Rhetorical: If Packers were offered a first round pick for Jordan Love, should they take it?

[Spartacus]

1 minute ago, Blue said:

Where in the world is this cult of Tim Boyle coming from? Tim Boyle was a second-year UDFA out of Eastern Kentucky. I do not believe for a second that Tim Boyle was doing anything magical at the line of scrimmage coming in cold off the bench in Week 17 that drastically overshadows what Jordan Love brings to the table athletically. We are not talking about some sort of ten-year vet here. We are talking about a guy who would be lucky to be QB3 for a vast majority of NFL teams and the Packers did not care enough to tender at the original round level.

Boyle was receiving rave reviews all offseason last year as well as having a great preseason the year before. TBH no one knows what Boyle would be like starting but he came in ahead of the curve and was praised the last two off-seasons. Its obvious you know very little about Packers outside of the ESPN headlines. I honestly wouldn't be surprised if Boyle starts for the Lions sometime this year. 

[vegas492]

11 minutes ago, Blue said:

Most rookies are put into simple offenses that they can run. Why would you put your rookie QB into an offense he can't run? Lamar Jackson took over for Joe Flacco, who could not be any more different a quarterback stylistically, and took the Ravens to the playoffs. They adjusted that offense in midseason for their backup QB's skillset. That didn't mean they put Lamar Jackson as the third-string QB up to that point.

I think it's ridiculous to act as though Jordan Love, whom the Packers traded a pick to go get, should be treated differently than other first-round QBs. But fine, I won't argue the point.

Where in the world is this cult of Tim Boyle coming from? Tim Boyle was a second-year UDFA out of Eastern Kentucky. I do not believe for a second that Tim Boyle was doing anything magical at the line of scrimmage coming in cold off the bench in Week 17 that drastically overshadows what Jordan Love brings to the table athletically. We are not talking about some sort of ten-year vet here. We are talking about a guy who would be lucky to be QB3 for a vast majority of NFL teams and the Packers did not care enough to tender at the original round level.

Flacco was cooked and the Ravens NEEDED to do that to be competitive.

Rodgers right now, if far from cooked.  At draft time of Love, many of us would have agreed that he had regressed for at least 2 seasons and maybe more.  We also would have agreed that it was by his own doing and that he still had the arm and legs to become elite again.  Which he did.

He was not anywhere like Flacco.

You didn't see Boyle in camp, or in past pre-season games.  He had a nice arm with good mobility.  And since he was in the system for every year that the new coach was there, and since it is a veteran roster full of guys he knew well on and off the field, well, he was going to be tough to beat out.  Then you add in COVID, no pre-season games and it was pretty easy to forecast.  

GB didn't try to keep him because there will be a true off-season this year.  There will be pre-season games and they will get Love up to speed and ahead of where Boyle was last year.  But, it wasn't happening last year.

[Soko]

1 hour ago, vegas492 said:

Then you add in COVID, no pre-season games and it was pretty easy to forecast.  

Probably an important point to make here. On the surface, your first rounder not even being the first backup is probably not a great sign, but given what went on last (off)season - when did you expect him to climb the depth chart? 

If Rodgers went down prior to the start of the season, I’m confident Love would’ve seen playing time at some point. But GB had SB aspirations, so have the guy that’s familiar with the team that could come in and do some spot duty in the event Rodgers misses a game or two. 

I didn’t love the Love pick (or the prospect) but we’ve seen really nothing from him to cast aspersions on him right now. Only the Packers know where he’s at.

[CWood21]

16 hours ago, Uncle Buck said:

It sounds like Love hasn't really been bowling them over in Green Bay.  He couldn't even take over the #2 QB spot last year, after being a first round pick that they traded up for.  If someone offered them their first round pick for him, the Packers would probably be very wise to take the deal.  They could always reinvest that pick in another prospect who has a better chance of succeeding and then restart the clock on his rookie deal at year 1.

Talk about throwing crap at the wall and hoping it sticks.  Not sure there's anything in there that's factually true.

[vegas492]

1 minute ago, Yin-Yang said:

Probably an important point to make here. On the surface, your first rounder not even being the first backup is probably not a great sign, but given what went on last (off)season - when did you expect him to climb the depth chart? 

If Rodgers went down prior to the start of the season, I’m confident Love would’ve seen playing time at some point. But GB had SB aspirations, so have the guy that’s familiar with the team that could come in and do some spot duty in the event Rodgers misses a game or two. 

I didn’t love the Love pick (or the prospect) but we’ve seen really nothing from him to cast aspersions on him right now. Only the Packers know where he’s at.

I did not expect him to "climb the depth chart" until now.  This off-season.  There's absolutely no rush to get him onto the field.

Had Rodgers gone down prior to the start of the season, our season would have been cooked anyway, regardless of who was under center.  Boyle would have started at first, but yah, I believe Love would have found some playing time by the end of the year.  I do not think he would have been thrust onto the field quickly.

Not only did I not "love" the pick.  I hated it.  Initially.  But, it made rational sense given where he went, who was available and the career trajectory for Rodgers over the past few years.  Add to it the elation at our coach and GM showed when drafting him and yah, he was the guy that they wanted.

Fast forward 6 months and Rodgers is playing at an MVP level.  Much better than his prior two years and the pick looks more foolish.  Now, maybe Love's selection motivated Rodgers to improve?  I don't know.  But may be that happened.  And if Love was the reason for the better Rodgers, then the pick was worth it.  And if Love actually hits in a few years, GB will be riding the QB gravy train once again.

As said before, we GB fans have lived this movie before.  Kindda used to it.  Feeling the same kinds of emotions.  Hopefully the ending is the same, too.  But I doubt it.  Having three HOF QB's in a row is an almost unimaginable situation.  

[Uncle Buck]

2 minutes ago, CWood21 said:

Talk about throwing crap at the wall and hoping it sticks.  Not sure there's anything in there that's factually true.

[Soko]

3 minutes ago, vegas492 said:

I did not expect him to "climb the depth chart" until now.  This off-season.  There's absolutely no rush to get him onto the field.

It wasn’t a question directed at you, it was for those condemning the guy because he was third string this past season.

 

[CWood21]

Just now, Uncle Buck said:

It really isn't.  Tim Boyle had been in GB's system for a year prior and given the offseason limitations with COVID, it was always highly unlikely that Jordan Love would unseat Tim Boyle as QB2 for the 2020 season.  Even Rodgers admitted that the transfer from McCarthy's offense to LaFleur's was a growing experience.  Imagine that as a rookie QB with no offseason to speak of, there's a natural learning curve as a rookie that you're going to see.  But let's get into that hypothetical, assuming Aaron Rodgers was forced out of a game, who was more likely to not lose the game: Jordan Love or Tim Boyle?  Boyle is probably more prepared to not lose the game, although he's unlikely to win games for Green Bay.  So if Rodgers was expected to be outside for an extended period, you probably would have seen Love play.

[vegas492]

2 minutes ago, Yin-Yang said:

It wasn’t a question directed at you, it was for those condemning the guy because he was third string this past season.

 

Got it.

Yah, guys are comparing Love to the average rookie QB drafted in the first round.  Usually those kids are needed to play right away, or relatively soon.  Love was drafted to be groomed for the future, not for the now.  Big difference in philosophy.

And I get why there is concern and second guessing of that philosophy.

[Uncle Buck]

3 minutes ago, CWood21 said:

It really isn't.  Tim Boyle had been in GB's system for a year prior and given the offseason limitations with COVID, it was always highly unlikely that Jordan Love would unseat Tim Boyle as QB2 for the 2020 season.  Even Rodgers admitted that the transfer from McCarthy's offense to LaFleur's was a growing experience.  Imagine that as a rookie QB with no offseason to speak of, there's a natural learning curve as a rookie that you're going to see.  But let's get into that hypothetical, assuming Aaron Rodgers was forced out of a game, who was more likely to not lose the game: Jordan Love or Tim Boyle?  Boyle is probably more prepared to not lose the game, although he's unlikely to win games for Green Bay.  So if Rodgers was expected to be outside for an extended period, you probably would have seen Love play.

CWood, I'm really not attacking your QB here.  I really don't care how he does.  I have tried to be objective.  Maybe check out my post on page 3 of this thread.  You don't have to prove anything to me.

[Blue]

2 hours ago, Spartacus said:

Boyle was receiving rave reviews all offseason last year as well as having a great preseason the year before. TBH no one knows what Boyle would be like starting but he came in ahead of the curve and was praised the last two off-seasons. Its obvious you know very little about Packers outside of the ESPN headlines. I honestly wouldn't be surprised if Boyle starts for the Lions sometime this year. 

lol

Scott Tolzien, Brett Hundley, that one dude from Texas Tech all got praised for their training camps, too. Case in point. I know plenty about the team, I'm just not a raging homer.

[Blue]

21 minutes ago, vegas492 said:

Got it.

Yah, guys are comparing Love to the average rookie QB drafted in the first round.  Usually those kids are needed to play right away, or relatively soon.  Love was drafted to be groomed for the future, not for the now.  Big difference in philosophy.

And I get why there is concern and second guessing of that philosophy.

Guys who are "drafted to be groomed from the future" aren't drafted in the first round because they don't deserve to be. If he's not even ready to be a backup by the end of his rookie season, that is a massive indictment of his ability.

[Uncle Buck]

1 minute ago, Blue said:

Guys who are "drafted to be groomed from the future" aren't drafted in the first round because they don't deserve to be. If he's not even ready to be a backup by the end of his rookie season, that is a massive indictment of his ability.

I would normally agree wholeheartedly with that sentiment.  The one thing you could use in his defense is that it was a strange season because of Covid.  He didn't get a normal amount of practice last year. 

 

[Blue]

5 minutes ago, Uncle Buck said:

I would normally agree wholeheartedly with that sentiment.  The one thing you could use in his defense is that it was a strange season because of Covid.  He didn't get a normal amount of practice last year. 

 

Neither did any of the other three first-round picks. And Tua was even dealing with not having thrown since, what, November? due to a serious injury.

Look, I don't know if Love is going to pan out as a franchise quarterback. He better, if only because of what the Packers did to get him with Aaron Rodgers still on the roster and under contract for years to come. But this is about what his value is around the league, and it seems abundantly, painfully clear that he has virtually no value to anyone but the Packers. If anybody wanted Love or thought he was good, I imagine the Patriots or Broncos or Football Team or even the Cowboys would have come sniffing around at the trade deadline to see if they could get him for a first, and there wasn't an ounce of reported interest in him. I am firmly convinced nobody in the NFL valued Jordan Love as highly as the Packers did then, and they certainly haven't had any reason to reevaluate that in the year since he was drafted.

[Uncle Buck]

10 minutes ago, Blue said:

Neither did any of the other three first-round picks. And Tua was even dealing with not having thrown since, what, November? due to a serious injury.

Look, I don't know if Love is going to pan out as a franchise quarterback. He better, if only because of what the Packers did to get him with Aaron Rodgers still on the roster and under contract for years to come. But this is about what his value is around the league, and it seems abundantly, painfully clear that he has virtually no value to anyone but the Packers. If anybody wanted Love or thought he was good, I imagine the Patriots or Broncos or Football Team or even the Cowboys would have come sniffing around at the trade deadline to see if they could get him for a first, and there wasn't an ounce of reported interest in him. I am firmly convinced nobody in the NFL valued Jordan Love as highly as the Packers did then, and they certainly haven't had any reason to reevaluate that in the year since he was drafted.

You make some very good points.