently bad hires from the top on down. 

And that is why, if and when this current regime is washed out, I will be happy for a moment and then realize that whoever they hire next will probably be bad as well, because they always are. That is why Same Old Lions and Lionized and Lions Free are actual things. This organization doesn't deserve any free passes, or excuses from their fans, they make enough of them on their own.

[MortexLion]

I had a bad feeling about this season after this **** hole of a GM picked a TE in the first round! Hock better be a HOF next your or BUST!

[Lionized]

Well team tank is having a good day so far. 

[Nastradamus]

Just hear to say Matt and Bob have every ounce of my support still. 

[Karnage84]

36 minutes ago, Nastradamus said:

Just hear to say Matt and Bob have every ounce of my support still. 

"According to Adam Schefter, Nastradamus has been 'randomly' selected for drug testing under the CBA. More to come."

[Nnivolcm]

5 hours ago, Karnage84 said:

"According to Adam Schefter, Nastradamus has been 'randomly' selected for drug testing under the CBA. More to come."

I just figured he was a Packers fan.

[Karnage84]

2 minutes ago, Nnivolcm said:

I just figured he was a Packers fan.

That would explain the drug testing...

[detroitroar]

I'd fire Patricia just to bring in Rivera.

[SteelKing728]

Maybe we can help you guys. Take the L.

And besides, you don't want to ruin that draft pick!

[Karnage84]

6 hours ago, SteelKing728 said:

Maybe we can help you guys. Take the L.

And besides, you don't want to ruin that draft pick!

The Lions are going to screw this thing up by playing good defense, running the ball and winning the game. It would just be such a Lions thing to do. 

[SimbaWho]

AH! There you are Karnage, now you are seeing a glimpse of the light that is the Lions organization. They'll almost surely play solid football now to draft 12 and pick a WR. 

Idk though, They're in prime position to get DE Chase Young possibly or LT Andrew Thomas who I think personally is the 2nd coming of Jason Peters. I like Chase Young, I do, but I love my O-line and think it's got a ripple effect through the team more than just a pass rush. A good line supports the run and pass games while keeping the defense off the field and fresh. We've got a QB who can do things, They're collecting some RB with Scarbough/Johnson, prolly should draft or sign another guy though. The TE's are set for better or worst, WR isn't an issue. Top 5 Oline in run/pass protection makes this team a playoff contender easily, improvements to the defense could make them a division winner.

Now, this won't happen with the rag tag fellas we've got running things. I think Bevell has done a good job but the HC hasn't been good, defense has been bad, and special teams has been bad. I hope the Fords are just riding out the season and wanna look at who's available at the end of the year but... IDK, Fords love money, and firing these guys will cost an additional 15 million or more upfront to fire Quinn/Patricia this season so, IDK if it'll happen unless they get embarrassed and people stop showing for games. 

 

 

[Karnage84]

38 minutes ago, SimbaWho said:

AH! There you are Karnage, now you are seeing a glimpse of the light that is the Lions organization. They'll almost surely play solid football now to draft 12 and pick a WR. 

Idk though, They're in prime position to get DE Chase Young possibly or LT Andrew Thomas who I think personally is the 2nd coming of Jason Peters. I like Chase Young, I do, but I love my O-line and think it's got a ripple effect through the team more than just a pass rush. A good line supports the run and pass games while keeping the defense off the field and fresh. We've got a QB who can do things, They're collecting some RB with Scarbough/Johnson, prolly should draft or sign another guy though. The TE's are set for better or worst, WR isn't an issue. Top 5 Oline in run/pass protection makes this team a playoff contender easily, improvements to the defense could make them a division winner.

Now, this won't happen with the rag tag fellas we've got running things. I think Bevell has done a good job but the HC hasn't been good, defense has been bad, and special teams has been bad. I hope the Fords are just riding out the season and wanna look at who's available at the end of the year but... IDK, Fords love money, and firing these guys will cost an additional 15 million or more upfront to fire Quinn/Patricia this season so, IDK if it'll happen unless they get embarrassed and people stop showing for games. 

 

 

I think for anyone wishing that Patricia/Quinn fail out is just a naysayer for naysayers sake. I don't expect this team to overcome all of the injuries and other items that have factored into where they're sitting now. My expectation is that we're going to lose out. I'm expecting and hoping that we get games like the Bears game, where we're competitive but are just missing the difference makers to put things over the hump. If things go the way we are expecting, we are likely seeing the Bengals and Giants at 1 and 2. There's a chance we could be sitting there at #3 or #4. The Bengals are likely going to need a QB for their new regime and Burrow is a prime target. If Tua is showing to be recovered from his injury, it wouldn't shock me to see the Dolphins make a move to trade up for him. This would lead us into a prime spot to take Chase Young. We'd have generational talent as an instant difference maker at a prime position which also happens to be a position of need. 

I want Patricia and Quinn to succeed. I don't want this team to go through yet another rebuild. I want to see a competitive Lions team with Matthew Stafford at the helm playing in games that truly matter in December and beyond. It might happen and it might not. Losing out this year isn't going to make much of a difference on next year except for putting us in a better draft position. If that's what is going to be the difference maker to right this ship, I'm good with it. 

It's not so much that I like Patricia or Quinn... I think there has been some highs that give me hope and a lot of lows that leave me with more questions than answers. I just don't think that it's good for an organization to have that much turnover in such a short period of time. With the team that they've assembled, it's very specific to the things that they want to do. So we'd be looking at another 2-3 years of retooling a roster for the next coach, getting pennies on the dollar for FA's and draftees who don't fit the new scheme (see KVN). 

Bevell has been the best OC Stafford has had in a long time. This offense has been humming. They've had the big play element without a lot of the mistakes that come with a downfield attacking scheme. 

[Nnivolcm]

Quote

I think for anyone wishing that Patricia/Quinn fail out is just a naysayer for naysayers sake. I don't expect this team to overcome all of the injuries and other items that have factored into where they're sitting now.

One of the first things BQ said when he was hired was he wanted to improve the depth of this team. Teams with good depth overcome injuries constantly. Every team in the NFL deals with injuries every year. More so than us fans know because players are constantly playing hurt. BQ has failed in developing the depth of this team, which was one of his stated goals from the start.

When you say "other items" I can't help but think you're referring to:

1. poor coaching

2. poor resource allocation while building the roster

So pretty much everything MP and BQ do.

Quote

My expectation is that we're going to lose out. I'm expecting and hoping that we get games like the Bears game, where we're competitive but are just missing the difference makers to put things over the hump.

Keeping the culture of losing strong I see. These guys know how to lose, they can pull a defeat from the jaws of victory unlike anyone I've ever seen. They even appear to have the talent to win right now, they just don't know how to do so. We need a regime who can show these guys how to win a close game.

 

Quote

If things go the way we are expecting, we are likely seeing the Bengals and Giants at 1 and 2. There's a chance we could be sitting there at #3 or #4. The Bengals are likely going to need a QB for their new regime and Burrow is a prime target. If Tua is showing to be recovered from his injury, it wouldn't shock me to see the Dolphins make a move to trade up for him. This would lead us into a prime spot to take Chase Young. We'd have generational talent as an instant difference maker at a prime position which also happens to be a position of need. 

Remember when pass rush was a significant need way back in the 2019 off season? When the highly rated pass rusher was still available and this regime selected a TE instead? Those who don't remember (and learn from) their history are doomed to repeat it...

Quote

I want Patricia and Quinn to succeed. I don't want this team to go through yet another rebuild. I want to see a competitive Lions team with Matthew Stafford at the helm playing in games that truly matter in December and beyond. It might happen and it might not. Losing out this year isn't going to make much of a difference on next year except for putting us in a better draft position. If that's what is going to be the difference maker to right this ship, I'm good with it. 

I want the Lions to succeed. I don't give a damn who is at the helm when they do so. Based on all the evidence the pairing of BQ and MP are not the guys to succeed here. I'd love to be wrong, but I doubt it. 

[Karnage84]

20 minutes ago, Nnivolcm said:

One of the first things BQ said when he was hired was he wanted to improve the depth of this team. Teams with good depth overcome injuries constantly. Every team in the NFL deals with injuries every year. More so than us fans know because players are constantly playing hurt. BQ has failed in developing the depth of this team, which was one of his stated goals from the start.

When you say "other items" I can't help but think you're referring to:

1. poor coaching

2. poor resource allocation while building the roster

So pretty much everything MP and BQ do.

Keeping the culture of losing strong I see. These guys know how to lose, they can pull a defeat from the jaws of victory unlike anyone I've ever seen. They even appear to have the talent to win right now, they just don't know how to do so. We need a regime who can show these guys how to win a close game.

 

Remember when pass rush was a significant need way back in the 2019 off season? When the highly rated pass rusher was still available and this regime selected a TE instead? Those who don't remember (and learn from) their history are doomed to repeat it...

I want the Lions to succeed. I don't give a damn who is at the helm when they do so. Based on all the evidence the pairing of BQ and MP are not the guys to succeed here. I'd love to be wrong, but I doubt it. 

This is a team that was knocking on the door early on. There were a few questionable calls with significant impact by the refs in some games and we were straight up robbed of a W over Green Bay. I don't know if we're having the same conversation about the team as a whole if things are a bit different. We still could be but it's something to chew on. I'm of the belief that Pasqualoni has been more of a negative on the D than Patricia. There is probably some loyalty or expectation that they can turn things around. It's possible that the game is getting past him at his age. I'm expecting PP is going to either be outright fired or moved into a different position with a new DC being hired + Patricia taking over more of the defensive play-calling duties. 

I'd be interested in seeing how the Lions compare to the rest of the league in terms of games missed due to injuries from starters. While I agree on the matters related to BQ's commitment to depth, it feels like this team has lost A LOT of starters for a significant period of time, principally on the defense. Then you lose your QB on top of that and it's an uphill battle for any team. 

I don't think there's a single one of us here who agreed with taking Hockenson at #8. Just like the Lions, you could find a way to justify it after the fact. I still don't think anyone was hoping for that pick to be made. However, they were a top 10 defense and top 5 against the run by seasons end. They were going into 2019 with Snacks as of week 1, draft gem Hand, run stuffer A'Shawn and a better than expected Okwara. Then they go and sign Flowers with high expectations. Clearly the expectation was that they had enough guys on the DL to do what they needed to do.

There's 3 TJ Hockensons - the draft prospect, the NFL player and the #8 draft pick. Teams loved the draft prospect and he was expected to go high. The NFL player has showed some flashes and could wind up being a very good player when all is said and done. The #8 overall pick may never live up to that billing... it's an uphill battle and then some. The team felt that they had the talent and depth at DL. They went a different route. Are we complaining as much about not taking a guy like Ed Oliver if our own DL lives up to the pre-season expectations? Even if Hockenson's play/injury stay the same? It's still a TE at 8, so probably yes. 

[Nnivolcm]

23 minutes ago, Karnage84 said:

This is a team that was knocking on the door early on. There were a few questionable calls with significant impact by the refs in some games and we were straight up robbed of a W over Green Bay. I don't know if we're having the same conversation about the team as a whole if things are a bit different. We still could be but it's something to chew on. I'm of the belief that Pasqualoni has been more of a negative on the D than Patricia. There is probably some loyalty or expectation that they can turn things around. It's possible that the game is getting past him at his age. I'm expecting PP is going to either be outright fired or moved into a different position with a new DC being hired + Patricia taking over more of the defensive play-calling duties. 

I'd be interested in seeing how the Lions compare to the rest of the league in terms of games missed due to injuries from starters. While I agree on the matters related to BQ's commitment to depth, it feels like this team has lost A LOT of starters for a significant period of time, principally on the defense. Then you lose your QB on top of that and it's an uphill battle for any team. 

I don't think there's a single one of us here who agreed with taking Hockenson at #8. Just like the Lions, you could find a way to justify it after the fact. I still don't think anyone was hoping for that pick to be made. However, they were a top 10 defense and top 5 against the run by seasons end. They were going into 2019 with Snacks as of week 1, draft gem Hand, run stuffer A'Shawn and a better than expected Okwara. Then they go and sign Flowers with high expectations. Clearly the expectation was that they had enough guys on the DL to do what they needed to do.

There's 3 TJ Hockensons - the draft prospect, the NFL player and the #8 draft pick. Teams loved the draft prospect and he was expected to go high. The NFL player has showed some flashes and could wind up being a very good player when all is said and done. The #8 overall pick may never live up to that billing... it's an uphill battle and then some. The team felt that they had the talent and depth at DL. They went a different route. Are we complaining as much about not taking a guy like Ed Oliver if our own DL lives up to the pre-season expectations? Even if Hockenson's play/injury stay the same? It's still a TE at 8, so probably yes. 

What do you mean by "knocking on the door early on"? Do you mean they played teams everyone thought would be better than they are? If that's the case I agree. The wins over Philly and LAC looked impressive at the time, but now aren't so great. They kept it close with KC (even had a 99.9% win probability in the 4th quarter) but once again found a way to pull defeat from the jaws of victory. 

Who hired Pasqualoni? Who's a defensive guru who's defense keeps making guys like Trubisky look like all pros? It's staggering how many times an opponent scores on the final possession of the half/game this season. 

Good teams with good coaching overcome injury issues. 

Expectations are meaningless. Results matter. The results of the the efforts by BQ and MP are not good enough by BQ's own standards used to fire Caldwell.