topwop1 Posted April 21, 2021 Share Posted April 21, 2021 (edited) The only way I'd be sold on a massive trade up for a QB in this draft is if it's for Lawrence, Wilson or Fields. If Pace trades away a haul for either Lance or Jones then I think that'd be a reach. That doesn't mean I don't like either of those guys as prospects, but IMO if you're going to make a splash then go get one of the more talented and high upside QBs with a good track record...i.e. Fields We've already been over this many a times but Lance just doesn't have long enough of a resume for me to gamble on his upside in the top-10. And Mac is more limited physically than the other guys I think I'd rather Trask in the 2nd instead of trading up into the top-10 for Trey Lance or Mac Jones Edited April 21, 2021 by topwop1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soulman Posted April 21, 2021 Share Posted April 21, 2021 1 hour ago, RunningVaccs said: If I were them I would be thinking of taking the QB with the highest upside there, and then wrap him in shrink wrap this year, then you have the luxury to actually develop the guy that needs it and then decide on cutting/trading Ryan next year when the dead cap is more amenable. I think Lance there would be a perfect fit, but to answer the prompt; if you're Atlanta you trade out because some lunatic from Chicago offers you 4 first round picks. Based on your analysis I agree which is also why any willingness on Atlanta's part to trade may end up being smoke and mirrors come draft day. They trade only if the haul is so great they can't say no. Many teams have ended up in a mess trading up when demand has made it so pricey they end up with their QB but the rest of the team is in a shambles. I believe we'd be dumb to go there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topwop1 Posted April 21, 2021 Share Posted April 21, 2021 1 minute ago, soulman said: Based on your analysis I agree which is also why any willingness on Atlanta's part to trade may end up being smoke and mirrors come draft day. They trade only if the haul is so great they can't say no. Many teams have ended up in a mess trading up when demand has made it so pricey they end up with their QB but the rest of the team is in a shambles. I believe we'd be dumb to go there. There's a lot of talk that Atlanta could take Pitts at 4 if they stay put and not necessarily take a QB. A QB doesn't really get them anywhere for 2021 and IMO they are still trying to salvage what's left of Matt Ryan's career. Why fix something that isn't broken? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soulman Posted April 21, 2021 Share Posted April 21, 2021 1 minute ago, topwop1 said: There's a lot of talk that Atlanta could take Pitts at 4 if they stay put and not necessarily take a QB. A QB doesn't really get them anywhere for 2021 and IMO they are still trying to salvage what's left of Matt Ryan's career. Why fix something that isn't broken? I'm far less certain a QB gets us any more than we can get with Dalton/Foles either. There are times when the effort and/or cost involved with achieving something are simply greater than the benefit. This may be one of those times. Pace can ill afford to make another mistake on a QB even if he owned the #4 overall pick. To have to spend multiple 1st round picks to get there only adds to the risk. This wouldn't be a trade for the #1 QB prospect but rather for the #4 QB prospect making it even riskier. No doubt we need a new QB but is it worth pushing a weak hand to do it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WindyCity Posted April 22, 2021 Share Posted April 22, 2021 I think Fields gets us above the Dalton line early in 2021 on God given ability alone. Lance, I think at some point in 2021 does but maybe not till 2022. Is he worth the wait? Mac I think gets us above the Dalton line in 2021, but my concern is that he does not get us well over it for his career. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topwop1 Posted April 22, 2021 Share Posted April 22, 2021 1 hour ago, soulman said: I'm far less certain a QB gets us any more than we can get with Dalton/Foles either. There are times when the effort and/or cost involved with achieving something are simply greater than the benefit. This may be one of those times. Pace can ill afford to make another mistake on a QB even if he owned the #4 overall pick. To have to spend multiple 1st round picks to get there only adds to the risk. This wouldn't be a trade for the #1 QB prospect but rather for the #4 QB prospect making it even riskier. No doubt we need a new QB but is it worth pushing a weak hand to do it? Like Windy mentioned I don't think Pace cares what he'd have to give up to draft another QB because he won't be here anyway to feel the repercussions of such a move if it fails It may not be worth it to some of us but to a desperate man like Pace .... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heinz D. Posted April 22, 2021 Share Posted April 22, 2021 2 hours ago, topwop1 said: There's a lot of talk that Atlanta could take Pitts at 4 if they stay put and not necessarily take a QB. That's absolutely what they should do. Whether it turns out that way, or not... 2 hours ago, soulman said: Pace can ill afford to make another mistake on a QB even if he owned the #4 overall pick. To have to spend multiple 1st round picks to get there only adds to the risk. This wouldn't be a trade for the #1 QB prospect but rather for the #4 QB prospect making it even riskier. The big difference here is that it could be Fields at #4, and it is HIGHLY debatable that he is actually the #4 prospect. Either way, the #4 prospect still has a good shot at being a franchise QB. Can't really say that about a 33 year old Andy Dalton. 26 minutes ago, topwop1 said: Like Windy mentioned I don't think Pace cares what he'd have to give up to draft another QB because he won't be here anyway to feel the repercussions of such a move if it fails It may not be worth it to some of us but to a desperate man like Pace .... I'm still confused as to how such a move isn't worth it. Let's face it, the big trade up probably won't happen. But how would it not be worth it, if it did? Please explain that to me, as I can't wrap my head around that position. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soulman Posted April 22, 2021 Share Posted April 22, 2021 1 hour ago, topwop1 said: Like Windy mentioned I don't think Pace cares what he'd have to give up to draft another QB because he won't be here anyway to feel the repercussions of such a move if it fails It may not be worth it to some of us but to a desperate man like Pace .... And yet I see it just the opposite. If as an owner I agree to allow my GM to spend 3 1st round picks plus to trade up for his choice of rookie QBs then I must be planning on keeping him around. If not I have to attract a new GM whose stuck with a QB he didn't draft, a HC he didn't hire, and no 1st round picks in 2022 or 2023. Not exactly an attractive spot to be in to begin your role as the new Bears GM. Should we tie one hand behind his back and make him hop on one foot too? 😄 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soulman Posted April 22, 2021 Share Posted April 22, 2021 1 hour ago, Heinz D. said: The big difference here is that it could be Fields at #4, and it is HIGHLY debatable that he is actually the #4 prospect. Either way, the #4 prospect still has a good shot at being a franchise QB. Can't really say that about a 33 year old Andy Dalton. Conventional wisdom has Fields and Lance somewhat equal as the #3 and #4 prospects. Both trailing somewhat more conventional types in Lawrence and Wilson. I read people saying ya' gotta have a running QB yet it's still the pocket passers winning championships while the former runners have slowed and fallen back due to numerous injuries. Is that what we're looking for? Another McMahon? No, Dalton is not a face of the franchise QB but he's smart enough and experienced enough to keep you in the hunt provided you give him support and protection. There is no doubt the DeShaun Watson is a franchise QB but how much good is that doing Houston right now? It's bad enough that Watson wants out. IMHO we need more than just another QB. We also need to support and tools to go with him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heinz D. Posted April 22, 2021 Share Posted April 22, 2021 19 hours ago, soulman said: No, Dalton is not a face of the franchise QB but he's smart enough and experienced enough to keep you in the hunt provided you give him support and protection. There is no doubt the DeShaun Watson is a franchise QB but how much good is that doing Houston right now? It's bad enough that Watson wants out. IMHO we need more than just another QB. We also need to support and tools to go with him. Watson is going to jail. Everybody needs to forget about him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bfan Posted April 22, 2021 Share Posted April 22, 2021 19 hours ago, soulman said: IMHO we need more than just another QB. We also need to support and tools to go with him. My hope is that this is exactly what Pace believes. (Note I say hope not believe!) The way I see it even though the league is QB driven it seems the media, some fans, and maybe some front offices have become QB obsessed. If the QBs go off the board as fast as everyone is saying then lord knows what gems will be left when the Bears draft. If we could get an OT that can develop into a John Tait type or a lock down CB in the first round and a solid player for the other position followed by a good slot receiver after that I think we will be closer to a Super Bowl then if we keep mortgaging our future moving up chasing a "franchise QB". Even if we get that treasure it will be two years before we can provide a good Oline for him to play behind and by then Mack will be in his mid-30, 10 years in the league and surrounded by a bunch of role players. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Epyon Posted April 22, 2021 Share Posted April 22, 2021 Some one is working real hard to see that Fields slides... A week before the draft, it's confirmed that Fields is epileptic, and takes medicine for his epilepsy. Also fwiw, the unreliable rumor mill is that Bears are gunning for pick #6 overall... With the expectation that 4-5 are Pitts and Sewall (the OT kid from Oregon if I butchered his name) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heinz D. Posted April 23, 2021 Share Posted April 23, 2021 1 hour ago, Epyon said: A week before the draft, it's confirmed that Fields is epileptic, and takes medicine for his epilepsy. This explains a lot. Folks are worried about him and concussions (and related effects to his epilepsy). 1 hour ago, Epyon said: Also fwiw, the unreliable rumor mill is that Bears are gunning for pick #6 overall... With the expectation that 4-5 are Pitts and Sewall (the OT kid from Oregon if I butchered his name) I haven't seen that one. Wow. Talk about crazy... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soulman Posted April 23, 2021 Share Posted April 23, 2021 (edited) 2 hours ago, Heinz D. said: Watson is going to jail. Everybody needs to forget about him. Geez Heinz. He hasn't even been charged criminally. Is your alter ego Roy Bean The Hanging Judge? 🤣 Edited April 23, 2021 by soulman 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soulman Posted April 23, 2021 Share Posted April 23, 2021 1 hour ago, Epyon said: Some one is working real hard to see that Fields slides... A week before the draft, it's confirmed that Fields is epileptic, and takes medicine for his epilepsy. Also fwiw, the unreliable rumor mill is that Bears are gunning for pick #6 overall... With the expectation that 4-5 are Pitts and Sewall (the OT kid from Oregon if I butchered his name) Could well be. Detoilet owns #7 and they're not likely to deal with us. I truly believe Pace will try very hard to move up for a QB. Whether he succeeds or not we may not know 'til draft night. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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