mse326 Posted February 3, 2018 Share Posted February 3, 2018 1 hour ago, NewAge said: The whole damn system needs to be overhauled. Other than a salary floor/cap and getting them to FA sooner what needs to be/can be changed. The reality is both the teams and players have a monopoly and monopsony and that will cause fluctuations in apparent power. Not too long ago we were all complaining because top players like Cabrera, Pujols, Fielder, Verlander, etc were commanding massive salaries in what would obviously be not just declining years but likely years that they would be the quality of bench players. This offseason it's turning a bit, and partially because the players keep basing contracts on what others got so are demanding absurd deals. If anything this whole mess is because the players had too much power in negotiations and it finally reached it's zenith and now they complain when the teams are trying to claw back a modicum of salary reality. Teams have realized a few things 1. You win by having great cheap players 2. Well timed massive contracts don't build your team, at best they take you over the top if your team is already built 3. Massive contracts in the late 30's lead to 5 years of horribleness unless you are the Yankees, Cubs, Dodgers who can absorb it. Unfortunately for the players those teams also have 3 of the smartest GMs in the game that have no desire or need to put themselves in that situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewAge Posted February 3, 2018 Share Posted February 3, 2018 2 hours ago, mse326 said: Other than a salary floor/cap and getting them to FA sooner what needs to be/can be changed. The reality is both the teams and players have a monopoly and monopsony and that will cause fluctuations in apparent power. Not too long ago we were all complaining because top players like Cabrera, Pujols, Fielder, Verlander, etc were commanding massive salaries in what would obviously be not just declining years but likely years that they would be the quality of bench players. This offseason it's turning a bit, and partially because the players keep basing contracts on what others got so are demanding absurd deals. If anything this whole mess is because the players had too much power in negotiations and it finally reached it's zenith and now they complain when the teams are trying to claw back a modicum of salary reality. Teams have realized a few things 1. You win by having great cheap players 2. Well timed massive contracts don't build your team, at best they take you over the top if your team is already built 3. Massive contracts in the late 30's lead to 5 years of horribleness unless you are the Yankees, Cubs, Dodgers who can absorb it. Unfortunately for the players those teams also have 3 of the smartest GMs in the game that have no desire or need to put themselves in that situation. I think raising the minimum salaries (something close to a million), moving arb/FA up (maybe FA up a year, all players are super two eligible), and artificially raising arb salaries by a certain percentage (and perhaps "modernizing" the formula) can go a long way. I also think expansion would help and be something both sides would be interested in. And as far as the monopoly thing goes, someone needs to challenge that anti-trust exemption. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mse326 Posted February 3, 2018 Share Posted February 3, 2018 Just now, NewAge said: I think raising the minimum salaries (something close to a million), moving arb/FA up (maybe FA up a year, all players are super two eligible), and artificially raising arb salaries by a certain percentage (and perhaps "modernizing" the formula) can go a long way. I also think expansion would help and be something both sides would be interested in. And as far as the monopoly thing goes, someone needs to challenge that anti-trust exemption. This isn't relevant to the type of monopoly I'm talking about. The CBA prevents collusion and price fixing so anything removing the exemption would do is irrelevant. At least when under CBA that is. Obviously things change if they aren't and the union decertifies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewAge Posted February 3, 2018 Share Posted February 3, 2018 Just now, mse326 said: This isn't relevant to the type of monopoly I'm talking about. The CBA prevents collusion and price fixing so anything removing the exemption would do is irrelevant. At least when under CBA that is. Obviously things change if they aren't and the union decertifies. Oh, I know. The Curt Flood Act of 1998 pretty much exempts the players anywhere. But the anti-trust exemption does matter for stuff like expansion, which ties back in here a bit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mse326 Posted February 3, 2018 Share Posted February 3, 2018 25 minutes ago, NewAge said: Oh, I know. The Curt Flood Act of 1998 pretty much exempts the players anywhere. But the anti-trust exemption does matter for stuff like expansion, which ties back in here a bit. I don't know that it has an effect on expansion either. A monopoly itself isn't a violation, only the use of anti-competitive practices. Baseball is too regional of another league to form anyway, Not enough money to be made quick enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewAge Posted February 3, 2018 Share Posted February 3, 2018 6 minutes ago, mse326 said: I don't know that it has an effect on expansion either. A monopoly itself isn't a violation, only the use of anti-competitive practices. Baseball is too regional of another league to form anyway, Not enough money to be made quick enough. It has an affect when it comes to territorial rights and so on. It's a large reason why DC had to wait so long to get a team and the A's are unable to move to San Jose. https://courses.cit.cornell.edu/econ352jpw/readme/Print - What if baseball lost antitrust deal.htm https://news.stanford.edu/2015/02/24/antitrust-baseball-court-022415/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mse326 Posted February 3, 2018 Share Posted February 3, 2018 3 minutes ago, NewAge said: It has an affect when it comes to territorial rights and so on. It's a large reason why DC had to wait so long to get a team and the A's are unable to move to San Jose. https://courses.cit.cornell.edu/econ352jpw/readme/Print - What if baseball lost antitrust deal.htm https://news.stanford.edu/2015/02/24/antitrust-baseball-court-022415/ Maybe. I thought it was more contract based between the franchises rather than an anti-trust issue. But I can see where it comes from. I would assume basketball has some form of territorial rights as well, but they don't have the exemption. So there is an intersection with contract law and I don't know how that would play out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramssuperbowl99 Posted February 3, 2018 Share Posted February 3, 2018 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
playmaker8267 Posted February 3, 2018 Share Posted February 3, 2018 The players are doing better in arbitration than they've done historically this year. The players are 5-2 so far by my count, while the players' win rate is usually around 40%. That doesn't help the owners in what is now looking more and more like a developing mess for the league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramssuperbowl99 Posted February 3, 2018 Share Posted February 3, 2018 14 hours ago, NewAge said: I think raising the minimum salaries (something close to a million), moving arb/FA up (maybe FA up a year, all players are super two eligible), and artificially raising arb salaries by a certain percentage (and perhaps "modernizing" the formula) can go a long way. I also think expansion would help and be something both sides would be interested in. And as far as the monopoly thing goes, someone needs to challenge that anti-trust exemption. The players could also go for a big increase in their pension. I think based on service time it goes up to only $30k/year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GmenSeattle Posted February 3, 2018 Share Posted February 3, 2018 The luxury tax is at least part of the reason why some of the players haven't been signed yet. Also think that teams should be required to spend all of the regular season money they bring in. AKA you don't profit from anything other than the playoffs and the fact that you own a major league franchise (which, is still making a huge amount of money). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tom cody Posted February 5, 2018 Share Posted February 5, 2018 Interesting to see Colon get another shot. He's 45 this year so this may be his last shot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dingo18287 Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 Todd Frazier to the Mets for 2 years 17 mil. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thelonebillsfan Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 1 hour ago, Dingo18287 said: Todd Frazier to the Mets for 2 years 17 mil. We are gonna have a roster of nothing but infielders by the time ST breaks. Great deal though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigbadbuff23835 Posted February 6, 2018 Share Posted February 6, 2018 Thought Todd would eventually come back to the Yankees. Really interesting to see where they turn now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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